Playing online

Hey all,

First off, I am sure you get questions like this all the time so i apologize for more of the same. I have read all the essays and hands here and some of the forum posts however.

Well I have not played any poker online. In fact the majority of my experience is in low-limit home games. However the FTR site has just about convinced me that I should go with NLHE. Someone on another site suggested that to start playing cash games online I should try some tournaments. So my questions are these?

1) What is the best way to get started playing online with cash. I am comfortable enough with the actual structure of the game and such that I dont think I need to play free money games.

2) Do you think tournaments are a good way to start out or do they demand a strategy that is different enough from ring games to make it not worth my while at this point?

Chris

Originally Posted by vulturesrow

Well I have not played any poker online. In fact the majority of my experience is in low-limit home games. However the FTR site has just about convinced me that I should go with NLHE. Someone on another site suggested that to start playing cash games online I should try some tournaments. So my questions are these?

Try to find a game to match your strengths. In a nutshell...

NLHE - Requires a lot of heart and "feel". Courage to put it all on the line when you're only 60%+ to win (unless you have a bad read.) Reading other players is very important. A single mistake can ruin a session. Huge difference in skill levels (how fast a better player busts a weaker one.)

NLHE Sit'nGos - As NLHE, but wilder swings and playing lots of different hands very well short handed becomes critical to success. Also important to look at hands in the bigger context of winning/placing in the tournament.

LHE - Manipulation is more subtle and small edges need to relentlessly pushed. Can't lose a lot on a single mistake, repeated misakes (leaks) kill ya. Greater overall swings in bankroll expected.

Stud - Larger skill edge than LHE, but less than NLHE. Small player base. Swings can still be wild. Requires a little memorization of dead cards. A lot of stuff to keep track of. Similar situations reoccur less often than in HE. Ante +bring in forces you to consider more situations than in HE.

Originally Posted by vulturesrow

1) What is the best way to get started playing online with cash. I am comfortable enough with the actual structure of the game and such that I dont think I need to play free money games.

2) Do you think tournaments are a good way to start out or do they demand a strategy that is different enough from ring games to make it not worth my while at this point?

Pick a game and stick with it for a while. Sit'nGos and ring games are different enough that you should focus on one or the other at first. Ring games will burn through more cash, but are easier to learn (IMHO.) Sit'nGos won't burn your cash as quickly, but require a broader skillset.

Originally Posted by Fnord

Pick a game and stick with it for a while. Sit'nGos and ring games are different enough that you should focus on one or the other at first. Ring games will burn through more cash, but are easier to learn (IMHO.) Sit'nGos won't burn your cash as quickly, but require a broader skillset.

i'd agree with the above 100%. i'm a newer player as well, and after starting in NL, now play mainly Sit 'N Gos (but still spend time on the NL tables).

in my mind, the sit 'n gos offer the following advantages:

- in a $6 SNG, you can play a lot of hands in a variety of situations, for pretty cheap

- in the SNG's, you can take your mind off of the money, e.g. you pay your entrance fee, and then concentrate on your chips, rather than your $25 real money stack.

- you play with the same players for 30 - 60 minutes, so you get a good chance to practice your reading skills.

- at least with me, the SNG's seem to be improving my NL play.

i seem to on a "always a brides maid, but never a bride" run in that i've placed 2nd in the last 8 SNG's i've entered. i've also moved up to the $20 + $2 SNG's, and as i was complaining this weekend to my wife (who's very supportive of my playing ) about another 2nd place, she pointed out that i probably couldn't make $38 in 40 minutes on a ring table very consistently. that shut me up!

keep at it, find what suits you, and have fun.

Above advice is accurate. I would recommend ring game over SNG. SNG require skill to play short handed. Need to adapt your play to increased blinds and loss of players. Most importantly, SNG involves a lot of luck when you get to the last 4 players. On the other hand, ring game is more consistent, you can play tighter and more solid poker.

I disagree that SNG is cheaper. Even if you play solid you are subject to bad beats before you get into the money and you need to be top 2 for it to be profitable.

Bottom line is try both and play the one that provides the most enjoyment for you. I would recommend starting in ring game for some experience because you only have to think about each hand as they come, rather than the additional tournament elements.

Originally Posted by SteveO

I disagree that SNG is cheaper. Even if you play solid you are subject to bad beats before you get into the money and you need to be top 2 for it to be profitable.

If you're a poor/new player, my guess is you'll lose less $/hour playing 5+1 SnGs.

Originally Posted by SteveO

SNG require skill to play short handed. Need to adapt your play to increased blinds and loss of players.

i'll agree with that - short handed play is a game in itself. but, i think that this is good practice for a ring game as most hands (with any money involved) get down to 2 - 3 players.

Originally Posted by SteveO

Most importantly, SNG involves a lot of luck when you get to the last 4 players.

i have to disagree with you on this one. with 4 players left, i'm usually the short stack, and if i've made it to 4th, i will make it to at least 2nd. everyone else is so eager to chew each other up at this point, you can easily get from 4th to the money justing by staying out of the pissing contests, unless you've got the cards to make a move. i actually find it hardest with 5 - 6 players left - no one wants to take chance, but the pressure's on. makes it hard to read people.

now, head's up, there is definitely a lot more luck involved.

I think that heads up play is the game with most skill involved. The better player will chew the weaker one up,,,,UNLESS the blinds are so enourmous that the other player must call/bet not to be eliminated by the blinds the next hand. This is often the case in sit'n go's at the end of the tourneys. I admit that sit'n go's require a great level of skill but at the end of them the better players edge decreases since the blinds are so big. Also all NL-tourneys open up for "all-inners", the guys that moves all in pre-flop consistently and manages to build a stack since the more solid players don't wanna get involved in a coinflip early in the tournament. I can honestly say that I think cash games is more "hard core poker", the better player builds a stack during a long time of playing, grinding weaker players out without the blinds increasing. In a sit'n go or any tour you have to take pretty big calculated risks at some point. Off course you have to take chances in any game but in a cash game it's not based on the fact that the blinds are gonna increase next round. Now I enjoy sit'n go's as well as cash games and I know that some people can actually make a living on playing sit'n go's but I still think that cash games is the best way to go if you wanna make a long term profit.

The only reason I can think of going for sit'n go's for value is that in some cheaper sit'n go's the opposition is really poor and that makes it very easy to get itm. That and the pure fun of playing them makes it worth it.

Thanks for taking the time to give me well thought out answers. I am still a little unsure of which way to begin but I am thinking SNG because A) I have a full time job that keeps me somewhat busy and B) I think it will be a little more palatable to la esposa until I prove to her that I am not just throwing mi dinero away. Thanks everyone.

Chris