Moral Dilemna, need good advice, LONG; cliff notes included

[bigspenda73]

First of all, cliff notes at bottom

This probably seems way out of place but there is really no one I can speak to about this. Some of you know me, some don't. I teach golf for a living, I help run an academy where myself and another instructor teach 8-10 lessons a day, 5 days a week each. I have only been working for my current company for 4 months, and I would be lying if I said it hasn't been a bit of a disappointment.

My boss, and fellow instructor has been a constant pain in the ass. Every day he has a new problem whether it be professionally or personally. Quite frankly I'm sick of hearing about it all. It certainly affects his work, and he has not been performing anywhere near up to standards. On top of this, his ineptitude is affecting my production levels as well, as his students have not renewed their lessons with him and he has been forced to cut into new clientele who should all be starting with me.

Let's go back to last Wednesday. He shows up for work looking like hell. I don't even ask, why, well because I know he's going to tell me. He says he got into a huge fight with his and they broke up. I don't ask why. He still tells me. It seems that her daughter (not his) was doing something she wasn't supposed to be and he slapped her. That's not the worst part, she's 13 years old and has SEVERE autism (sp?). Anyways, as he smacks her the mother walks into the room, freaks out, and kicks his out ass (rightfully so, makes me sick to my stomach).

Skip forward to today. I'm at work on my day off because we (actually he is, I hit my sales numbers for the month today..mini woot!) are way behind budget for the month and I want to help catch up. I'm calling some of my students when 2 men in street clothes walk up. They ask for him, I take him out of a lesson and listen from around the corner. Seems they are two County detectives and he is being arrested, the charges I do not hear. He is escorted outside where 4 men in full swat gear put him in a cruiser. He leaves me a note asking to teach his remaining lessons and to tell no one about this. 30 minutes pass and his best friend calls me, again to just keep quiet and he'll get back to me about the situation. I agree and teach his 5-6 remaining lessons. About the time I am ready to leave I get another call, looks like this is not just a misdemeanor, it's a felony (due to the age of the girl) and he's spending at least the night in prison and not making it in tomorrow. I have 12 lessons on the books and so does he, there's no way I can cover for him.

His friend and parents both ask to keep this quiet and to not report it to our city manager. I tell them "I'll have to think about it". Here's my dilemna:

If I contact the city manager he will most likely get fired, I'll get promoted and I won't have to deal with him anymore. However, the charges could be false, do I really want to ruin this guys life? On top of this he's borderline crazy and if it got back to him that I "ratted" him out I do fear he would pull something. So, what it do people? What would you do? Also, lying to the city manager, the man who holds my future with the company in his hands, is certainly not a good idea.

Cliff notes:Boss is a total pain in the ass, gets arrested for felony harm to a child, won't be working for a few days and wants me to cover for him, I cannot cover, I have to work myself. Do I call our city manager and get him fired or do I keep quiet for a few days?

[Fnord]

Find a way to "have to" tell management and claim you had no choice. If you lose out big here it doesn't sound like a big loss but the upside is too strong to pass up.

[swiggidy]

wait, did he tell you the story?

This doesn't sound like a moral problem at all. Guy's a jerk, a shitty boss, doing a shitty job and you would be way better at it. It's not like you're getting your friend canned for a couple extra shifts.

Now the part about him being pissed at you (and knowing where you work) may be a concern.

[bode]

Only being there a few months, and unless you have full authority to cancel all his appointments for him, then you should probably find a way to tell the manager. You dont have to give details, just tell him he was arrested and the manager can find out details on his own.

[jyms]

Your livelihood is without question more important than some coworker. And that is all he will ever be to you, a coworker. Take care of number one, save the loyalty for family and close friends.

[bigspenda73]

If you lose out big here it doesn't sound like a big loss but the upside is too strong to pass up.

I like this advice, hadn't thought about it that way. Losing this job would not be as bad compared to how good it could be if he is gone.

An EV equation really, lolpokernerdaments.

So how should I go about telling the city manager? It is times like these where I feel I grew up too quickly, I have little idea of how to approach this situation and what is right/wrong.

[TylerK]

fold preflop

[PrestonLuv]

my mom bitch slapped me when i was a teenager...

regardless slapping is wrong...if its a one time thing, a felony is bullshit whether its his kid or not...parents or parental figures(which he was) can make mistakes...i mean its not like he kicked her ass..if its a repeat thing..throw his ass in jail.

now back to the topic...tell your superiors that you cannot cover his shift as well as yours...you have to be responsible for your work and that will falter if you are doing his as well....

do not tell them why though..just say he is sick or something....unless of course you know for a fact he is a repeat child beater....narq on his ass and get promoted....

[djzcko]

You can't cover for him so you have to let somebody know. If they happen to ask why then you should leave it up to them to call your boss and find out why. You have an obligation to make sure the clients are given fair warning if you know there will be nobody there to teach their lessons.

[UG]

Don't businesses have the right to know if the people working for them have been (or will be) charged with felonies? This could get you off the hook easily. Figure out a good reason why you "have to" tell your city manager. Make sure the city manager knows that none of this information came from you, and that he/she has to figure out a way to make it look like they're the ones that found out, and that you're not the one that sold him out.

The guy sounds like a piece of shit and I wouldn't really think twice about telling your boss the truth. He made these problems for himself, now he's got to deal with them. Plus, if you get a raise because of this...you win.

How much danger could you possibly be getting in if you tell and he finds out it was you? That's all you should be worried about here, because telling is the best way to go here (unless this guy will mess you up or possibly kill you or something). Possibly being dead is not worth the raise, but it doesn't sound like it will get to that point......or could it?

[Fnord]

regardless slapping is wrong...if its a one time thing, a felony is bullshit whether its his kid or not...parents or parental figures(which he was) can make mistakes...i mean its not like he kicked her ass..if its a repeat thing..throw his ass in jail.

You're hearing his side of the story second hand. A lot more fucked up shit could be going on that he obviously isn't going to talk about or even is in denial over.

[UG]

regardless slapping is wrong...if its a one time thing, a felony is bullshit whether its his kid or not...parents or parental figures(which he was) can make mistakes...i mean its not like he kicked her ass..if its a repeat thing..throw his ass in jail.

You're hearing his side of the story second hand. A lot more fucked up shit could be going on that he obviously isn't going to talk about or even is in denial over.

This is an autistic child, too, don't forget that.

[bigspenda73]

Yes, the only story I've heard is his side.

[NWNewell]

I would tell the city manager the truth, but maybe not the whole truth.

What I mean is I would leave out the details. Perhaps only mention something about extenuating circumstances that prevent him from covering his shifts. I would leave it kind of vague, but peaking his interests. And when/if he tries to question you about it. I would state that you do not feel it is your place to discuss issues in your boss's personal life, but it would be in his (the city manager's) best interest to have this conversation with your boss. Something like, "It is not a health issue. But I feel that is not my place to discuss his personal issues and I think it is best that you have the conversation about the details with him." I expect that someone in his position would have some experience with H.R. issues and will respect your position, be pleased that you alerted him to "a situation" (that is really his responsibility to look into), and know how to handle it.

After all, depending the policies of your company/employment, I believe you are probably not under any obligation to disclose this information about a co-workers personal life. Just be honest about your boss's request, be vague about the details (since you really don't know all the circumstances, anyway), and suggest that the city manager discuss this issue with your boss.

And, depending on the job functions of your boss, I would simply state that you are happy to fill in for him as he requested and feel you are up to the task (blah, blah, blah), but that you feel that your then supervisor (city manager, or whoever) should be aware of the situation (professionally, as it relates to your work only) and that you want to ensure that you have the support of your supervisor for any decisions you have to make for your detained boss, since you will be filling in for your boss after such a short time with the company.

This is kind of the way I would handle it. But I'm not in you shoes and you'll have to "read" your situation for yourself

GL

[ensign_lee]

I don't see a way around telling your manager. There's no other way those shifts are going to get covered. And pissing off clients by cancelling at the last second is no way to run a business.

If you REALLY want to cover for the guy, then yes: A) just either tell your boss that your co-worker has issues and is dealing with them B) Tell them that the cops dragged your coworker out and that you don't know the intimate details of the situation.

That seems to be the best course of action. Even crazy people (one would hope) can't expect you to do the impossible.

[DaNutsInYoEye]

my mom bitch slapped me when i was a teenager...

regardless slapping is wrong...if its a one time thing, a felony is bullshit whether its his kid or not...parents or parental figures(which he was) can make mistakes...i mean its not like he kicked her ass..if its a repeat thing..throw his ass in jail.

I was hit by my parents on a few occassions growing up. There wasn't a single occassion where I can honestly say I didn't deserve it at the time. This kid is autistic though. You cross the line when you strike someone that doesn't have the capacity to comprehend what they have done.

Concerning the situation, it's not your responsibilty to cover for him and it's not fair for him or his family to ask you to. If you need help then contact your city manager. It's certainly legitimate. Explain to him that your boss was arrested. I wouldn't tell him more than that. Charges aren't convictions and your boss should have the chance to explain the situation to the city manager himself.

You cover for people in situations like this when YOU want to. If your boss happened to be your best friend that you've known since 2nd grade then you may want to. You're not doing it because it's morally the correct thing to do, but rather because you're emotionally tied to the situation and know he would probably do the same for you.

[boost]

heroin is the one and only answer to all your problems.

[Reidak]

thread just got boosted


Seriously though, you need to take advantage of this guys spew. Dont drop 15 buy ins at 50nl like I did.

[badgers]

my mom bitch slapped me when i was a teenager...

regardless slapping is wrong...if its a one time thing, a felony is bullshit whether its his kid or not...parents or parental figures(which he was) can make mistakes...i mean its not like he kicked her ass..if its a repeat thing..throw his ass in jail.

I was hit by my parents on a few occassions growing up. There wasn't a single occassion where I can honestly say I didn't deserve it at the time. This kid is autistic though. You cross the line when you strike someone that doesn't have the capacity to comprehend what they have done.

Concerning the situation, it's not your responsibilty to cover for him and it's not fair for him or his family to ask you to. If you need help then contact your city manager. It's certainly legitimate. Explain to him that your boss was arrested. I wouldn't tell him more than that. Charges aren't convictions and your boss should have the chance to explain the situation to the city manager himself.

You cover for people in situations like this when YOU want to. If your boss happened to be your best friend that you've known since 2nd grade then you may want to. You're not doing it because it's morally the correct thing to do, but rather because you're emotionally tied to the situation and know he would probably do the same for you.

I agree with everthing in this post. I don't think slapping is wrong, I would do everything first to avoid having to do it but I know when I was slapped I deserved it and it taught me not to do it again. However, slapping a child with autism is really wrong.

It's up to the city manager to sort it out. If the guy's been wrongly arrested, he can't be sacked anyway so it shouldn't be a problem. You've been put in a horrible situation, and it's not fair on you. Unless you can find a way of covering his lessons it's not like you have a choice anyway.

[Anosmic]

Meh.

To be fair what the guy told you can assume to have been told in confidence; so you can't really go and tell your manager the details and hold the moral high ground.

What I don't understand is why your colleague hasn't contacted the manager and told him he can't come to work. That's just weird.

Can you contact the colleague or his family? Tell them they have to ring the boss and call in sick, tell him they're having a family situation or whatever...

If they don't do it, you have to and you can say he's having some "family crisis" and say that you don't feel at liberty to say more. But if pressed I suppose you have to report what you've seen at work.

[Galapogos]

You don't need to tell the boss why this guy was arrested because that is beneficial to no one and will only serve to piss this guy off. Just say some guys took him dowtown for questioning. I seriously doubt he's going to get fired for this anyway, you're not allowed to fire someone because one time he was questioned about hitting his kid. So just do the thing that's good for business and tell the boss so coverage can be found for his clients.

If you're concerned about his performance, that's something you have to bring up to your boss. As a manager, you sometimes get complacent with your staff and might not realize how bad someone's doing until another staffer brings it up to you. Never be the guy that covers for him. He's not your friend. Maybe bring it up to him first if you feel you owe him that much.

Also, how do I stop slicing my drive?

[Anosmic]

Also, how do I stop slicing my drive?

Take the razor blades out of your tyres?

[Da GOAT]

didnt read all replies but rat him up plz

look after number one

never ever take a hit for someone you dont like EVER

[uscheese]

didnt read all replies but rat him up plz

look after number one

never ever take a hit for someone you dont like EVER

ayup...you already stated you don't like the dude and he's a pain in the ass...it will make your life easier...find a way to tell your city manager (whatever the fuck that is) what happened...maybe leave an anonymous note or send him a link to the police log with the guys name in it or something. don't cover for a douchebag.

[Warpe]

The only ass you should be covering is your own.

[PrestonLuv]

maybe autistic kids need to be slapped twice to get the point across?









j/k.....my friends kid is autistic and that fucked up...i missed that in the original read...very wrong

[mcatdog]

In my opinion, the stigma against being a "snitch" is one of the most misguided things about our culture. I wouldn't rat on a friend (unless they did something really bad like kill someone) but if it's someone I don't like who's making my life difficult already, then fuck them. This isn't a moral dilemma at all.

[uscheese]

snitches get kitchens I hear

[bigspenda73]

Trip Report & Update: I get into work at 8 this morning, he's not scheduled in until 10. There are no messages on our phone nor on my cell phone. At 9 the phone rings, it's him from his holding cell. Safe to say he isn't happy and wants to know when he's getting out. I tell him I don't know but I'll contact his friend who was taking care of getting him a lawyer.

I call his buddy and it seems his bond hearing will not be until tomorrow at the earliest. The lawyer he hired was trying to get it moved up but it doesn't seem the court is too willing to help him out (lol duh obv).

I man up and call the city manager, telling him that my boss was arrested yesterday and will not be back in until tomorrow afternoon at the earliest. He says I've done nothing wrong in telling him this and that I would have been in the wrong had I not contacted him. I ask him to spin the story in order to make it seem that he called looking for my boss and that I finally told him where he was after some resistance.

I cancelled all of his lessons and that's where it stands. Updates soon if I'm still alive.

[bode]

wp sir.

[Warpe]

Agree. Shows good judgement on your part and will reflect well on you when it comes time to replace your boss, which will be soon.

[gabe]

sounds like everything is good for you so far

[jyms]

Now if your city manager fucks up you'll be well positioned for that next job. Any chance he may have a drinking problem or has a monkey on his back.

[Galapogos]

Also, how do I stop slicing my drive?

[JL]

Also, how do I stop slicing my drive?

Simple, just tee off with your irons.

[Warpe]

Any chance he may have a drinking problem or has a monkey on his back.

I was thinking the same thing. His work behaviour sounds classic.

[bigspenda73]

Also, how do I stop slicing my drive?

how the fuck should I know?

In all seriousness a slice is caused my one of two things (**Assuming a right handed player):
A. an open clubface (one pointing to the right of the target) at impact
B. a club path moving across the golf ball from the right to left(out-to-in) causing left to right spin on the ball.

A few questions for you, do you take divots? If so where are they pointing, straight at your target or to the left? Secondly, when you slice the ball does it start to the left of your target or does it immediately go the the right and curve further right.

That'll be $85 sir.....god I love saying that every 30 minutes.

[euphoricism]

spendas not in the business of fixing problems, he's in the business of making smaller problems ;p

[Galapogos]

Also, how do I stop slicing my drive?

In all seriousness a slice is caused my one of two things (**Assuming a right handed player):
A. an open clubface (one pointing to the right of the target) at impact
B. a club path moving across the golf ball from the right to left(out-to-in) causing left to right spin on the ball.

A few questions for you, do you take divots? If so where are they pointing, straight at your target or to the left? Secondly, when you slice the ball does it start to the left of your target or does it immediately go the the right and curve further right.

Yeah I'm definately the B scenario. And yeah my divots cut across diagonally left.

The weird part is, my divots from practice swings are straight, but when I hit the ball they're crooked. This happens with all my clubs. But the only club that's affected by it is my driver.

Meh, guess it doesn't matter, I'm just out there for some drinks anyway.

[Numbr2intheWorld]

Also, how do I stop slicing my drive?

how the fuck should I know?

In all seriousness a slice is caused my one of two things (**Assuming a right handed player):
A. an open clubface (one pointing to the right of the target) at impact
B. a club path moving across the golf ball from the right to left(out-to-in) causing left to right spin on the ball.

A few questions for you, do you take divots? If so where are they pointing, straight at your target or to the left? Secondly, when you slice the ball does it start to the left of your target or does it immediately go the the right and curve further right.

That'll be $85 sir.....god I love saying that every 30 minutes.

But it's much more complicated than that (which i'm sure you know, i'm not trying to undermine your advice, just add to it). There are many many different causes for your club face to be open and/or swing path to be right to left. There's no way to figure out what that cause is without looking at your specific swing, really. That's why golf magizines kinda suck.

[bigspenda73]

It's actually not as complicated as you think.

Chew on this: I used to teach for an academy sponsored by Nike and ESPN (ESPN golf schools ld0). Anyways, Nike does this research, they tested 100 PGA tour Players and 100 amateur mid-high handicappers (or something like this).

This is what they found:

PGA Tour players swung the club 30% faster than amateurs (of course) while using 50% LESS muscle energy.

That's right, you're working twice as hard as Tiger and hitting is much shorter. Suck on that, and take some lessons plz.

[Numbr2intheWorld]

Ok maybe the word complicated is not right. What i mean is that there are a couple of basic things that cause a slice, and several problems that cause those things.

Anyways i think i'm going to stop trying to argue with a golf coach .

[swiggidy]

Also, how do I stop slicing my drive?

how the fuck should I know?

I loled

[bigspenda73]

Also, how do I stop slicing my drive?

In all seriousness a slice is caused my one of two things (**Assuming a right handed player):
A. an open clubface (one pointing to the right of the target) at impact
B. a club path moving across the golf ball from the right to left(out-to-in) causing left to right spin on the ball.

A few questions for you, do you take divots? If so where are they pointing, straight at your target or to the left? Secondly, when you slice the ball does it start to the left of your target or does it immediately go the the right and curve further right.

Yeah I'm definately the B scenario. And yeah my divots cut across diagonally left.

The weird part is, my divots from practice swings are straight, but when I hit the ball they're crooked. This happens with all my clubs. But the only club that's affected by it is my driver.

Meh, guess it doesn't matter, I'm just out there for some drinks anyway.

You are either
a. Swinging the club too much with your arms and hands and not with body rotation
-or-(most likely...)
b. Rotating your body ok but doing so too levelly in your downswing. Think about this. Take your swing to the top and then just turn your shoulders dead level, club comes straight over-the-top doesn't it? Now, take the club to the top and start the club down by feeling as if you are compressing your right shoulder into your right hip (extreme feeling). Almost like you're doing an oblique crunch with your right side.

The two motions that cause the club to stay on path in your downswing is the rotation (turning) of your hips and the tilting of your shoulders. Complicated, like Mass said. Very difficult to explain in words, that's why I work with a lot of visual and kinesthetic aids.

Maybe I'll start a golf thread sometime soon, but for now I just don't wanna get my ass shot.

[Zee Devee]

Update?

Did ur boss get fired?

[bigspenda73]

Update?

Did ur boss get fired?

awww bub, you've been thinkin 'bout me? Actually, glad you bumped this.

Ok, I'm at work today, get a call from our corporate Operating Control Manager. He's basically the dude who oversees all of the stores across the nation. Well, he's looking for my boss. I leave the message and my boss eventually talks to him. Of course my boss tells me about his conversation because he actually thinks I care about his well-being and/or future with this company. It seems that they are "concerned about his future with our company." DAMN RIGHT YOU BETTER BE CONCERNED, WTF? All I know is I think something is about to go down soon, and I hope it does.

As far as his legal troubles, it seems he is taking this thing to trial, which to me seems like a horrid mistake. I cannot even begin to think what would be worse for him, trial by jury/judge. Sounds like his ex has really built a case against him and he is now trying to build a case against her. I mean, he has admitted to doing what he did, there's no court in the US that would let this pass is there?

Sigh, we'll see tomorrow, on top of all of this he is well below is yearly budget which is fucking me out of somewhere near $5,000 which I was going to blow in Vegas at the end of September.

I was going to update this tomorrow after I knew more but whatevs.

Yep, whatevs.

[spoonitnow]

Whatever happened with this?

[jyms]

Spenda is playing Full time as of last month, and looking into some life decisions. i.e: Residence, School, new career.

[Monty3038]

Update?

Did ur boss get fired?

awww bub, you've been thinkin 'bout me? Actually, glad you bumped this.

Ok, I'm at work today, get a call from our corporate Operating Control Manager. He's basically the dude who oversees all of the stores across the nation. Well, he's looking for my boss. I leave the message and my boss eventually talks to him. Of course my boss tells me about his conversation because he actually thinks I care about his well-being and/or future with this company. It seems that they are "concerned about his future with our company." DAMN RIGHT YOU BETTER BE CONCERNED, WTF? All I know is I think something is about to go down soon, and I hope it does.

As far as his legal troubles, it seems he is taking this thing to trial, which to me seems like a horrid mistake. I cannot even begin to think what would be worse for him, trial by jury/judge. Sounds like his ex has really built a case against him and he is now trying to build a case against her. I mean, he has admitted to doing what he did, there's no court in the US that would let this pass is there?

Sigh, we'll see tomorrow, on top of all of this he is well below is yearly budget which is fucking me out of somewhere near $5,000 which I was going to blow in Vegas at the end of September.

I was going to update this tomorrow after I knew more but whatevs.

Yep, whatevs.

Being a big golfer... and a victim of DV for years when I was young... I can understand a bit of your situation... but have to ask... which golf chain do you work for that lets this slide at all?

[spoonitnow]

Spenda is playing Full time as of last month, and looking into some life decisions. i.e: Residence, School, new career.

Yeah I know that but I'm just wondering about this particular situation.

[swiggidy]

Boss got transferred, but he still wasn't happy. Or something like that.

rebump in a week maybe, he's not near a puter.

/not actually spenda's bitch

[bigspenda73]

OH HAI FTR

situation got handled, end of story really.

I just got back from a 2 week drunkfest, life's good.

[jyms]

OH HAI FTR

situation got handled, end of story really.

I just got back from a 2 week drunkfest, life's good.

TLR