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 Originally Posted by poop
Name me one of those laws that directly affects you. Explain how it's had a negative impact on your life.
I'm not selfish when it comes to my vote. This isn't about me. This is about what I think is good for the UK. If you want an example of an EU law that I think is bad for the UK and bad for British communities, then the obvious one is fishing quotas. Fishermen in England were unable to fish British territorial waters because of EU law. This has a negative impact on the British economy, especially in coastal communities. And yes it does impact me, come to think of it; it means my fish and chips costs more. A minor problem for me, but like I say, I'm not selfish. It's a major problem for the coastal communities. That's why the North East voted en masse to leave. It's not because they're racist. It's because they're relatively poor, by British standards, and are seeing their core industry being raided by other European nations. All in the name of trade agreements.
Well, that's pretty much what you said. Except you couched it in terms like foreign business investment was somehow bad for the people who live here.
It's not what I said. It's how you interpreted it. That's a you problem, not a me problem. You're the one that defaults to jingoism whenever anyone shows any shred of preference for locals. I would prefer British people to own British companies because it means less money leaves the country, which is good for the economy. And it means more tax, which means improved services. It also means the company is less likely to fuck off, leaving people out of work. Local people have closer ties to the community, and accept greater responsibility when it comes to local economies. This isn't jingoism.
Why do you have data that says Remain was way ahead? Like 80-20 ahead?
I made a bet on betfair exchange. I got roughly 4/1. That's not a bookmaker. That's another actual person accepting my bet at those odds. I know you'll laugh at this, but that's real people putting their actual money on the line, not a state sponsored entity publishing propaganda. That for me is better evidence.
I think the British people are collectively about the same as people in every other country. There's some with above average intelligence and an equal number with below average intelligence. There's also a fair share of people who don't understand the issues they're voting on. If you think the UK is somehow special in that regard, then that is jingoistic.
Every other country? No. Every other western nation? Closer. No, I don't think the UK is special, I just recognise that we have world class education, which puts us in the top bracket, along with other nations with similar education standards. But this is besides the point. The point is that if you can't trust the public to make democratic decisions, then what is the point of democracy in the first place? If you truly believe in democracy, then you simply have no choice but to put your faith in the public's collective ability to make the right decision. If you don't have that faith, democracy isn't for you. You're basically saying that people are collectively too stupid for democracy. To suggest that for the UK, you might as well go right ahead and apply it to the rest of the world.
The same applies to elections. Why should they happen so much more frequently? What happened to democracy?
Elections have to happen regularly. 5 years is about right. If we have referenda every five years, that's going to have a negative impact on the economy, and cause social division. I mean, if we vote again now, and we vote to remain, does that mean we get another vote in three years? And then after another three years? Every three years? The EU won't tolerate this uncertainty indefinitely, will they? It is impractical to keep voting on this issue. It is not impractical to have an election every five years.
Not sure if you're aware or not, but Russia just recently invaded the Ukraine and annexed the Crimea. So apparently they are something of a threat.
Yeah. They are a "threat" to any region that actually wants to be part of Russia.
ya, talking and doing and two different things. Also, I'm pretty sure membership in the joint army would not be mandatory.
Moreover, the various members of the EU have often taken independent lines of foreign policy. Some went to Iraq War II and some didn't, for example.
Currently, foreign policy is a matter for member states, and is not subject to common policy. That will change, you'll see. If you want evidence, do some fucking research. Learn about what the EEC was, how it evolved into what it has become, and understand why it is a great deal more than trade and labour. Then perhaps you might understand that people like me are not racist, we are not jingoistic, we simply value culture, community, and above all, independence.
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