*** The Official MAGAposting thread ***

[OngBonga]

Who pays these "independent" regulators?

I had to research this. The Home Office, so basically the taxpayer. They're called the Independent Office for Police Conduct (IOPC). I have no reason to doubt their independence, but I'm open to persuasion. What you got?

Here's their website... https://www.policeconduct.gov.uk/

What's the difference if they don't do anything?

They do. I just had a dig and found the case of Dalian Atkinson, former Villa player who died after being tasered. The IOPC were then the IPCC, and they decided there was enough evidence to send them to court. One cop is facing a murder charge, another is facing assault. They were due to stand trial next month, but covid has delayed it. Let's see if anything comes of it. Because he's a former footballer, he's high profile, so it should make the news.

Obviously one case is insufficient to prove they are useful, independent, whatever, it proves nothing, but they have doubled in size since they became the IOPC, so that does kind of imply that the Home Office takes police conduct seriously.

The question was whether you'd be ok with it, not whether you'd consider yourself a "victim". I mean, you don't really seem to know what a victim is anyways, so there's no point asking about that.

Of course I know what a victim is, and if you want to be accurate then sure, people are "victims" if they are innocent of any crime yet still get pulled by the police. They are a victim of inconvenience. I'm a victim every time I get called a cunt on Twitter. But it's also a pretty powerful word, and really I prefer to reserve it for those who have experienced some kind of violence, or theft, like serious things, rather than hurt feelings. Racism too, provided it's actual racism and not perceived racism.

Black people were searched at 11 times the rate of whites, mixed people at just under three times, Asians twice, and Chinese or 'other' people just under one and a half times the rate of whites across the Capital.

Conversation in cop car...
"How about this guy? That's a nice car."
"Nah, he's Asian, not black. He might be a doctor and can afford it."
"I don't mind the yellow Asians, but I don't like the brown ones."
"Well I don't mind the brown Asians, so long as they're not mixed."
"Yeah, fuck the mixed. Let's go find a mixed."

Another point... London is a fucking big place. There are extremely wealthy parts, and there are complete shitholes. Even London figures don't tell the whole story. You kinda need to dig deeper. I appreciate that's convenient for my argument, but it's also relevant.

By the way, just got back from a drive. I played the "guess the race" game again. I'll admit, it's easier in the town where you're going at 25mph right behind someone, but once you've got distance at 30+ then it's not easy at all.

I'm just curious why your opinion is so strongly held that you continue to come up with so many nonsensical reasons why the evidence that disputes it is wrong.

My opinion isn't actually as strongly held as you might think. I just think that to default to racism with no consideration for other factors is knee jerk, and problematic. If racism isn't the cause, and people are accusing the police of racism anyway, then it gets us into a situation where the police are afraid to police black communities. And when that happens, serious crime thrives.

I'm giving the police the benefit of the doubt. I don't know they're systematically racist, and I don't see any evidence of institutional racism except for statistics that lack context.

1. Black people mouth off a lot (blaming the "non-victim").

Simplified somewhat, I mean at first I was also thinking of people like Black Karen who immediately play the race card. I know first hand that cops don't appreciate you being a dick to them. If you give them attitude, they're more likely to search you. Are black people more likely to show bad attitude to cops than white people? Maybe. It's a potential factor.

2. They're poor and can't afford to fix a taillight (which, naturally, justifies a body search).

Huh? Getting pulled over doesn't usually mean stop and search. The cops will generally only search the car if it stinks of weed, or if you're acting cagey. But back on point... poverty is certainly a factor. Poor people interact with police more often than wealthy people, on average, certainly on the streets, mainly because of location. Police don't tend to patrol rich neighbourhoods because there's not much crime.

3. Urban vs. rural (with blacks more likely to live in the urban parts of London, apparently).

Related to poverty. London has very little rural land, and the people who live in these parts are millionaires. But across the UK generally, rural areas don't see much police. My town doesn't have any cops by night, if there's an emergency they'll come from Leomister probably, ten miles away. Or maybe even Shrewsbury or Telford, both 20-odd miles away. There's also a much lower percentage of resident non-whites in rural towns and villages. So urban vs rural is certainly a factor too.

I don't consider your suggestions plausible at all, in case you didn't see the above.

That's because your mind is made up. If you approach this from the angle "maybe there's another reason", you might think of things that seem implausible, but they might contribute.

0/642 cases where police were held in any way responsible is the alarming part.

Well let's see if this Dalian Atkinson case breaks the mould. Would that satisfy you that we're making progress?

[Poopadoop]

Are black people more likely to show bad attitude to cops than white people? Maybe. It's a potential factor.

11x as likely? Really? Who are these people lol.

If anything, they might be less likely to mouth off 'cause they don't want to push any buttons.

poverty is certainly a factor. Poor people interact with police more often than wealthy people, on average, certainly on the streets, mainly because of location. Police don't tend to patrol rich neighbourhoods because there's not much crime.

If black people are 11x as likely to live in poverty than whites (which I doubt is anywhere close to the truth), that in itself would be a problem.

I was also thinking of people like Black Karen who immediately play the race card. I know first hand that cops don't appreciate you being a dick to them.

You don't know how many times she's been stopped and/or harassed, so it's not really fair to say she "immediately" played the race card.

In any case, I've never seen a video of someone playing the race card and the cops using that as an excuse to search them. Seems a bit counterproductive on their part.

The mouthing off you were doing sounded like you were being a smart ass. That's the kind of mouthing off I would expect to dramatically increase your chance of being searched.

Related to poverty. London has very little rural land, and the people who live in these parts are millionaires. But across the UK generally, rural areas don't see much police. My town doesn't have any cops by night, if there's an emergency they'll come from Leomister probably, ten miles away. Or maybe even Shrewsbury or Telford, both 20-odd miles away. There's also a much lower percentage of resident non-whites in rural towns and villages. So urban vs rural is certainly a factor too.

Yeah, don't think your living arrangements are at all relevant to why black people are 11x as likely to get stopped and searched in London. Saying there's more police in London than in the boonies doesn't explain that.

That's because your mind is made up. If you approach this from the angle "maybe there's another reason", you might think of things that seem implausible, but they might contribute.

My mind is open, just not to theories that make no sense.

Well let's see if this Dalian Atkinson case breaks the mould. Would that satisfy you that we're making progress?

Not exactly. If it's a footballer, that's going to have an influence. If they start convicting them of mistreating common schmoes I'd be more impressed.