*** Official Putin Started Shootin' Thread ***

[OngBonga]

The maximum casualty rate of an air raid on ground troops is basically the same as however many people you can cram into a given area.

[Poopadoop]

Oh.

https://www.popularmechanics.com/mil...sia-air-force/

[OngBonga]

Oh.

https://www.popularmechanics.com/mil...sia-air-force/

The conclusion from this is pretty much one of two things...

1) it's all smoke and mirrors,
2) the Russian air force is nowhere near as competent as we assumed.

This report you link suggests it was a convoy of 100 trucks, nice to finally get a number of vehicles instead of random numbers talking about men. Such a convoy should hardly be feared by a global superpower on their own territory.

To say the Russian air force is incapable of taking out this convoy is to say they are a shit air force.

[Poopadoop]

The conclusion from this is pretty much one of two things...

2) the Russian air force is nowhere near as competent as I assumed.

fyp

When you lose a bunch of multimillion dollar aircraft attacking 100 trucks, you're definitely not a competent air force.

[MadMojoMonkey]

Oh.

https://www.popularmechanics.com/mil...sia-air-force/

Great read. Fills in a lot of open questions we had in this thread with data from on location.

Like... why were Wagner so effective at taking out Russian helicopters?
The helicopters had to get closer than they do in Ukraine to distinguish civilians from Wagner troops.

Why was Wagner able to take out a plane?
It was too close and had too little armor for the situation, not sure why it was so close, though.

[OngBonga]

RAF in this context = Russian Air Force. Sorry if that confused you.

It actually did. You were blabbering about WWII around the same time.

[OngBonga]

Wagner using civilian highways to convoy put the Russian AF in a more difficult spot.


If they just fired on every vehicle in the convoy, they'd be targeting Russian civilians.

If the threat to the capital is real, then this is collateral damage. A few dead civilians on the roads is a preferable outcome to lots of dead civilians in the capital.

Of course it is a factor that the Kremlin has to consider, but ultimately if they think the approaching force is capable of causing serious turmoil in the city, then their hand should be forced.

[Poopadoop]

They don't seem very sophisticated if they have to get close enough to get shot down to identify their targets. I thought they could precision bomb anything from the stratosphere, they were so damn good.

I mean in reality I'm sure if they had enough aircraft and wanted to they could put a serious dent in Wagner. The question is whether they could easily scrape together enough operable planes after a year at war with Ukraine getting their asses shot off, concentrate them, and use them effectively. So far all they've done is send in one or two choppers at a time, get them blown up, then send in another one or two.

Also, a lot of their air force is on paper only. They don't have spare parts or maintenance crews, or fuel, or all the myriad other things the AF needs to work properly. They've got the same problem the army does. That's largely why Russia didn't overrun Ukraine in three days.

[MadMojoMonkey]

They don't seem very sophisticated if they have to get close enough to get shot down to identify their targets. I thought they could precision bomb anything from the stratosphere, they were so damn good.

They can hit every car on the highway from behind the horizon with pinpoint precision.

I'm not saying it really makes a lot of sense. It makes some sense. It's from the source you linked, not my presumption.

My presumption would be that you can at least easily identify a tank on the back of a flatbed truck and safely assume that's not a civilian vehicle.

[Poopadoop]

They can hit every car on the highway from behind the horizon with pinpoint precision.

That plane must have been getting a tune-up that day. In that video from the Popular mechanics link they couldn't even hit the highway, never mind what was on it.