What is your political ideology?

[Bad Beaten]

Hmm...

[michael1123]

Yikes ... Social Liberal ... I think?

I think you need to make like a 20 question test for us to take to find out which of the above we fall into. Would make for a more fun thread too, to see how everyone answers the different political delimas and issues.

[gutshot]

http://www.politicalcompass.org/

This one is good.

[Element187]

libertarian easy.

not exactly pleased with bush and the republicans. but would never want to see american way of life in danger from the socialist in america (howard dean/hillary clinton/ted kennedy/bernie sanders/al sharpton/jesse jackson/aclu/michael moore/george soros).

not pro conservative, but anti-liberalism.


supporting politicians like rudy guliani, michael badnarik, joe lieberman.

[Bad Beaten]

A libertarian who likes Lieberman? WTF?

I like him on gay rights, the environment, and civil rights issues...

But he's in favour of media censorship, a staunch War on Drugs support, and generally extremely hawkish/pro-premeptive on defense...None of those positions would be supported by either left-libertarians or libertarian-conservatives, to say the least.

As for the GOP, you'll be hard pressed to meet a more authoritarian bunch than Mid-Atlantic, Mid-West, and (especially) Deep South Republicans.

Labour.

The Tories in Britain really don't make much sense.

[Element187]

A libertarian who likes Lieberman? WTF?

I like him on gay rights, the environment, and civil rights issues...

he was the only democrat running for the primary democrat nomination that would be voteable... no one with their right mind could have voted for john kerry, howard dean, al sharpton, john edwards..


seriously, all the democrats sucked this past election year.. lieberman was the most moderate of all them.

[evman150]

Just left of centre.

[Element187]

how can "Centrist (Liberal Party of Canada, moderate Democrats, New Labour)"


be considered centrist ??? that is a very ironic description.

its like howard dean calling himself a democrat when he really is a socialist...i guess thats how you can have a popular communist party in america, mask it with words like liberal and democrat.

[gabe]

elementy187, we think very alike.

[vqc]

socialism and its corollary of communism as an ideal is a very attractive ideal. Its too bad that human nature would never allow it to happen.

[vqc]

just take hte political compass test, i did that for my gov class, its cool.

[whileone]

http://www.politicalcompass.org/
This one is good.

left of center anarchist.
Economic Left/Right: -2.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.46


Roads and libraries do more for freedom than they take away. Policemen, firemen and teachers help the economy more than the hurt it.

[vqc]

Your political compass
Economic Left/Right: 0.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.26

Almost dead center.

Your political compass
Economic Left/Right: -3.50
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.87

[FyrFytr998]

Labour.

The Tories in Britain really don't make much sense.

Labor? *Must resist the urge to make joke about his age!*

Whew, that was hard. I would think a person of your age would be more inclined as to wether to choose between the Harry Potter or Power Ranger Pajamas.

Dammit. I failed. I am weak.

[TylerK]

[michael1123]

Economic Left/Right: -3.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.67

My dot on the graph is right where the Dalai Lama's is!

"I've always felt a strong spirital connection with the Dalai Lama."

On a side note, I hope everyone strongly disagreed with "You cannot be moral without being religious."

[Fnord]

What selection is for Socially Liberal Fiscal Conservatives.

Theocratic Conservative (Islamists, about 1/2 of the GOP)

That is silly and pretty biased. A large portion of the party isn't Bible thumping.

Libertarian-Conservative/Classical Liberal/Thatcherite

The biggest problem I have with this group is they often go too far under-estimating the importance and needed scope of government. Also, many are isolationist when it comes to forgien affairs.

[Shark Bait]

pure libertarian.

Lieberman sucks because of his censorship bullshit. If you're into video games and politics...you know what I'm talking about.

[Grand_MasterB]

Your political compass
Economic Left/Right: 0.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.26

Almost dead center.

i was right where you are... maybe my neutralness explains why i find politics and political conversations to be a snooze fest.

[Phyl]

Politcal compass results:

Economic Left/Right: 1.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.51

To be honest, I think it's a bad test.

[a500lbgorilla]

Conservative fiscally. The rest I could care less about, more passionate people can decide what to do with unborn children.

-'rilla

[LeFou]

What selection is for Socially Liberal Fiscal Conservatives.

Theocratic Conservative (Islamists, about 1/2 of the GOP)

That is silly and pretty biased. A large portion of the party isn't Bible thumping.

I agree and found that weird. Theocracy is about uniting the political authority with the religious authority. Even bible-thumping GOP types aren't really interested in that. Their notion of moral governance is -- oddly -- in accord with communitarian thought.

I voted "Other". I think I'm a Green ... or a Green Libertarian. But "Other" will be fine.

[ZenOffsuit]

Definitely Libertarian

I am from Massachusetts and I am horrified by the socialist idiots that 'represent' me in the House and Senate.

[Glival]

Your political compass
Economic Left/Right: -2.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.36

Questions like "Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism" don't really apply to me (I live in Europe).

I'm curious as to what the USA people answered to the following questions:
- "I'd always support my country, whether it was right or wrong."
- "No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it."

[ZenOffsuit]

Your political compass
Economic Left/Right: -2.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.36

Questions like "Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism" don't really apply to me (I live in Europe).

I'm curious as to what the USA people answered to the following questions:
- "I'd always support my country, whether it was right or wrong."
- "No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it."

If I felt we were absolutely in the wrong...no I wouldn't.

IMO, the second question is stupid; But, I do think it is more foolish to blame and insult your country in a knee-jerk way just because it is trendy and cool or considered 'progressive' thinking.

[Element187]

Definitely Libertarian

I am from Massachusetts and I am horrified by the socialist idiots that 'represent' me in the House and Senate.

ouch .. too bad you cant vote em out .. the majority in your state will keep teddie in the senate for all of eternity ... and when teddie passes, they will choose another kennedy out of the 400 available.

[Element187]

I'm curious as to what the USA people answered to the following questions:
- "I'd always support my country, whether it was right or wrong."
- "No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it."

1. no ... if we were over in iraq dipping people toe first into acid bath, scooping childrens eyes out with ice cream scoops, putting political enemys into wood chiippers.. hey wait, iraqi's dont have to fear that anymore, saddam is in jail.

2. now thats stupid .. americans love their country because they are not taxed to death, forced to pay for royal family's grocery bill, forced to pay for everyones health coverage (government healthcare), we dont pay 7$ a gallon for petro, we dont have horrible unemployment problems, and our GDP is f'n huge ... and for gods sake we dont eat fish and chips.

[ZenOffsuit]

I'm curious as to what the USA people answered to the following questions:
- "I'd always support my country, whether it was right or wrong."
- "No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it."

1. no ... if we were over in iraq dipping people toe first into acid bath, scooping childrens eyes out with ice cream scoops, putting political enemys into wood chiippers.. hey wait, iraqi's dont have to fear that anymore, saddam is in jail.

2. now thats stupid .. americans love their country because they are not taxed to death, forced to pay for royal family's grocery bill, forced to pay for everyones health coverage (government healthcare), we dont pay 7$ a gallon for petro, we dont have horrible unemployment problems, and our GDP is f'n huge ... and for gods sake we dont eat fish and chips.

I like the way you think! For anyone that thinks that Abu Ghraib was the horror of horrors......try watching Shadows in The Sand.....now that is torture.

And yes Element, Way too many people drink the Kennedy Kool-Aide around here...it is sickening. I bet the same people that vote for him won't let him drive them anywhere!

[Bad Beaten]

how can "Centrist (Liberal Party of Canada, moderate Democrats, New Labour)"


be considered centrist ??? that is a very ironic description.

its like howard dean calling himself a democrat when he really is a socialist...i guess thats how you can have a popular communist party in america, mask it with words like liberal and democrat.

Howard Dean is far from a left-wing demagogue and the Democratic Party is not socialist from either a theoretical or a policy standpoint. (In fact, when one examines his record in VT, one sees somebody who is a semi-statist fiscal moderate to conservative and a liberal-leaning social moderate similar to the Progressive Conservative Party of Ontario prior to its take over by Mike Harris and the slash-and-burn hard-right gang)

[Element187]

I'm curious as to what the USA people answered to the following questions:
- "I'd always support my country, whether it was right or wrong."
- "No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it."

1. no ... if we were over in iraq dipping people toe first into acid bath, scooping childrens eyes out with ice cream scoops, putting political enemys into wood chiippers.. hey wait, iraqi's dont have to fear that anymore, saddam is in jail.

2. now thats stupid .. americans love their country because they are not taxed to death, forced to pay for royal family's grocery bill, forced to pay for everyones health coverage (government healthcare), we dont pay 7$ a gallon for petro, we dont have horrible unemployment problems, and our GDP is f'n huge ... and for gods sake we dont eat fish and chips.

I like the way you think! For anyone that thinks that Abu Ghraib was the horror of horrors......try watching Shadows in The Sand.....now that is torture.

And yes Element, Way too many people drink the Kennedy Kool-Aide around here...it is sickening. I bet the same people that vote for him won't let him drive them anywhere!

i dont see how anyone can say abu ghraib was torture .... taking pictures of prisoners in funny sexual positions isnt torture... embarrasing ... but not torture ... hell, back in my kegger party days, we would do that to the first two lightweights that passed out.. and i never had michael moore or howard dean breathing down my neck.


even if we were torturing prisoners ... so what, these are terrorist launching bombs at iraqi citizens and american troops.. and why is the left calling for gitmo to be closed ... are they going to house these terrorist ???

[Bad Beaten]

I'm curious as to what the USA people answered to the following questions:
- "I'd always support my country, whether it was right or wrong."
- "No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it."

1. no ... if we were over in iraq dipping people toe first into acid bath, scooping childrens eyes out with ice cream scoops, putting political enemys into wood chiippers.. hey wait, iraqi's dont have to fear that anymore, saddam is in jail.

2. now thats stupid .. americans love their country because they are not taxed to death, forced to pay for royal family's grocery bill, forced to pay for everyones health coverage (government healthcare), we dont pay 7$ a gallon for petro, we dont have horrible unemployment problems, and our GDP is f'n huge ... and for gods sake we dont eat fish and chips.

I like the way you think! For anyone that thinks that Abu Ghraib was the horror of horrors......try watching Shadows in The Sand.....now that is torture.

And yes Element, Way too many people drink the Kennedy Kool-Aide around here...it is sickening. I bet the same people that vote for him won't let him drive them anywhere!

Abu Gharib is bad, and American prisons are deplorable...Human Rights Watch (which has been ironically criticised by China for an alleged pro-American bias. Frankly, I think the C"C"P and both parties in the U.S. are in cahoots, but I don't feel like going into that right now, as I have some vacuuming to finish...Put it this way...Anybody who has ever read an objective account of modern Taiwanese history would have a hard time disagreeing with the assertation that Taiwan is nothing more than a staged pissing contest between the two nations and that since the rise of Lee Teng-hui and his radical democratic reforms, there has been a tri-partite agreement between the Kuomintang, the Chinese CONmunist Party, and America's rulers to ensure that the Waishengren right-wing pan-Chinese nationalist elite is able to eventually turn Taiwan into a Sino-American puppet state...Of course, A-bian is too naive and trusting of America to realise this, which makes the Democratic Progressive Party a dead end towards Taiwanese emancipation) released a report on the state of Maryland's youth jails a few years that was a real eye-opener to me. I have similar faith in Amnesty International: They may be hard on the U.S., but one look at their reports suggests that they don't put the kid gloves on when calling any regime out (including my own in Canada) for any sorts of huamn rights abuses.

[Element187]

you sure know alot about china.

they make good lo mein too.



in all seriousness i think Amnesty International is a bunch of hokey crack pots.

[whileone]

even if we were torturing prisoners ... so what, these are terrorist launching bombs at iraqi citizens and american troops.. and why is the left calling for gitmo to be closed ... are they going to house these terrorist ???

I think you're confusing two issues.

So, the last *big* terrorist problem in the us whas the whole militia thing that blew up that fedral building in oklahoma. It seems to me the FBI pretty much took that apart. Terrorists aren't an army, the're a handful of crazy people that need to be stopped. It's a job for cops, not armies.

The folks at gitmo not involved with flying planes into buildings are prisoners of war. the govenrments they were fighting for have collapsed. send them to iraq and afghanistan to face war crimes charges, or let them go. a private does what he's told, not masterminding killing millions of americans. By and large the're just grunts. you can pick out the super villians after a few years. execute them. To put it another way, do you think the pope was a nazi on purpose? he did what he did, because he had no choice. folks in afghanistan didn't have cnn coverage before the war, all they heard was, the infidels are coming, kill them.

catch terrorists with police. it's cheap (relative to war) and very effective. grunt soldiers aren't responsible for war, they do what thier told. Non grunt soldiers need to be hanged ASAP.

[michael1123]

I'm curious as to what the USA people answered to the following questions:
- "I'd always support my country, whether it was right or wrong."
- "No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it."

- "I'd always support my country, whether it was right or wrong."

Strongly disagree. That line of thinking sickens me. That's how guys like Hitler could do what they do. Its almost the same line of thinking as law = morality, which is another pet peeve of mine.

- "No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it."

I agreed, but not strongly. Of course you can be happy to live where you do, but that's not what the question is really asking. I'm just not very big on the whole nationalist thing. I wouldn't really say it was "foolish", and don't look down on people that do, its just not something I'd feel.

[Glival]

1. no ... if we were over in iraq dipping people toe first into acid bath, scooping childrens eyes out with ice cream scoops, putting political enemys into wood chiippers.. hey wait, iraqi's dont have to fear that anymore, saddam is in jail.

2. now thats stupid .. americans love their country because they are not taxed to death, forced to pay for royal family's grocery bill, forced to pay for everyones health coverage (government healthcare), we dont pay 7$ a gallon for petro, we dont have horrible unemployment problems, and our GDP is f'n huge ... and for gods sake we dont eat fish and chips.

First of all I didn't mean to insult anyone, it's just that I sometimes don't understand the pride people take in living in the USA.

I like living in The Netherlands; due to the taxing no one lives in poverty (you get money from the state if you don't have a job, but you have to prove you've been searching for a job), and everyone can get basic healthcare, wether they have money, insurance, or not. We do have a national debt, but it isn't that extreme (http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/). But that doesn't mean I wouldn't want to live in the USA, Norway, France, or whatever.

About Iraq, I've heard so many reasons to justify invading the country, what's the main reason according to the USA politicians?

I totally agree with Michael by the way.

[a500lbgorilla]

First of all I didn't mean to insult anyone, it's just that I sometimes don't understand the pride people take in living in the USA.

And you probably never will.

I BLEED RED [WHITE AND BLUE] MOTHERFUCKER!

-'rilla

I'm a definite believe in patriotism and being proud of where you are from. If you don't like your origins, you will probably be eternally depressed.

[vqc]

Your political compass
Economic Left/Right: 0.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.26

Almost dead center.

i was right where you are... maybe my neutralness explains why i find politics and political conversations to be a snooze fest.

I love politics. A ridiculous amount. I spent most of my junior and senior year debating politics with the rest of my school. I showed up to rallys and went anti-rallyying. I was hardcore. Now that the elections over, my boner for politics has decreased. When it starts kicking up again, Ill restart my efforts at making sure hillary clinton doesnt get into office.

[whileone]

I'm a definite believe in patriotism and being proud of where you are from. If you don't like your origins, you will probably be eternally depressed.

Or english. they seem eternally depressed as well.

[Gatlin Dan]

my current avatar tells you which way I lean.


George McGovern for President!

[ensign_lee]

Pretty right wing here. Lousy liberals...:P

Good thing they're giving me their money. haha.

Go Bush.

[dsaxton]

Economic Left/Right: -1.25
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -3.49

[Theeggman]

"No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it."

That's as weak as folding aces preflop. I don't care where you're from. We each owe it to our people to take some pride and contribute to our country's progress.

The "foolish" comes when you let national pride eclipse rational thinking. That's when you skew reality and - as an example - become the founder of the KKK.

I used to say to my friends that I have an obligation to better myself and appreciate what I have because I could have just as easily been born a one-legged Guatemalan girl. So I do understand where the statement leads, but I don't agree with it. Sounds European. doh.

[Demiparadigm]

Economic Left/Right: -2.50
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -3.03


I don't think the quiz is incredibly accurate. I consider myself relatively conservative. without the quiz, I would put me at about 0,1 although I do have some libertarian tendencies.
I am registered as a republican, but I despise the GOP. If it weren't for Politicians like John McCain and Jim Kolbe(a representative from AZ) I don't think there would be anything nice I could say about the party. The fact that W was reelected I think is a testament to the idiocy and ignorance prevalent in American society.

[Element187]

Libertarian-Conservative/Classical Liberal/Thatcherite

The biggest problem I have with this group is they often go too far under-estimating the importance and needed scope of government. Also, many are isolationist when it comes to forgien affairs.

i think i agree with you 100% .. even tho i consider myself a libertarian, i do not share the view of the party on foreign policy .. its essential for us to stick our noses in the middle east to protect our way of life (oil)

[Element187]

even if we were torturing prisoners ... so what, these are terrorist launching bombs at iraqi citizens and american troops.. and why is the left calling for gitmo to be closed ... are they going to house these terrorist ???

I think you're confusing two issues.

So, the last *big* terrorist problem in the us whas the whole militia thing that blew up that fedral building in oklahoma. It seems to me the FBI pretty much took that apart. Terrorists aren't an army, the're a handful of crazy people that need to be stopped. It's a job for cops, not armies.

The folks at gitmo not involved with flying planes into buildings are prisoners of war. the govenrments they were fighting for have collapsed. send them to iraq and afghanistan to face war crimes charges, or let them go. a private does what he's told, not masterminding killing millions of americans. By and large the're just grunts. you can pick out the super villians after a few years. execute them. To put it another way, do you think the pope was a nazi on purpose? he did what he did, because he had no choice. folks in afghanistan didn't have cnn coverage before the war, all they heard was, the infidels are coming, kill them.

catch terrorists with police. it's cheap (relative to war) and very effective. grunt soldiers aren't responsible for war, they do what thier told. Non grunt soldiers need to be hanged ASAP.

i think this is where we disagree ..alot of these prisoners are "grunts" of al qaeda and we need to continue to interogate them to get them to spill every last drop of information.. so far the ongoing detainees are helping us out with investigating future attacks, we need to continue to hold them until the war on terror is over, then we should prosecute them with military tribunals.

[Element187]

First of all I didn't mean to insult anyone, it's just that I sometimes don't understand the pride people take in living in the USA.

And you probably never will.

I BLEED RED [WHITE AND BLUE] MOTHERFUCKER!

-'rilla

werd to your ancestory ape.

[Element187]

Now that the elections over, my boner for politics has decreased. When it starts kicking up again, Ill restart my efforts at making sure hillary clinton doesnt get into office.

AMEN TO THAT.

[Element187]

Economic Left/Right: -2.50
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -3.03


I don't think the quiz is incredibly accurate. I consider myself relatively conservative. without the quiz, I would put me at about 0,1 although I do have some libertarian tendencies.
I am registered as a republican, but I despise the GOP. If it weren't for Politicians like John McCain and Jim Kolbe(a representative from AZ) I don't think there would be anything nice I could say about the party. The fact that W was reelected I think is a testament to the idiocy and ignorance prevalent in American society.

i agree with your post to extent .. W does suck , but what were the choices ?? him or a socialist ... we have been fighting communism for the last 100 years, why would i want want to help john kerry get to the white house.. i ended up voting for bush just to avoid john kerry's ideas, not because i liked bush or agree with him.

i believe in a strong capitalist nation, and electing far left politicians into office would seriously damage our way of life.

[gabe]

element, seriously, we think too much alike. i was just about to make all the same posts you did, but my job is already done.

[Element187]

element, seriously, we think too much alike. i was just about to make all the same posts you did, but my job is already done.

dont get me started on the ACLU



i'm convinced the majority of the country is libertarian, and they just dont know it...

i'd say close to 75% of GOP supporters are libertarians but vote primarly republican because they dont even know the libertarian party exists.. and because the democrats havent been on the right side of any important issue in our country, they completely lost touch with america.


also i think close to 30% or maybe more of "democrats" are libertarians and dont know it.. .then another 65% being moderate democrats, and with the last 5% being far left liberals (socialist/communist)


i think howard dean being in control of the DNC is the fall of the democrat party.. he will completely alienate america from the party (he's doing a good job so far only a few months into the position)


my prediction for 2012, the democrats wont even exist, and will give way to all the "3rd parties" to have a decent chance of taking the white house.. and i think the libertarian party will be the front runner against the GOP.

[michael1123]

"No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it."

That's as weak as folding aces preflop. I don't care where you're from. We each owe it to our people to take some pride and contribute to our country's progress.

I'm a definite believe in patriotism and being proud of where you are from. If you don't like your origins, you will probably be eternally depressed.

I'm proud of my poker winnings. I'm proud of my college degree. It makes sense to be proud of things you've accomplished. Being proud of the country you were born in just seems silly to me. Now if I founded the country, or ran the country, then it would make rational sense ...

Its not the same thing as being happy to live where you do and not in some desolate third world country ran by an evil dictator, struggling to earn enough to feed yourself. The question really has nothing to do with "contributing to your country's progess", nor does it have to do with not liking your country of origin.

[Element187]

"No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it."

That's as weak as folding aces preflop. I don't care where you're from. We each owe it to our people to take some pride and contribute to our country's progress.

I'm a definite believe in patriotism and being proud of where you are from. If you don't like your origins, you will probably be eternally depressed.

I'm proud of my poker winnings. I'm proud of my college degree. It makes sense to be proud of things you've accomplished. Being proud of the country you were born in just seems silly to me. Now if I founded the country, or ran the country, then it would make sense ...

Its not the same thing as being happy to live where you do and not in some desolate third world country ran by an evil dictator, struggling to earn enough to feed yourself. The question really has nothing to do with "contributing to your country's progess", nor does it have to do with not liking your country of origin.

being proud of the country you are born into is nothing to look down upon .


there is a reason why we have the highest most sought after migration in the world... even our allies like england and france cant compare.

i had english neighbors who migrated here back in '92 and they cant believe how good they have it now ..

not being able to drive v8's cheaply, to outrageous taxes .. find me an american who is happy else where, minus johnny dep, sean penn and michael moore, or any rich priveledged liberal.

[Element187]

Theocratic Conservative (Islamists, about 1/2 of the GOP)


is this correct? i thought the majority of muslims voted for john kerry this year ?

[michael1123]

being proud of the country you are born into is nothing to look down upon .

there is a reason why we have the highest most sought after migration in the world... even our allies like england and france cant compare.

i had english neighbors who migrated here back in '92 and they cant believe how good they have it now ..

not being able to drive v8's cheaply, to outrageous taxes .. find me an american who is happy else where, minus johnny dep, sean penn and michael moore, or any rich priveledged liberal.

Good job at not comprehending any point in my post!

First, I already said in my other post that I don't look down upon people that have "pride" in their country, I just don't think its rational.

As I said, it has absolutely nothing to do with how good the country your born in is. That would be asking how much you like your country. It also has nothing to do with the U.S. specifically. The question goes for all people of all countries.

I gave examples of things that make sense to be proud of, but since that didn't work, here's a definition.

Pride: Satisfaction with your achievements.

Is it an achievement to be born into a good country? Is the country a good country because of you?

As the question states, we don't choose the country we're born into. Its not an accomplishment, and actually being proud of things your country does or has done in the past is really in a way taking credit you don't deserve. I may as well be proud of stopping Adolf Hitler, or the building of the Great Wall of China, or hell, the creation of the Earth!

Now being proud of your achievements, which could possibly be policital and could benifit your country, does make sense. But that's not what the question was asking.

[Glival]

Exactly my thoughts, but I'm having trouble translating my thoughts into English

[Estrop]

Which on is communism? I think the nazi party were really onto something...

[a500lbgorilla]

"No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it."

That's as weak as folding aces preflop. I don't care where you're from. We each owe it to our people to take some pride and contribute to our country's progress.

I'm a definite believe in patriotism and being proud of where you are from. If you don't like your origins, you will probably be eternally depressed.

I'm proud of my poker winnings. I'm proud of my college degree. It makes sense to be proud of things you've accomplished. Being proud of the country you were born in just seems silly to me. Now if I founded the country, or ran the country, then it would make rational sense ...

Its not the same thing as being happy to live where you do and not in some desolate third world country ran by an evil dictator, struggling to earn enough to feed yourself. The question really has nothing to do with "contributing to your country's progess", nor does it have to do with not liking your country of origin.

I'm proud of your poker winnings too. I'm proud of my families achievements independant of mine. And I'm proud of my countries achievements and grateful for them.

-'rilla

[Greedo017]

"The fact that W was reelected I think is a testament to the idiocy and ignorance prevalent in American society."

haha, yea, those ignorant lawyers and doctors and dentists don't know what they're talking about, hippies all the way!

[Theeggman]

I'm proud of my poker winnings. I'm proud of my college degree. It makes sense to be proud of things you've accomplished. Being proud of the country you were born in just seems silly to me. Now if I founded the country, or ran the country, then it would make rational sense ...

I understand what you're saying and I do agree with it. The misunderstanding comes with the ambiguous definition of "pride". I'm not as proud of my country as much as I am committed to it. I see a "yes" answer to the question as being "weak" because without national pride there would be no national defense.

I think that with the pervasive short-sightedness in our culture your thinking is correct. It seems as US citizens we tend to polarize and are either blindly and wholeheartedly American or equally blindly anti-American. I cannot stand the people in our country who criticize the US as being an autocratic evil empire with only our own best interest in mind. Yet if they had to live in a country where protests were met with machetes or automatic gunfire they would likely change their opinion of where they were born.

I'm not proud of my country in the same way that I'm proud of my nunchuck skills. But I still take much pride in my country even though it definitely has blemishes.

. . .And for the record, I'm against picketing but I just don't know how to show it. (rip mitch)

[a500lbgorilla]

I'm proud of your ability to keep boobs in your avatar.

-'rilla

[Theeggman]

I'm proud of your ability to keep boobs in your avatar.

-'rilla

And I'm proud of your ability to find - and compress - the most entertaining loops available on the web *tearful hug*

[Greedo017]

"No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it"

There is a difference between being proud of being born in a country, and being proud of your country and its accomplishments. I don't see how anyone could be proud of being born in a particular country. but, i'm proud of my country. I'm proud of what my country stands for, the things that my country does. whether or not i like my country does affect whether I have pride in it. someone who lived in iraq under hussein's worst years and hated their own country can still disagree with this statement, depending on how you interpret it.

[BeatMeBad]

This quiz is all wrong. Everyone who knows me says I am just to the left of Ghengis Khan. This thing scored me at Economic Left/Right 5.38 and Social Libertarian/Authoritarian 2.31. I can't be such a bleeding heart! I should be at least 9.50/7.50.

[ihategnomes]

Where is the option for, Writes angry letters to the government and thinks big brother is out to get you?

[Element187]

Which on is communism?

Social Liberal (aka left-wing of the Democratic Party, some of the Liberal Party of Canada, U.K. LibDems)
Social Democrat (Canada's NDP, most centre-left and third war parties in Europe, Bernie Sanders, a few Democrats)
Centrist (Liberal Party of Canada, moderate Democrats, New Labour)
Left-libertarian (certain New Democrats and Blocheads in Canada, most Greens in the U.S., a few Democrats, Aussie and Kiwi Greens, Leung Kwok-hung)
Authoritarian Far-Left (Maoist, Stalinist, Castroist, Kimist, etc...)


take your pick.

[Element187]

"No one chooses his or her country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it"

There is a difference between being proud of being born in a country, and being proud of your country and its accomplishments. I don't see how anyone could be proud of being born in a particular country. but, i'm proud of my country. I'm proud of what my country stands for, the things that my country does. whether or not i like my country does affect whether I have pride in it. someone who lived in iraq under hussein's worst years and hated their own country can still disagree with this statement, depending on how you interpret it.

werd to your grandmother

[whileone]

Which on is communism?

Social Liberal (aka left-wing of the Democratic Party, some of the Liberal Party of Canada, U.K. LibDems)
Social Democrat (Canada's NDP, most centre-left and third war parties in Europe, Bernie Sanders, a few Democrats)
Centrist (Liberal Party of Canada, moderate Democrats, New Labour)
Left-libertarian (certain New Democrats and Blocheads in Canada, most Greens in the U.S., a few Democrats, Aussie and Kiwi Greens, Leung Kwok-hung)
Authoritarian Far-Left (Maoist, Stalinist, Castroist, Kimist, etc...)


take your pick.

socialists and communists both trade economic and personal freedom for stuff.

socialists promise things like health care and schools.

communists promise things like tanks and jets.

socialists forcibly take money to build things like schools, then they force kids to attend the schools, on the theory that the country will be *better* if everyone goes to school. it may not allways work out, but that is the stated goal.

communists forcibly take money to build factories. they continusly ramp up production capacity, at the expense of everything else, to conquer the world. communists figure, once all of the capitalists are gone, and the economys can be managed, less and less work will be required to do the same amount of work, eventualy nobody will have to work. but before any of that can happen, they have to rule the world. so the factories end up building war stuff.

i just finished an american history class, tought my an east german who got out in 1988. if that means anything, to you, he grew up in a stalinist school system. east germany was basicly run by a soviet puppet government. he also covered national socalisim. in german it's translated to something like "nationales socalism" they abbreviated that as nazism.

don't let folks fool you. hitler was a socialist. the italians were the facists. FDR's public works projects were creepily simaler to hitlers public works programs. the autobaahn and all that crap was a bunch of public work projects to get the economy back in gear. once things started rolling they kicked over into "attack mode".

in general, socalists will, against your will, build socal programs. public transportation is a good example. public funding of amtrack. public hospitals. crap like that.

communists will, against your will, build factories. ususaly they use the factories to build tanks and jets and stuff.

[Element187]

Which on is communism?

Social Liberal (aka left-wing of the Democratic Party, some of the Liberal Party of Canada, U.K. LibDems)
Social Democrat (Canada's NDP, most centre-left and third war parties in Europe, Bernie Sanders, a few Democrats)
Centrist (Liberal Party of Canada, moderate Democrats, New Labour)
Left-libertarian (certain New Democrats and Blocheads in Canada, most Greens in the U.S., a few Democrats, Aussie and Kiwi Greens, Leung Kwok-hung)
Authoritarian Far-Left (Maoist, Stalinist, Castroist, Kimist, etc...)


take your pick.

socialists and communists both trade economic and personal freedom for stuff.

socialists promise things like health care and schools.

communists promise things like tanks and jets.

socialists forcibly take money to build things like schools, then they force kids to attend the schools, on the theory that the country will be *better* if everyone goes to school. it may not allways work out, but that is the stated goal.

communists forcibly take money to build factories. they continusly ramp up production capacity, at the expense of everything else, to conquer the world. communists figure, once all of the capitalists are gone, and the economys can be managed, less and less work will be required to do the same amount of work, eventualy nobody will have to work. but before any of that can happen, they have to rule the world. so the factories end up building war stuff.

i just finished an american history class, tought my an east german who got out in 1988. if that means anything, to you, he grew up in a stalinist school system. east germany was basicly run by a soviet puppet government. he also covered national socalisim. in german it's translated to something like "nationales socalism" they abbreviated that as nazism.

don't let folks fool you. hitler was a socialist. the italians were the facists. FDR's public works projects were creepily simaler to hitlers public works programs. the autobaahn and all that crap was a bunch of public work projects to get the economy back in gear. once things started rolling they kicked over into "attack mode".

in general, socalists will, against your will, build socal programs. public transportation is a good example. public funding of amtrack. public hospitals. crap like that.

communists will, against your will, build factories. ususaly they use the factories to build tanks and jets and stuff.

Main Entry: com·mu·nism
Pronunciation: 'käm-y&-"ni-z&m
Function: noun
Etymology: French communisme, from commun common
1 a : a theory advocating elimination of private property b : a system in which goods are owned in common and are available to all as needed
2 capitalized a : a doctrine based on revolutionary Marxian socialism and Marxism-Leninism that was the official ideology of the U.S.S.R. b : a totalitarian system of government in which a single authoritarian party controls state-owned means of production c : a final stage of society in Marxist theory in which the state has withered away and economic goods are distributed equitably d : communist systems collectively



Main Entry: so·cial·ism
Pronunciation: 'sO-sh&-"li-z&m
Function: noun
1 : any of various economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods
2 a : a system of society or group living in which there is no private property b : a system or condition of society in which the means of production are owned and controlled by the state
3 : a stage of society in Marxist theory transitional between capitalism and communism and distinguished by unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done



i dunno they sound like the same thing.

both are dangerous to the USA and should be shunned and looked down upon ... and for gods sake vote against howard dean and the socialist of america (DNC)

[whileone]

if you want to go with those definitions you can't call Stalin or Khrushchev a communist, because they weren’t. When folks generally talk about communists they *mean* cold war Russia. The Russians used the rhetoric of "allowing the state to wither away" and all of that, but in practice they did something completely different.


just to be clear, you are morally opposed to the national highway system, national parks, FDA, FCC, state schools, etc because it is a "a system in which goods are owned in common and are available to all as needed" or are you intentionally using slightly misleading language to make your point seem stronger?

For all I know you're a pure capitalist, that's awesome. In that pure system where everything is owned, how do you separate stuff that's hard to separate? Like air, how do I keep you from getting your car exhaust out of my air? I think some things *have* to be shared. Maybe not, I’m not exactly a clear thinker.

[Element187]

just to be clear, you are morally opposed to the national highway system, national parks, FDA, FCC, state schools, etc because it is a "a system in which goods are owned in common and are available to all as needed" or are you intentionally using slightly misleading language to make your point seem stronger?

For all I know you're a pure capitalist, that's awesome. In that pure system where everything is owned, how do you separate stuff that's hard to separate? Like air, how do I keep you from getting your car exhaust out of my air? I think some things *have* to be shared. Maybe not, I’m not exactly a clear thinker.

there is no way to put ownership on air, although the libs in california are trying to tax people on exactly that.


the government does own alot of the land in the states, but alot of it is for sale, and individuals may purchase land from the government.

state parks are owned by the government to create sanctuaries for plants and animals that would normally be destroyed in favor of a super walmart.

roads are not owned completely by the government, you can adopt a road i here (reminds me of an episode of seinfeld)

i dont like the fcc, i think its bogus in every way .. censorship is wrong and controlling who can broadcast and who cant stands in the way of our rights. i dont remember our 4 fathers ever ommitting into the consitution the state has the right to all broadcasting.

we pay taxes to keep schools open to educate our children.. its a better use of socialism then letting parents pay for their own childs education directly.


my main beef with socialism is its goal to garnish all wages of everyone and redistributing them equally that peeves me .. it then defeats the purpose of even getting an education when someone at mcdonalds flipping burgers and cleaning grease traps is making almost as much as an engineer.

although a tax system is a small form of socialism, when it applies to our tax systems specifically. the fact we have tax brackets on income is a step in the communist idea as it creates class warfare and a clever way of redistributing wages.

i really think we need to lose the tax brackets and just go on pure % of income no matter if its 20k a year or 2 million dollars a year.. an even better idea would to abolish the IRS completely and keep a national sales tax so we can stop punishing people who prefer to save their money against the people that like to buy spinning rims.

but of coures none of this can happen if we keep electing the far left into office.

[whileone]

roads are not owned completely by the government, you can adopt a road i here (reminds me of an episode of seinfeld)

well, you keep it clean. you don't patrol it, provide sinage, mantinence ie, the expensive stuff

i dont like the fcc

i don't like it either

we pay taxes to keep schools open to educate our children.. its a better use of socialism then letting parents pay for their own childs education directly.

i don't have kids and never will. i get sick of parents i work with bitiching about how the schools treat thier kids. But, in the long run i think having people who can read and write is better for me that a bunch of retarded thugs.

my main beef with socialism is its goal to garnish all wages of everyone and redistributing them equally that peeves me .. it then defeats the purpose of even getting an education when someone at mcdonalds flipping burgers and cleaning grease traps is making almost as much as an engineer.

yes, it's reasonable to fear the crazy extremes. socalism is a useful tool for maintaining balance, but some jobs are harder than others, and worth more than others. I think a minimum wage is better than a welfare kind of solution, i have complicated feelings about that.

although a tax system is a small form of socialism, when it applies to our tax systems specifically. the fact we have tax brackets on income is a step in the communist idea as it creates class warfare and a clever way of redistributing wages.

i'm with you on a flat income tax. but, does the guy who rents an apartment benifit more or less than the guy who owns the apartment building from the fire department? People with more stuff worth stealing get more value from the police. i have a preference for a flat tax, but i'm not strongly opposed to a progressive tax.

i really think we need to lose the tax brackets and just go on pure % of income no matter if its 20k a year or 2 million dollars a year.. an even better idea would to abolish the IRS completely and keep a national sales tax so we can stop punishing people who prefer to save their money against the people that like to buy spinning rims.

so, the tax i have the biggest issue with is inheritence. Warren buffet, bill gates, all for inheritance taxes. people who made thier own money seem to think just giving thier kids a pile of dough, dosn't help the economy or thier kids. you ever hear of a Vanderbuilt or a Rocafeller or a Kennedy *cough* Bush making money? how about no inheritance tax up to 10 million, (each kid could get 10 million tax free) 100% beyond that. they could live a nice life, never having to work. but not piss away those resources like, say, paris hilton.

but of coures none of this can happen if we keep electing the far left into office.

*shrug* i'm not sure if you're just saying this or if you live somewhere real left. oregon maybe?

i think health care is out of control. sick or broken people are not working at full capacity. some sort of state run basic care provided cheap, that keeps people on thier feet could dramaticly reduce health insurance costs. I think if you look at the total cost of all of the health insurance and medicare, medicade, it's realy out of control. scrap all that crap, set up a new system, where anybody can go, for cheap, and i think you'll have a net economic win.

you probably think of me as a liberal nut job, but i don't see many people on either side making much sense.

sometimes you get a better deal with a state organization, sometimes you get a better deal with a private organization. both will always try to grab more power. whatever man.

[Element187]

*shrug* i'm not sure if you're just saying this or if you live somewhere real left. oregon maybe?

i think health care is out of control. sick or broken people are not working at full capacity. some sort of state run basic care provided cheap, that keeps people on thier feet could dramaticly reduce health insurance costs. I think if you look at the total cost of all of the health insurance and medicare, medicade, it's realy out of control. scrap all that crap, set up a new system, where anybody can go, for cheap, and i think you'll have a net economic win.

you probably think of me as a liberal nut job, but i don't see many people on either side making much sense.

sometimes you get a better deal with a state organization, sometimes you get a better deal with a private organization. both will always try to grab more power. whatever man.

I dont want my tax dollars to pay for obese people getting gastro bypasses. i dont want my tax money going to people with lung cancer who smoked cigarettes their entire lives. i dont want my tax money going to crack whores who want abortions. i dont want my tax money going to healthcare for everybody, it serves me no benefit except gobble up more of paycheck every week.

i have health insurance where i work. everyone should .. it should not be the governments responsibility to baby sit us.

mcdonalds offers health coverage, walmart .. take your pick there is plenty of low wage jobs that anyone can get and receive health coverage, do not burden middle class america with it because someone doesnt "want" to work at walmart... if you are not willing to find a job with health insurance, you dont deserve it.

the less social programs we have the better our country will be, its not the governments responsibility.

social security is a joke and should be done away with, or make it purely voluntary .. the people who choose to use it have to pay it, the people who dont want to pay into it should have the option of not paying into and let the money be well spent in a 401k or another means of investing.

again its not the governments job to make sure we all can retire, the slackers get what they deserve.

minium wage is an alright idea, but never should be raised, it just creates an inflation problem, everything starts costing us more, when its raised, i cant exactly goto my boss and say hey minium wage was raised by a 1$ so i deserve a 20% raise just to offset the compounding problem of inflation when min. wage is raised. if you cant earn more then min. wage, you should go back to selling crack.

welfare.. dont get me started.. ABOLISHED NOW.

foreign aid .. its welfare for the rest of the world .. the rest of the world doesnt appreciate, it never gets to the people it needs to .. ABOLISHED NOW.


this is why im a libertarian... i share the same ideas as our 4 fathers, not this new radical wanna be a socialist nation we have become, although i hate the GOP and republicans, but they keep the left from completely turning us into another canada/spain/france type government.