100nl, flopped flush facing c/r from small blind

villain is a solid regular running like 13/7/4 over 3000 hands. Is this 4 bet/ call a shove on the flop or call/reevaluate on the turn?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (9 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

CO ($64.15)
Button ($98.50)
SB ($100.50)
Hero (BB) ($94.35)
UTG ($109.75)
UTG+1 ($180.15)
MP1 ($40.15)
MP2 ($73.55)
MP3 ($13.40)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 2, 6
1 fold, UTG+1 calls $1, 5 folds, SB calls $0.50, Hero checks

Flop: ($3) Q, K, 9 (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $2, UTG+1 calls $2, SB raises to $11, Hero ?

SNAP FOLD!

Particularly if you don't stab at limped pots a lot.

folding here is fine.

okay, fold FTR is a nit garden.
what if we flop a mid-bottom set in a similar situation?

Originally Posted by pokerfan

okay, fold FTR is a nit garden.

Yeah, I'm a total folding station.

Originally Posted by pokerfan

okay, fold FTR is a nit garden.
what if we flop a mid-bottom set in a similar situation?

it's a way different situation as your set at least has a chance to improve to the nuts, whereas your hand is often dominated, and is never improving.

as described = dunno, it's rare for me to see a limped pot these days... I guess you can check 22-55 here and end up in that situation though.
In that case I call or push.

Originally Posted by Fnord

Originally Posted by pokerfan

okay, fold FTR is a nit garden.

Yeah, I'm a total folding station.

Do you consider folding sets here?

Originally Posted by daven

Originally Posted by pokerfan

okay, fold FTR is a nit garden.
what if we flop a mid-bottom set in a similar situation?

it's a way different situation as your set at least has a chance to improve to the nuts, whereas your hand is often dominated, and is never improving.

as described = dunno, it's rare for me to see a limped pot these days... I guess you can check 22-55 here and end up in that situation though.
In that case I call or push.

hmmm, i flopped little flush twice in these monotone flops this week and faced massive heat in limped pots. How is my life ?

Originally Posted by pokerfan

Originally Posted by Fnord

Originally Posted by pokerfan

okay, fold FTR is a nit garden.

Yeah, I'm a total folding station.

Do you consider folding sets here?

No. Certainly not middle or top set. I'm at least seeing a turn.

Originally Posted by Fnord

Originally Posted by pokerfan

Originally Posted by Fnord

Originally Posted by pokerfan

okay, fold FTR is a nit garden.

Yeah, I'm a total folding station.

Do you consider folding sets here?

No. Certainly not middle or top set. I'm at least seeing a turn.

I'm shocked that "fold" is still in your vocabulary, Fnord. lol. You seem to be the only player around here that isn't a nit or nearby. What's with that?


I guess I agree... I wouldn't do this at the lower stake though, like at 25nl.... would you?

Bleh I would call one street, 3betting is bad

Originally Posted by Deanglow

Bleh I would call one street, 3betting is bad

Yup! I don't think this is a snap fold.

Id also call one street and see if he slows down on the turn, plenty of people raise this flop with 2 pair,a club type hands.

this is how this hand developed from turn on. I smelt weakness and fired the turn after he slowed down. Do you guys fight back a lot or just check down?
Turn: ($27) 3 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero $22

how do we think that we're beat here? This guy's pretty nitty, but why couldn't he do this with a straight, set, good draw etc?

I was gonna say if another club fell i like betting representing the ace of clubs, so i like your line.

Time to bluff him out now

bluffing turn pretty dumb unless you are shoving river. i would just check down and expect to beat KQ or JT w/ no club. Folding flop is also wrong unless you have some sort of bet sizing tell. I expect this raise to not be a high flush all that often and you can prob get a stronger read on his turn bet by calling. 3betting is wrong though.

Originally Posted by nutsinho

bluffing turn pretty dumb unless you are shoving river. i would just check down and expect to beat KQ or JT w/ no club. Folding flop is also wrong unless you have some sort of bet sizing tell. I expect this raise to not be a high flush all that often and you can prob get a stronger read on his turn bet by calling. 3betting is wrong though.

So we either let him hit a boat or lose to T,7,8 or J higher flush at showdown time? I expected this nit(13/7) to fold the majority of his flop c/r range unless he had Ac or Jc.

You guys are wrong, because a small flush is better on this board than a small set.

Just because you can improve with the set, doesn't mean it's a better hand. If you can put more than 22% of non-flush hands in his range, small flush here is better than a set.

Drawing dead is not that bad as long as you're drawing dead against a small portion of his range. He only has a flush here maybe half of the time. Sometimes he has a flushdraw + pair, small set, etc.

With the turn bet we're turning our hand into a bluff.