KK 5xBB in MP, 5 Callers!

UTG+2 is 20/3.5 with a .54 af after 170 hands. No other read on him. What should I have done?


PokerRoom No-Limit Hold'em, $.50 BB (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver Cards)

SB ($51.40)
BB ($41.65)
UTG ($54.60)
UTG+1 ($42.50)
UTG+2 ($51.05)
Hero ($105.50)
MP2 ($49.50)
MP3 ($53.80)
CO ($14.35)
Button ($16.00)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with , .
2 folds, UTG+2 calls $0.50, Hero raises to $2.5, MP2 calls $2.50, 2 folds, Button calls $2.50, SB calls $2.25, BB calls $2, UTG+2 calls $2.

Flop: ($15) , , (6 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG+2 bets $10, Hero??.

Final Pot: $25

Raise to $30-$35.

Gotta put him to the test... see above.

Raise it up as others have said. Raise more preflop though.. Make it 3.5 to go.

Originally Posted by freechus9

Raise it up as others have said. Raise more preflop though.. Make it 3.5 to go.

I don't know, I think a 5x (more than potsized) bet was fine. I don't see any reason to announce our hand if we don't raise like this with other hands. Unless the table has been calling 5x raises easily prior to this.

Originally Posted by holdin2

Originally Posted by freechus9

Raise it up as others have said. Raise more preflop though.. Make it 3.5 to go.

I don't know, I think a 5x (more than potsized) bet was fine. I don't see any reason to announce our hand if we don't raise like this with other hands. Unless the table has been calling 5x raises easily prior to this.

5x is my standard raise. I will add limper tax if there is more than one caller in front of me, but UTG+2 was the only one so I made it $2.50. I have a pretty tight image and get a 50% fold rate to my pf raises. Yes, 50% of the time I raise pf, everyone folds! This is the 1st time I can recall in almost 20k hands of $50nl that I've had five callers to my pf raise...

Originally Posted by freechus9

Raise more preflop though.. Make it 3.5 to go.

Because in hindsight he got too many callers? His preflop was fine..

I don't know, I like to raise a lot. My standard is 4x on top plus one more for every limper. And if there are 6 seeing a flop after a raise...table might be a little looseygoosey.

Originally Posted by freechus9

I don't know, I like to raise a lot. My standard is 4x on top plus one more for every limper.

That's exactly what he did..

This bet worries me because villain stats are so nitty, especially post-flop (0.54 AF is LOW). I put him on 22,33, or AJ. I don't think this guy is ever betting a flush draw hard like this. I raise to $25 I think. A little wimpy I know, but it denies flush draw odds to the blinds (the button short-stack gets them no matter what you do) and as I said, I'm not worried about villain drawing. Fold to a push or a strong turn lead.

If people were folding as often as you said, then PF is fine. I just thought it was a little odd that there were 5 callers, that's all. My b.

When I say 50% fold rate to my pf raises, I mean over almost 20k hands, not this specific table. However, this table was no looser than the average table I play so I had no reason to think I'd get 5 callers.

OK, here's my thinking on this hand:

UTG +2 was 20/3.5. OK, pretty standard nit. However, .54 aggression factor is ridiculous. What that tells me is that this guy will bet only when he's got a good hand. Add to that the fact that he limped/called. What are the most likely hands this guy has? A low PP...22 or 33 most likely. Maybe AJ. With the board showing two hearts, any good player is going to hit this hard on the flop if they hit their set. Thus, I concluded he most likely hit his set based on his EP bet. On top of that, with 4 more players to act after me, I couldn't be sure that none of them had JJ, 22 or 33. AA would have re-raised with all of those callers so I ruled that out. So, taking that all into account, I folded. Unfortunately, nobody called his bet so I didn't see a showdown...sounds like most of you disagree with this fold though.

No, I like your reasoning.

$20

Originally Posted by Fnord

$20

why?

any raise here against these stacks commits us to the pot surely?
Any action from behind if we miniraise commits us to it to surely?

Im just pushing or folding i think.

have you heard that a whole bunch of players at 2+2 are boycotting pokerroom because they have some new rediculous rake scheme?

Please elaborate, it's where I play. Might be time for me to switch?

I am with miffed: Push it. Do you really think you could lay it down after an all-in rereraise? This is one of the situations the money is going to go in the pot anyway, no matter talking about the best line. If someone hit their set, or someone runners a flush, so be it.

If he's 20/3.5 he probably doesn't raise AJ, so that's got to be a likely holding (he'd fold any other jack here I think other than JJ - would he raise JJ, do you think?). However, 22 or 33 both make good sense - his bet is pretty substantial compared to the pot so clearly he wants drawing hands out, and he's confident enough to risk 20% of his stack against 4 unknowns (including the pre-flop raiser) - I think it's a good fold.

Originally Posted by biondino

If he's 20/3.5 he probably doesn't raise AJ, so that's got to be a likely holding (he'd fold any other jack here I think other than JJ - would he raise JJ, do you think?). However, 22 or 33 both make good sense - his bet is pretty substantial compared to the pot so clearly he wants drawing hands out, and he's confident enough to risk 20% of his stack against 4 unknowns (including the pre-flop raiser) - I think it's a good fold.

he might also like his TT too much....

Originally Posted by Galapogos

Please elaborate, it's where I play. Might be time for me to switch?

Yeah, I play there too. What's the deal?

Preflop good.

I raise flop to $30, fold to a push. 3.5% PFR means AA-JJ, AK, so rule those out. smells like 22 or 33, maybe AJ/TT to me. His bet would scare me but I can't laydown to that bet on that flop.

But I enjoy swinging like a monkey, too....

Originally Posted by cardsman1992

Preflop good.

I raise flop to $30, fold to a push. 3.5% PFR means AA-JJ, AK, so rule those out. smells like 22 or 33, maybe AJ/TT to me. His bet would scare me but I can't laydown to that bet on that flop.

But I enjoy swinging like a monkey, too....

you cant fold once you raise the pot odds say so.
A flush draw can push probably and be playing not so horribly.

Stack sizes, you're right...DOH!!

In that case, I takes my chances if he pushes....