Missplayed kings ?

Printable View

12-28-2005, 01:50 AM
fat-b

Missplayed kings ?

Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

MP3 ($254)
CO ($181.75)
Button ($538.15)
SB ($266.35)
BB ($243.55)
Hero ($312.10)
UTG+1 ($56.60)
UTG+2 ($99)
MP1 ($37.95)
MP2 ($257.20)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with K:diamond:, K:heart:.
Hero calls $2, 3 folds, MP2 calls $2, MP3 calls $2, CO calls $2, 1 fold, SB raises to $14, 1 fold, Hero calls $12, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO calls $12.

Flop: ($48) 6:club:, 7:heart:, 4:club: (3 players)
SB bets $48, Hero raises to $100, CO raises to $100, SB raises to $148, Hero calls $0.

Turn: ($396) A:club: (3 players)

River: ($396) 5:spade: (3 players)

Final Pot: $396

Results in white below:
SB has Js Jh (one pair, jacks).
Hero has Kd Kh (one pair, kings).
CO has 9c 7c (flush, ace high).
Outcome: CO wins $396.

Something strange with the converter, cant see its right, but here is the real result :

$3 is raked from a total pot of $720.45.
$3 is raked from the main pot of $551.25.
$0 is raked from side pot #1 of $169.20.
demas wins the main pot $548.25 with flush, ace high.
samemann wins the side pot $169.20 with a pair of kings.

--

I maby shoulda reraised preflop here, but i really didnt expekt a call from the late limper.

Any other way to play this hand ?? I reraised and showed power, but the guy with 9c7c pushed. And i was comitted. Knew i had the SB beat.
Turned out to be a huuge pot and the chaser won.
12-28-2005, 02:00 AM
Fnord

I rarely limp with KK from EP anymore. Heck, if I'm open-limping pre-flop it's because the game is so good that I've forgotten all about balance.

The second pre-flop decision is tough. You'd like to screw over AK/QQ/JJ post-flop and lose the least to AA. However, those 3 pesky limpers are getting a pretty good price to continue into what's certain to be a chip tossing contest on the flop. Hence I think you got to raise it up and hope you didn't run into AA.
12-28-2005, 02:00 AM
Symbolic

I'm re-raising with all the limpers. I think you know thats a good option. Once the flop comes down its hard to get away from You're pretty much pot commited after your raise on the flop, and the clubs are correct in going all in in that spot.
12-28-2005, 02:13 AM
WildBobAA

I definatly hate how you played it preflop. Were you looking to see a cheap flop so you make sure the A doesn't hit? If so, this will only cost you money in the long run since you will let so many weaker hands see a cheap flop and outdraw you. What if the SB just called? Then you're going to be seeing a 6-handed flop with KK which is a horrible situation to be in.

As for this hand, I'm not a big fan of getting all your money in a ring game after the flop on an unimproved AA or KK. I'm really surprised one of them didn't have a set. But I think you played it fine. The SB pot bet the flop which looks like an over pair and unless he has AA, you have him crushed. It's just unfortunate that Mr. chaser hit. After the flop, you're about 43% to win and Mr. Chaser is 52% to win so in that respect, you were both getting the correct odds to stick your stacks in there. And I can't really fault Mr. JJ from trying to protect his hand since there's no way he can put you or Mr. Chaser on a higher pair since he didn't get reraised PF.

So basically, I can't really fault how anyone played after the flop but if you had raised preflop, you would have been in a much easier situation.
12-28-2005, 02:16 AM
Fnord

Quote:

Originally Posted by WildBobAA

So basically, I can't really fault how anyone played after the flop but if you had raised preflop, you would have been in a much easier situation.

This could get ugly if he opened for $6 and got 4 callers and JJ decided to spew all over this flop.

Quote:

Originally Posted by WildBobAA

As for this hand, I'm not a big fan of getting all your money in a ring game after the flop on an unimproved AA or KK.

I am.
12-28-2005, 02:17 AM
fat-b

Agree that i shoulda reraised it. But as i said , didnt expect any calls from the limpers.
Any of you guys got the numbers in % after that flop?
12-28-2005, 02:19 AM
Fnord

Quote:

Originally Posted by fat-b

Any of you guys got the numbers in % after that flop?

For what it's worth...

903 games 0.005 secs 180,600 games/sec

Board: 6c 7h 4c
Dead:

equity (%) win (%) tie (%)
Hand 1: 42.8571 % 42.52% 00.33% { KdKh }
Hand 2: 52.2702 % 51.94% 00.33% { 9c7c }
Hand 3: 04.8726 % 04.54% 00.33% { JhJs }
12-28-2005, 02:20 AM
WildBobAA

http://img463.imageshack.us/img463/5783/odds5fi.jpg
12-28-2005, 02:22 AM
fat-b

Thanks. WildbobAA , where is that cute calc?
12-28-2005, 02:31 AM
WildBobAA

www.cardplayer.com
12-28-2005, 02:43 AM
KoRnholio

Yeah the only reason to limp KK/AA up front is so you can raise if and when the action gets back to you.

It seems no matter what size a bet/raise is, once one person cold-calls it, even more people just tag along hopeing to hit a lucky flop. So when the SB bumps it up you need to raise to isolate him and not let the rest of the table in with implied odds to crack your hand.
12-28-2005, 10:17 AM
Miffed22001

Quote:

Originally Posted by KoRnholio

Yeah the only reason to limp KK/AA up front is so you can raise if and when the action gets back to you.

It seems no matter what size a bet/raise is, once one person cold-calls it, even more people just tag along hopeing to hit a lucky flop. So when the SB bumps it up you need to raise to isolate him and not let the rest of the table in with implied odds to crack your hand.

Agreed
I dont know how big you pump this, im thinking $30/40 here to make him see the flop. I still get it all in on the flop though. I also think CO would be on my buddy list for getting invloved here while he certainly has big implied odds it smells very loose in big situations.
12-28-2005, 10:28 AM
r8ed

This is why I try to escalate preflop betting as much as possible with KK and pay off AA. He's raising 7xbb OOP so he's happy with his hand. Doubling his raise sounds good. If 97s still calls you are hosed regardless, but the reraise may deter him.
12-28-2005, 08:12 PM
bdawg56kg

I might be the first one to say that I actually like the way fat-b played this hand. Of course the safest and most conventional way to play this hand is to raise the $14 preflop bet to isolate, but the fact is that unless you've limp-reraised and shown down with other hands than AA/KK, then villian is going to have a very easy time getting away from his hand, or just call and hope to hit a set and double up. So you either win $20-$40 or lose $180. Villian raised 7xBB preflop, and most times that will only get 0-1 callers, so I don't blame fat-b for just smooth calling since there is a pretty good chance no one else will call. Calling will mask the strength of his hand and give him a very good chance at stacking villian on a raggedy flop. The third caller sucks, but is not that bad of a situation IMO.

On the flop, I would probably push or put in a big reraise, say to $150. That way the 97s guy knows he has no fold equity and for all he knows he could be up against a straight/set, and that if he calls he probably is behind and has to gamble to win. Just MHO, but I think a lot of the replies have been results oriented, so next time you should hold off on the results for a little while.
12-29-2005, 02:19 AM
KoRnholio

Quote:

Originally Posted by bdawg56kg

On the flop, I would probably push or put in a big reraise, say to $150. That way the 97s guy knows he has no fold equity and for all he knows he could be up against a straight/set, and that if he calls he probably is behind and has to gamble to win. Just MHO, but I think a lot of the replies have been results oriented, so next time you should hold off on the results for a little while.

Looking back, that line looks good also. Maybe I am just paranoid with my Kings.. 6000 hands of NL and I think I am still in the red with them. (Although this this could be an indication that I am tipping off my hand and/or not getting enough value out of them when they are good).