Cowboys OOP vs TAgg

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08-29-2006, 06:48 PM
Fnord

Cowboys OOP vs TAgg

My opponent is tight and likes to bet responable sized bets quite often.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Button ($166.10)
Fnord ($128.15)
BB ($100)
UTG ($122.55)
MP ($105.50)
CO ($87.45)

Preflop: Fnord is SB with Khttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif, Khttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif.
UTG raises to $4, MP calls $4, 1 fold, Button calls $4, Fnord raises to $15, 1 fold, UTG folds, MP calls $11, Button folds.

Flop: ($39) Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif, Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif, 3http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif (2 players)
Fnord checks, MP bets $15, Fnord calls $15.

Turn: ($69) Thttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif (2 players)
Fnord checks, MP bets $27, Fnord pushes
08-29-2006, 07:28 PM
Robert

I like it. Villian would bet more with a Q in his hand, and byjudging his actions I think he has some kind of medium PP most of the time here (like 88,99 or JJ)
08-29-2006, 08:04 PM
Miffs_mom

this is standard
08-29-2006, 09:56 PM
ilikeaces86

Fnord,
It make smuch more sense to check call here as you only get hands to that beat you to call here and all hands that you beat and are drawing very slim fold. You are much better off check calling this and check calling river or check calling this and leading and non ace river.
08-30-2006, 12:23 AM
drmcboy

Quote:

Fnord raises to $15

I really don't get this, especially given the way you proceed to play the hand.

agree with aces turn/river.
08-30-2006, 12:54 AM
NLHE lahooozaher

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert

I like it. Villian would bet more with a Q in his hand, and byjudging his actions I think he has some kind of medium PP most of the time here (like 88,99 or JJ)

So he folds out worse hands and gets called by AA/Qx/TT/33. What is it that's to like about that?
08-30-2006, 04:54 AM
Fnord

Quote:

Originally Posted by drmcboy

Quote:

Fnord raises to $15

I really don't get this, especially given the way you proceed to play the hand.

I'm out of position and there is already $13 in the pot. Taking it down right now wouldn't be terrible, I'm out of position and a re-raise clearly defines my hand. My raise is to an ammount few (if any) hands/players could call and expect to show a profit.

In addition, my balance hand here is air. With air I certainly would want to take it down pre-flop or with a flop bet.

Re: The Turn push

I think even guys like this call with worse hands here sometimes. Also AK having 7 outs made me not want to give him a river card.
08-30-2006, 11:07 AM
samsonite2100

The only worse hand I see calling there is JJ, maybe. I don't think this line is very good.
08-30-2006, 12:51 PM
Irisheyes

Quote:

Originally Posted by drmcboy

Quote:

Fnord raises to $15

I really don't get this, especially given the way you proceed to play the hand.

.

Why not? Whats the other option - call?
08-30-2006, 12:58 PM
jackvance

The only value I see in this play is if you want to look like a loose looney to get paid more often later.. in isolation almost no hand you beat calls.
08-30-2006, 01:38 PM
drmcboy

no, raise more. You have priced in A high, I don't know what you mean that most hands can't call. 2/1?
08-30-2006, 01:43 PM
samsonite2100

What, PF? Yeah that should be at least $20, no?
08-30-2006, 01:45 PM
Irisheyes

Oh ok. Yeah I suppose it could be bigger.
08-30-2006, 03:24 PM
Fnord

Quote:

Originally Posted by drmcboy

no, raise more. You have priced in A high, I don't know what you mean that most hands can't call. 2/1?

Ax needs to hit his Ace on a flop without a King and have it hold.
08-30-2006, 03:42 PM
drmcboy

I could explain the many other ways Ax could win, but I have more respect for you than you apparently do for me.

Code:

Hand 1: 29.7353 % 29.52% 00.22% { A2s+, A2o+ } Hand 2: 70.2647 % 70.05% 00.22% { KK }

the only mistake you're giving A high a chance to make is folding. Not to mention the problem you have when first opp calls and everyone else trails in.
08-30-2006, 03:54 PM
Fnord

Quote:

Originally Posted by drmcboy

I could explain the many other ways Ax could win, but I have more respect for you than you apparently do for me.

I don't take poker advice at face value. Why is the most important question and the work to get there is more important than the answer. I appologise is this appears confrontational.

Quote:

Originally Posted by drmcboy

Code:

Hand 1: 29.7353 % 29.52% 00.22% { A2s+, A2o+ } Hand 2: 70.2647 % 70.05% 00.22% { KK }

This is based on 7 card hands. Ax rarely gets past the flop. Also Ax has a high risk of getting stacked on AKx boards. One of the problems AK has in NL vs Limit is that it makes a lot of money when it turns and rivers Aces or Kings.

Quote:

Originally Posted by drmcboy

the only mistake you're giving A high a chance to make is folding. Not to mention the problem you have when first opp calls and everyone else trails in.

Yeah, the trailing issue is a real problem. On the other hand, so many of the guys in this pot play really terrible post-flop, so rather than just blow them out of the pot, I'd like to get a single caller (I was VERY surprised when it was this guy.) KK in a pot where I'm not folding any board without an Ace is very +EV for me against players who don't fold nearly often enough.

I thought about this a bit before putting in my raise and came up with $11 to go. I could be wrong...
08-30-2006, 04:05 PM
drmcboy

the plays you are making based on table reads obv I can't comment on.

You have a great chance of getting stacked on a 956 flop by 99 or 87, which more or less negates IMO the stacking you do on AKx board.

I really think a 20, even 25 raise gets called by one out of these three guys almost 100% of the time. If you are worried about blowing them out, the better solution is to open re raise range. This also gives you more stacking chances against TT on the 984 flop.
08-30-2006, 04:10 PM
Warpe

Quote:

Originally Posted by drmcboy

If you are worried about blowing them out, the better solution is to open re raise range.

lol. I don't think Fnord could open his reraise range much wider. I agree though, I'm making it at least $20 here preflop.
08-30-2006, 07:39 PM
Fnord

Quote:

Originally Posted by drmcboy

You have a great chance of getting stacked on a 956 flop by 99 or 87, which more or less negates IMO the stacking you do on AKx board.

They're calling off $11 of a $100ish stack. Good luck.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warpe

lol. I don't think Fnord could open his reraise range much wider.

...and I wonder why people play back at me so much...
08-30-2006, 09:09 PM
ilikeaces86

Fnord,
Consider the line I offered as I believe it is the superior line then get back to me.
08-31-2006, 03:15 PM
alias2211

Quote:

Originally Posted by ilikeaces86

Fnord,
It make smuch more sense to check call here as you only get hands to that beat you to call here and all hands that you beat and are drawing very slim fold. You are much better off check calling this and check calling river or check calling this and leading and non ace river.

i would agree w/ aces on this one. i look to check call another half-pot sized bet on the river. if he likes pot control, he isn't going to jam the pot on the river w/o a monster. and he also is more likely to make that 3rd bet himself than he is to call it (even the same amount he would have bet himself), so i would probably not lead even if it was a non ace river.

check call turn, check call river unless he shoves, then just fold.