QQ against massive push on flop

Printable View

11-26-2006, 04:20 PM
Da GOAT

QQ against massive push on flop

reads:opp would bet in position with little, even RR and call 4 gutshot but never did this.

EDIT: he limp/called PF many times with poor cards

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (8 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

UTG+1 ($9.65)
MP1 ($4.35)
MP2 ($48.25)
Hero ($46.85)
Button ($47.10)
SB ($28)
BB ($24.90)
UTG ($25.85)

Preflop: Hero is CO with Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif, Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif.
2 folds, MP1 calls $0.25, MP2 calls $0.25, Hero raises to $2, 3 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 calls $1.75.

Flop: ($4.60) 4http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif, 6http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif, 7http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif (2 players)
MP2 bets $46.25 (All-In), Hero calls $44.85 (All-In).

Turn: ($95.70) 8http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (2 players, 2 all-in)

River: ($95.70) Khttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (2 players, 2 all-in)

Final Pot: $95.70
11-26-2006, 04:33 PM
Warpe

Bleh...really read dependent. Sometimes call, sometimes fold. It's either a donkey with the nuts/set/2-pair/AA/KK, or not much.
11-26-2006, 04:46 PM
Da GOAT

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warpe

Bleh...really read dependent. Sometimes call, sometimes fold. It's either a donkey with the nuts/set/2-pair/AA/KK, or not much.

hmm yeah. from SNGs i figure him to have f'all. trips usually slowplay (actually i think i had a note thats what he does with them) so i put him on nothing much.

guy called same PF situation before with J9s betting a gutshot. but since he had never used the line before or could figure ive a PP since ive raised a good bit at the table.

ah well he had 76o. bit annoyed at myself for INSTACALLing and not thinking about it. i probably would of called anyway(based on reads) i guess TBH but should of at least gave it a sec.
11-26-2006, 05:40 PM
Rondavu

Is one pair worth 200xBB? The answer is rarely.
11-26-2006, 05:45 PM
Warpe

Quote:

Originally Posted by Da GOAT

from SNGs i figure him to have f'all.

Be wary about translating anyone's SNG play to their cash play.
11-26-2006, 07:36 PM
KoRnholio

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warpe

Quote:

Originally Posted by Da GOAT

from SNGs i figure him to have f'all.

Be wary about translating anyone's SNG play to their cash play.

QFT. In cash games there is no need to make massive all in bluffs like this to pick up chips. You're beat here about 90% of the time IMO. The only non-bluff hands you beat that *might* do this are pps 99-JJ.
11-27-2006, 03:56 AM
Da GOAT

ive slept on it. I should of folded :oops:

Im guessing that if there was some math to it then im probably not ahead often enough for this to be profitable (given this exact situation).

Balls, at least ive learned it early tho.

gotta read up and study (just telling myself)
11-27-2006, 04:02 AM
givememyleg

Even if you are ahead it isn't by much. Stacks are too deep here.
11-27-2006, 07:12 AM
nutsinho

yeah you shouldnt have revealed results so soon, but i would definitely say fold without seeing them. Youre never going to be in a dominating situation here unless he is really really horrible; the worst youll see is a pair +oesd where youre a tiny favorite. Otherwise youre smoked.
11-27-2006, 07:46 AM
Pants_101

Hey Goat you playing cash now? Me too, am 3 tabling the baby 0.2/0.5c tables. Gotta say I'm enjoying it more than SNG's now, I like to play after the flop and lag it up a bit.

My advice is from Sklanksy - big bets with big hands. An overpair is a good but not great hand.

If I can hijack slightly - I find the tables very tight pf, even small raises are often folded around. So I'm raising more in late position but tending to limp my big hands and so far it's working. Do you guys think this is a good adaptation to the table or should I still raise big hands and hope someone else has a hand to play against me? I can't tell what will make more long term.
11-27-2006, 07:54 AM
nutsinho

LOL at notation "0.2/0.5c"
11-27-2006, 08:04 AM
Da GOAT

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants_101

Hey Goat you playing cash now? Me too, am 3 tabling the baby 0.2/0.5c tables. Gotta say I'm enjoying it more than SNG's now, I like to play after the flop and lag it up a bit.

My advice is from Sklanksy - big bets with big hands. An overpair is a good but not great hand.

If I can hijack slightly - I find the tables very tight pf, even small raises are often folded around. So I'm raising more in late position but tending to limp my big hands and so far it's working. Do you guys think this is a good adaptation to the table or should I still raise big hands and hope someone else has a hand to play against me? I can't tell what will make more long term.

i 2 table, went with 3 but lost focus. ill play 2 till i adapt properly to FR
11-27-2006, 08:12 AM
Pants_101

Quote:

Originally Posted by nutsinho

LOL at notation "0.2/0.5c"

;-) What do you call them then?
11-27-2006, 08:19 AM
biondino

Unless the small blind really is one fifth of a penny, then your notation is wrong :)
11-27-2006, 08:20 AM
nutsinho

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants_101

Quote:

Originally Posted by nutsinho

LOL at notation "0.2/0.5c"

;-) What do you call them then?

the same if the blinds are really 1/5 and 1/2 of a cent
11-27-2006, 08:44 AM
Pants_101

oh yeah.... hmmmm err anyway! So like I say I'm playing the 2/5c tables...

*gets coat*
11-27-2006, 08:56 AM
nutsinho

thats not like you said at all...2c/5c= $.02/.05
11-27-2006, 09:06 AM
Pants_101

yeah I was playing the fool, guess it didn't come across. ;-) Thanks for the correction anyway

$.02/.05
$.02/.05
$.02/.05

I'm suprised how tight so many people are at these limits, is it the same at 25nl?
11-27-2006, 09:11 AM
Da GOAT

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants_101

yeah I was playing the fool, guess it didn't come across. ;-) Thanks for the correction anyway

$.02/.05
$.02/.05
$.02/.05

I'm suprised how tight so many people are at these limits, is it the same at 25nl?

i cant imagine they are, mmust be small sample. 25 NL is full pretty full with donks with occasional good player
11-27-2006, 09:30 AM
Pants_101

I'm seeing quite a lot of multi-tablers :shock: The donks seem to buy in small so they are not as appealing a target as the big stacks, although I'll happily stack them of course ;-) Anyway I've only played 5k hands so like you say could be a small sample
11-27-2006, 10:41 AM
gingerwizard

Ive been 2-tabling the $10NLs. Its so cool how you see the same players almost everytime you go on. PT and your own notes make it so much easier to read them and pwn them. E.g. got a great read off this guy who really over bets his TP hands and slow plays his sets, flushes etc. Stacked him four times this weekend and twice in an hour last night. Awesome.

I think the 10NL is a little looser but when its all regulars often $.40 raise gets folded around. You on stars pants?
11-27-2006, 10:46 AM
Warpe

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants_101

...but tending to limp my big hands and so far it's working. Do you guys think this is a good adaptation to the table or should I still raise big hands and hope someone else has a hand to play against me?

'splain what you mean by "big hands". If you're open limping overpairs/AK/AQ, don't.
11-27-2006, 11:26 AM
Pants_101

Yeah I'm on Stars Ginger, if I keep building my roll I'll move up to your stakes :-)

@warpe yes I have open limped AA KK and AK because I was fed up with raising with them and it folding round. I realise I'm causing some problems for myself on subsequent streets but I can let an overpair go if I think it's beat. But hey it might be a bad play, I just can't see how not getting any action can be good. I don't believe in absolute rules to play by as so many situations can arise but if someone can demonstrate that it's almost always better to raise big hands then thats cool.
11-27-2006, 11:46 AM
Warpe

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants_101

@warpe yes I have open limped AA KK and AK because I was fed up with raising with them and it folding round. I realise I'm causing some problems for myself on subsequent streets but I can let an overpair go if I think it's beat. But hey it might be a bad play, I just can't see how not getting any action can be good. I don't believe in absolute rules to play by as so many situations can arise but if someone can demonstrate that it's almost always better to raise big hands then thats cool.

*sighs*
There are a gajillion threads on here that explain why this is bad. Search for them and read them. You deserve every stacking you get by playing these hands in unraised pots and letting marginal hands hit the flop hard.
11-27-2006, 12:15 PM
Pants_101

Look what you say is fair enough, but if you think I'll easily commit my stack with top pair you underestimate me. Big pots are for big hands only, I generally want at least a set to play for my stack and that's still dependent on the board and the betting etc. All I'm saying is that at an exceptionally tight table might it not be ok to limp big starting hands, even though there is risk that you'll have to fold when someone starts betting big with a hand that would have folded to a raise pf. Or maybe raising more hands is the way to go so people are forced to loosen up against you and you get more action on big hands? I'm sorry if this is all old news to you regulars ;-) I just want to have some discussion, I'm not stupid just inexperienced :lol:
11-27-2006, 12:29 PM
Warpe

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants_101

Or maybe raising more hands is the way to go so people are forced to loosen up against you and you get more action on big hands?

This is a better line of thinking.
11-27-2006, 12:34 PM
Pants_101

Ok cool :-) I'll try this approach next time, seems to fit with the kind of style I'm trying for anyway
11-27-2006, 01:16 PM
Rondavu

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants_101

I was fed up with raising premium hands and it folding round

I have a friend who thinks this way. He never made it past min stakes.

Forget about trapping opponents you percieve to be smart, until you build big pots with big hands against opponents who are actually more stupider than you could ever imagine.

Acting weak when strong at low levels is EXTREMELY BAD POKER.
11-27-2006, 02:04 PM
jackvance

Yeah if they fold a lot, then raise more hands, that's standard play.
11-28-2006, 04:48 AM
Miffed22001

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants_101

yeah I was playing the fool, guess it didn't come across. ;-) Thanks for the correction anyway

$.02/.05
$.02/.05
$.02/.05

I'm suprised how tight so many people are at these limits, is it the same at 25nl?

stop playing on stars then...
11-28-2006, 06:24 AM
Pelion

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rondavu

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants_101

I was fed up with raising premium hands and it folding round

I have a friend who thinks this way. He never made it past min stakes.

Forget about trapping opponents you percieve to be smart, until you build big pots with big hands against opponents who are actually more stupider than you could ever imagine.

Acting weak when strong at low levels is EXTREMELY BAD POKER.

QFT

Also. If raising AA works at 100NL+ then it sure as hell will work at 10NL

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:34 AM.

Image resizer by SevenSkins