"Good day to be alive Sir, Good day to be alive" h

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08-19-2007, 12:28 AM
phantom_lord

"Good day to be alive Sir, Good day to be alive" h

villain is a reg from another forum i post on, usually plays 200 but is running bad, i have him as 24/12/1.8, raises c-bets a lot, we played a similiar hand last night, where i raised pf, c-bet a two tone 224 board, he made it 20, i made it 60 and he said folded 10s.

pretty sure he had air in the last hand, and don't expect him to have anything here, i'm kinda hoping he does a sick 3bet bluff...

so i go for a reverse yeti?

Noble Poker 0.50/1.00, hand converted by the iPoker Converter at Talking-Poker

saw flop | saw showdown

Button phantom_lord ($158.65)
SB ($12.90)
BB BB ($191.85)
UTG ($275.38)
UTG+1 ($181.55)
CO ($108.70)

Preflop: phantom_lord is on the Button with Q :club: K :spade:
3 folds, phantom_lord raises to 4.00, 1 fold, BB calls 3.00.

Flop (8.50) Q :heart: Q:diamond: Q:spade:
BB checks, phantom_lord bets 7.00, BB raises to 20.00, phantom_lord raises to 53.00,

thoughts? i made it 60 total, the converter is weird.
08-19-2007, 12:46 AM
EzDuzIt

i think you should just call and let him hit a boat which he will probably stack off with or just for him to think he can bluff you off on the turn or river which imo is a lot more probable then him shoving over this as a bluff on the flop.
08-19-2007, 01:33 AM
snowbird4life

Quote:

Originally Posted by EzDuzIt

i think you should just call and let him hit a boat which he will probably stack off with or just for him to think he can bluff you off on the turn or river which imo is a lot more probable then him shoving over this as a bluff on the flop.

QFT

Don't count on a sick 3 bet bluff by villain lol, even given the history which is at best being really hopeful. Just play it standard.
08-19-2007, 01:39 AM
phantom_lord

just play it like i have a Q?
08-19-2007, 02:31 AM
EzDuzIt

Quote:

Originally Posted by phantom_lord

just play it like i have a Q?

more hands than just a Q would do that.
and most villans are never going to give you credit for quads anyways.
08-19-2007, 10:53 AM
|~|ypermegachi

i think i like the 3bet.
08-19-2007, 10:59 AM
Pelion

I just call. He wont stack off without a high PP anyway and high PPs dont have many scare cards. let him fire again when an A or K doesnt hit.
08-19-2007, 11:09 AM
|~|ypermegachi

the problem with calling is it make your hand face up. "you have a pocket pair...oh wait, you raised me on the turn, i can't call without AA/KK"

3betting the flop puts a bluff in your range.
08-19-2007, 12:18 PM
Galapogos

Your read says he'll raise c-bets lightly, but you do really think he is capable of bluffing a 150+bbs eff stack off?
08-19-2007, 01:06 PM
Ash256

I think it's awesome.
08-19-2007, 01:24 PM
Vi-Zer0Skill

IMO he won't have 10-10+, since he didn't 3bet preflop. Therefore if he does have a pocket pair he probably isn't going to put another bet in on the turn/river, because it is probably a small one.

Given the fact that villain is aggressive postflop (frequently raises c-bets), a 4bet bluff is at least possible.

Basically, since we most likely won't be able to get a weaker made hand to put more money in the pot, and the fact that this player is aggressive postflop, a 3bet by Hero is probably the best way to maximize EV.
08-19-2007, 03:42 PM
EzDuzIt

lol by calling we dont make our hand face up. a queen could do anything here anyways. and we could be calling with more than just a big pp here.
lets not forget that the villan probably sucks and isnt a good hand reader anyways.
also what reason do we have to think that he will bluff? hes a passive player 24/12/1.8 and the other hand we had on him said that he folded 1010 on 244 to a reraise. doesnt seem like the type to 4bet bluff here lol.
and if he is just raising you lightly here i think there is a lot higher chance he continues with it if you just call compared to the small chance of him 4betting this really lightly. also i think he calls down a lot more lightly if we just calls this flop compared to what he is going to call this 3bet with.
08-19-2007, 05:10 PM
Numbr2intheWorld

I actually like a small 3-bet since he's not continuing with anything but pp's on the turn anyway. He'll be hard pressed to fold a boat and eventually find himself really pot commited.
08-20-2007, 12:16 AM
phantom_lord

Quote:

Originally Posted by EzDuzIt

lol by calling we dont make our hand face up. a queen could do anything here anyways. and we could be calling with more than just a big pp here.

yeah, but i think if i raise he's gonna give me less respect, and certainly take the q out of my range,

Quote:

lets not forget that the villan probably sucks and isnt a good hand reader anyways.

nah he's good.

Quote:

also what reason do we have to think that he will bluff? hes a passive player 24/12/1.8 and the other hand we had on him said that he folded 1010 on 244 to a reraise. doesnt seem like the type to 4bet bluff here lol.

he's more agro than those stats suggest, at least in spots where he can take down pots with aggression. he didn't fold 1010 in that other hand, he said he did! i think he's capable of a bluff here.

Quote:

and if he is just raising you lightly here i think there is a lot higher chance he continues with it if you just call compared to the small chance of him 4betting this really lightly. also i think he calls down a lot more lightly if we just calls this flop compared to what he is going to call this 3bet with.

in the other hands where he raised my cbet he just gave up on the turn and river. i think a small chance of him shoving here is worth sacrificing the chance of getting AT MOST another bet from him if i just call.

he hasn't got 1010+ here since he just called pf, and he's not some random stooopid fish who i'm gonna zeebo pwn when he can't fold 55 or something.
08-20-2007, 12:22 AM
phantom_lord

Quote:

Originally Posted by |~|ypermegachi

3betting the flop puts a bluff in your range.

exactly!
08-20-2007, 01:27 AM
snowbird4life

I mostly agree with what Zeroskill said, "IMO he won't have 10-10+, since he didn't 3bet preflop. Therefore if he does have a pocket pair he probably isn't going to put another bet in on the turn/river, because it is probably a small one. " (if any pp).

My point is that: is he going to continue with his bluff? Do you think hes capable of 4bet bluffing bc he thinks your 3 bet bluffing? It seems pretty likely he is not on that solid of a hand so why 3bet him? Why not let him hang himself on the turn? I just think your going to get more value by calling than 3betting and hopeing for a 4bet bluff. Just because 3betting the flop puts a slight chance of some sort of bluff in your range, doesn't mean hes going to have the balls to 4bet bluff with air. I think the real question is if you are almost sure he is capable and will likely 4bet bluff. If your sure of this (seems unlikely) than this is fine. Otherwise, i think you get more value by just calling.
08-23-2007, 02:04 AM
phantom_lord

he timed down and typed "will u fold to an ai" before folding.

as it happened he posted up the hand at the same time on another forum!

it's down atm so i can't quote what he said exactly. but it was along the lines that he thought i was making a move and he should have shoved, and actually regretted that he didn't.

i think if he hadn't been running bad and had been a bit more confident i could have gotten his stack here, esp. since he never figured me for a q.