400NL A-Qo

Villain is a competent TAG. Has been quite aggressive.

I think i should have check/folded the turn, but is river an easy check/fold?

Hero: ($426.20 in chips)
Villain: ($546.60 in chips)
4 other players

*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero: [Qh As]
Hero: raises $12 to $16
Villain: calls $16
4 folds
*** FLOP *** [3h 2h 7c]
Hero: bets $28
Villain: calls $28
*** TURN *** [3h 2h 7c] [Ad]
Hero: checks
Villain: bets $68
Hero: calls $68
*** RIVER *** [3h 2h 7c Ad] [Qs]
Hero: checks
Villain: bets $268 (small overbet)
Hero: ?

I don't see how you aren't calling...seems like you set villain up to bluff and you have top 2. What is your question?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mixchange

I don't see how you aren't calling...seems like you set villain up to bluff and you have top 2. What is your question?

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Question: "is river an easy check/fold?"

Fact: top two pair is as good as A-4 here.

Quote:

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Fact: top two pair is as good as A-4 here.

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FACT: Your fact is not a fact.

i'm confused.

bet turn. bet river. as played call.

I bet this turn, but I don't mind a c/r either, don't like the c/c unless you know he'll bluff a blank river. As played I call the river overbet.

Okay, it is certainly possible that i just am stupid and am not thinking this through correctly. Here's what i was thinking:

Villain's range on...

the flop
8-8 - 10-10
Flush draw/4-5
occasionally a set

the turn
Flush draw
Flush draw with Ah
straight
occasionally a set

the river
missed flush
straight
set



mixchange i don't see villain having any two pair at any point in this hand. What two pair hands do you think he could have?


If the river bet wasn't an overbet i would have called.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vi-Zer0Skill

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mixchange

I don't see how you aren't calling...seems like you set villain up to bluff and you have top 2. What is your question?

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Question: "is river an easy check/fold?"

Fact: top two pair is as good as A-4 here.

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seriously? and here my first instinct was to c/r this river.. hmmm

I really don't see how we can fold here. I would have expected a set to raise this flop, and as played we let villain bluff a possible missed FD on two streets.

I guess villain could have 45, so a check call is better than a c/r, but i don't see how we can fold.

i think bet/fold the turn is the best line, since i am not getting any more value out of mid pairs by checking anyways.


And i charge draws, and make the hand easier to play.

you're still beating A2, A3, and A7...

I dont see how you can fold this river. As played, i call.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Massimo

you're still beating A2, A3, and A7...

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i don't think a TAG calls my UTG open with A-x without someone else having called in front of him.

Ah Qh is the only possible two pair combination that i could see villain holding here, but even then i think he might 3bet preflop.

i think we need to know about how villain plays a pair and a set etc before we can consider how we should play the turn and river.
I think calling here is bad because our hand is so clear and hes overbetting despite our line.

How is our hand so clear? I get to the river like this with KK- alot against aggro villains, and sometimes with draws. I'm not folding this hand.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by HalvSame

How is our hand so clear? I get to the river like this with KK- alot against aggro villains, and sometimes with draws. I'm not folding this hand.

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im beginning to reconsider now you mention it.
Why did we not bet turn fwiw. surely we have to follow through here to be able to fire enough two barrels?

i still think my hand is essentially a bluff catcher. If anyone can give a well reasoned explanation for how villain could be holding A-2/A-3/A-7/A-Q, i will certainly stand corrected. I will concede that Ah-Qh is a possibility, but even then i think villain would tend to 3bet preflop.

i agree with everyone that says i should have bet the turn. This will be my default play in the future, as it makes the hand much easier to play and i charge draws etc.

What do you guys think an overbet generally means, seriously? When i see an overbet, i generally assume that it's the nuts or a near nut hand. Is this less often the case as you move up in limits?

i haven't folded this in probably a year or so

as played i d be fistpumping as I check raised the river AI

also he could be bluffing!

consider betting turn at least with some frequency

as played i like the c/c c/c line on turn and river. You obviously must call the river. You have an unlikely big hand vs an aggressive player when most of the draws bricked, in a spot where he could very easily have turned a flopped overpair into a bluff.

Okay, since its literally unanimous that i should be calling this river bet, i assume no one is too concerned about the overbet by this opponent.

I guess checking the turn to induce a bluff is okay against an aggressive opponent, but in general i think bet/folding the turn is best. Particulary because, like miffed said, i would probably fire the turn with a hand like Q-J.

By check/raising the turn, i think we allow this aggressive villain to let go of a drawing hand so i think i like check/calling the turn and check/calling a non heart river.

I learned a ton from everyones comments in this thread, which is worth (in the long run) the embarrassment in admitting that i actually folded.

y isnt A3 A2 A7 a big part of his range?

I don't see tags calling A-rag UTG+1 very often at all.

Why would he want to overbet this river?Seems more like a busted draw.I would have betted the turn, and c/c river.I think betting the turn would make play this river more easy.

this hand was also played pretty goofy by both parties.

its not a terrible fold for sure, but i think calling is better