check/shove always?

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10-22-2007, 11:19 PM
|~|ypermegachi

check/shove always?

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (6 handed) http://www.flopturnriver.com/reviews/Online-Poker-PartyPoker.php#converter]Party Poker[/url] Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

CO ($166.06)
Button ($210)
SB ($249.25)
Hero ($532.50)
UTG ($273.96)
MP ($148.85)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Ahttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif, 5http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif.
2 folds, CO raises to $6, 1 fold, SB calls $5, Hero calls $4.

Flop: ($18) Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif, 8http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, 2http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif (3 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, CO bets $16, SB folds, Hero ...
10-22-2007, 11:50 PM
Fnord

Money is too deep. I would just call here unless he's terrible.

Against a tourist in a live game, I'd make it $50 and shove any turn card expecting a loose call on the flop and a tight fold on the turn.
10-22-2007, 11:55 PM
|~|ypermegachi

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fnord

Money is too deep. I would just call here unless he's terrible.

Against a tourist in a live game, I'd make it $50 and shove any turn card expecting a loose call on the flop and a tight fold on the turn.

i actually folded like a little pansy...

but then i thought...what does he have? i stoved it afterwards...

vs 99+ we have 42% equity
vs 99+,AJs+,KQs,AJo+ we are 43%
vs QQ,88,22 we're 25%

it almost seems like shoving would be a very high variance play which is very slimly +EV...
10-22-2007, 11:58 PM
Fnord

Folding here is terrible.

If he's going to call a re-raise with any two, then fold a lot of hands on the turn, that's the play. Given that it's online, c/r for balance sounds good, but puts us in a really shitting turn spot if called. c/c is reasonable.
10-23-2007, 12:05 AM
IowaSkinsFan

Wow you reverse fished that one, seriously how does anyone fold a flush draw teach me.

Oh btw i call.
10-23-2007, 12:16 AM
Numbr2intheWorld

i raise here... a shove seems excessive though.
10-23-2007, 12:39 AM
|~|ypermegachi

Quote:

Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan

seriously how does anyone fold a flush draw teach me.

oh, just play with scared money ;)
10-23-2007, 12:42 AM
griffey24

Quote:

Originally Posted by |~|ypermegachi

i actually folded like a little pansy...

I don't get it.. you folded to just the flop bet?...

c/r here is good.. but at the very least call!
10-23-2007, 12:45 AM
bigspenda73

I don't like a c/r and I don't like a lead.

I c/c and lead turns where I hit and perhaps c/r the right turn card that missed my hand as well.
10-23-2007, 10:38 PM
Jack Sawyer

Quote:

Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan

Wow you reverse fished that one, seriously how does anyone fold a flush draw teach me.

Oh btw i raise to at least $49,99.

fyp
10-23-2007, 10:57 PM
bode

folding here is disgusting. flat call, but a c/r is sexy sometimes.
10-24-2007, 12:13 AM
benny999

i raise for sure on this board, like 50-60.
10-24-2007, 12:25 AM
NLHE lahooozaher

Why is leading here bad? I'm trying to get better with my nut flush draw hands and am very curious.
10-24-2007, 12:27 AM
Deanglow

I lead the flop and push over a raise expecting a fold most of the time. Playing OOP with a FD is not fun.
10-24-2007, 12:28 AM
silu73

Calling sounds good but c/raising is better. Folding is just aargh.
10-24-2007, 12:37 AM
|~|ypermegachi

yeah yeah...enough with the folding!! i know it was teh crappy!
10-24-2007, 01:16 AM
benny999

Quote:

Originally Posted by NLHE lahooozaher

Why is leading here bad? I'm trying to get better with my nut flush draw hands and am very curious.

leading is good, but with relative position i tend to check any hand...it's fun if it goes bet, call, raizzzz.
10-24-2007, 01:50 AM
NLHE lahooozaher

Quote:

Originally Posted by benny999

Quote:

Originally Posted by NLHE lahooozaher

Why is leading here bad? I'm trying to get better with my nut flush draw hands and am very curious.

leading is good, but with relative position i tend to check any hand...it's fun if it goes bet, call, raizzzz.

So you're content to c/r here? Why would you raise here if everybodys advocating to call HU? I also thought it was HU on the flop, is leading better if it's HU to the flop?
10-24-2007, 01:55 AM
benny999

i don't understand - only a few are saying call and i didn't see anything about being HU.

if it was HU i still prob c/r but think it matters less between that and leading and calling.
10-24-2007, 03:08 AM
NLHE lahooozaher

I was thinking bet/3bet not bet/call. Thoughts?

Quote:

i don't understand - only a few are saying call and i didn't see anything about being HU.

Maybe I just saw a few people say call and they said it a couple times. I thought it was heads up, just my bad.

Thanks and sorry for slightly hijacking here.
10-24-2007, 09:26 AM
Chopper

i'm confused as to why, Hyper, you are saying you "play with scared money," yet want to shove $160+ into a $20 pot?

and, why you are sitting so deep when scared? why didnt you leave the table when 150-200 bb's deep?
10-24-2007, 09:37 AM
|~|ypermegachi

i just moved up, so i'm still not entirely comfortable "gambling," but after i folded i thought wtf, i would never do that at 100, and then realized what a good opportunity to check raise it woulda been. then i just took it one step further, that pushing 100bb we're pretty much breaking even, which makes raising probably the most +EV play.
10-24-2007, 11:01 AM
Ash256

b/3b AI seems really sexy, but it puts us in such a shitty spot if he calls our flop lead and the turn blanks... eurgh
10-24-2007, 02:45 PM
Ravageur

This seems like a pretty standard c/raise to 50/call shove or bet/3-bet or if called on flop pot turn/call shove hand :) (guy has less than 100 bbs right? Get iT IN)

This is a pretty failproof/oversimplified way to play big hands oop but it's difficult to adjust against.

I don't like check/calling because i don't like checkraising the turn all in with a lot less fold equity than on the flop (what made hand can we have in this spot from villain's perspective - especially if we have a TAG image like hyper?) and checkfolding the turn is very very silly especially if we turn a gutshot or something cute. Also if we make the nuts we don't always get paid off.
10-24-2007, 05:27 PM
|~|ypermegachi

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravageur

(what made hand can we have in this spot from villain's perspective - especially if we have a TAG image like hyper?)

my image is a 16/14 nit...this is way tighter than i'd like to be, and hopefully as i get more desensitized i'll loosen back to the 21/16 i used to be.
10-24-2007, 05:35 PM
djzcko

Lead is good. Fold is bad. Fold is terrible actually. C/R is cool. C/C you might as well play with your cards face up. Bottom line is you gotta mix it up--you can't lead or C/R every time you have a made hand. With a lead, you can better define villains hand. If you C/C you are telling him you have a flush draw. C/R puts some doubt into villains mind about the strength of your hand.