QQ with history

MP is 30/20, he minraises a lot. I've 3bet him twice before, both times I took the pot down preflop. The second of those hands was the hand directly before this one.

SB is a regular TAG. He likes to 3bet me a decent amount and I usually fold pretty quick. We had a hand earlier in the session where I open raised in the SB, he reraised on his BB, I 4bet and got AI and my AK sucked out on his KK.

Here's the hand,

200NL, stacks are $225. MP open minraises, I RR to $20 from the CO. Folds to SB who makes it $66. MP folds, I do what?

i fold. u need like 40% equity and i bet he just calls with JJ-. <3 if he has like J4s.

Why'd you make it 20 pre? I think whatever you do it pretty marginal.

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Originally Posted by Massimo

Why'd you make it 20 pre? I think whatever you do it pretty marginal.

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MP's an idiot, he'll call $16 more with anything he'll call $12 more with. Might as well get as much in as I can while I'm sure my hand is good vs his range.

So you shove for metagame?

I could only see myself calling here for set value but given that there is already so much in the pot you would need to go broke if neither an A or K is flopping. I don't mind a fold either.

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Originally Posted by Irisheyes

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Originally Posted by Massimo

Why'd you make it 20 pre? I think whatever you do it pretty marginal.

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MP's an idiot, he'll call $16 more with anything he'll call $12 more with. Might as well get as much in as I can while I'm sure my hand is good vs his range.

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Well you said he folded twice before, so i thought he might be tight against them. But if he';s gonna call 20 the same amount as 16 then do it.

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So you shove for metagame?

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No, i don't like shoving. I really just want to call but the pot would be too big already. Folding is probably the best choice since i don't know if he'll bluff this spot and i doubt he has JJ.

snap shove for value wtf? are these games that nitty?

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Originally Posted by sauce123

snap shove for value wtf? are these games that nitty?

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yes

and max if you think its marginal either way id rather shove then fold. If you think folding is better than shoving say it.

seriously if this is even MAYBE a fold you should be running over these games to an absurd extent

(actually in my upcoming video i play 30/26 at 1/2 and consider it kinda tight)

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Originally Posted by sauce123

seriously if this is even MAYBE a fold you should be running over these games to an absurd extent

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Yeah, I make almost all my money playing no showdown poker in these games. The issue here is that if you totally LAgg it up, the other players will adapt. I had a +20 buy-in stretch where my expected all-in value wasn't much higher than $200 and the actual results were something like -$300.

ya don t mean to get up on sauce's nuts or anything but I 4-bet preflop in this spot quite a bit with a pretty wide range (pp's, Axs, crapola) when I was playing 1-2 and saw ppl doing crazy shit like tanking with KK, claiming they folded QQ etc...

Kind of pointless to post I suppose since there's no reason to think villain here is getting out of line. Previous hand where you got AI with teh nutz makes me want to call cuz he may be tilting or overplaying.

what do you do here if you are villain and you see Irish 3-bet the donk for the 3rd time and you have AJ+? Fold?

Doesn't seem like that would be very good... also calling kind of sux with 99 or AQ... so I can see this being a 4-bet with a worse hand

Id probably never fold Axs preflop ever in these games after reading this thread

or 22, 33 cause when u stack AK with them for some reason it tilts ppl so gooooooodddd

sauce/fnord/genitruc, the game I'm in are basically full of guys who are loose passive pf and stations post flop with a few preflop nits who have some notion what they are doing thrown in. FE is not in abundance. My reaction to this has basically been to tighten up preflop because I just found that I was spewing post with cbets and the like just getting called down.

An I wrong?

i don t think you re wrong at all if you re looking to play taggy in these games

having played them myself quite a bit, I'd suggest using a counter-play style

cut down on c bets and limp behind a ton

every flop you see cheaply with any two cards is +ev vs these guys if you just wait around and consistently get the money in with big draws and 2pr +

QQ is deffenatly good enough to 5bet/shove