Is this bad application to max's 55 equity thread?

Villain is pretty donkish, and i want to see if this is a good application of max's theory with the 55 equity thing.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (5 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Button ($129.20)
SB ($33.15)
BB ($60.75)
UTG ($96)
Hero ($93.50)

Preflop: Hero is MP with 4http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, 4http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif.
1 fold, Hero raises to $4, 1 fold, SB raises to $12, 1 fold, Hero raises to $93.5, SB calls $21.15 (All-In).

Flop: ($67.30) Khttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif, Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif (2 players, 1 all-in)

Turn: ($67.30) Thttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif (2 players, 1 all-in)

River: ($67.30) 6http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (2 players, 1 all-in)

Final Pot: $67.30

Don't do this in the games you play, people don't threebet nearly light enough and there's not enough metagame to warrant it.

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Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan

Don't do this in the games you play, people don't threebet light at all pretty much ever and even when they do it's cause they're maniacs and not good regs and there's almost 0 metagame to warrant it.

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At what stakes does this become good? 400nl+? Just curious.

its not all that good at any stakes

Axs is better. Better yet, 4b/folding for 30 with a trash hand like 65o would be better.

4bet bluffs don't have to be all ins.

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Originally Posted by Trainer_jyms

4bet bluffs don't have to be all ins.

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I see most people 2-2.5X the 3-bet when 4-betting, what size is good and why? I am sure different effective stacks cause for different sizes.

uhh you need FE, which you don't have here.

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Originally Posted by Renton

its not all that good at any stakes

Axs is better. Better yet, 4b/folding for 30 with a trash hand like 65o would be better.

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why is Axs better? Did you see me thread about equity against preflop stack off ranges? 55 has better equity than Axs against every range.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Massimo

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Renton

its not all that good at any stakes

Axs is better. Better yet, 4b/folding for 30 with a trash hand like 65o would be better.

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why is Axs better? Did you see me thread about equity against preflop stack off ranges? 55 has better equity than Axs against every range.

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the combos of AK and AA that Axs removes from his range (thus he is folding more), probably more than makes up for the 5% equity edge that 55 has.

Also, 55 often probably has flatcall potential that Axs doesn't.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Renton

the combos of AK and AA that Axs removes from his range (thus he is folding more), probably more than makes up for the 5% equity edge that 55 has.

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Pokerstove doesn't take this into account?

im talking about the width of his calling range, not the equity vs it.

Yeah obv the width is smaller because one A is gone... but does pstove not take this into account?

yeah, it does. But im talking about how often he folds. If the girth of his calling range (QQ+ AK or similar) has one less ace in its combinations, I'm pretty sure that gonna be significant with regard to how often he folds to our shove.

hmmm has anyone done that calculation?

I'm pretty sure the whole flat call potential reasoning with pp's is the reason Axs are advocated as shoves rather than pp's.

this wasnt good because you didnt have enough folding equity.

and i think a hand like 55 is slightly better than Axs for these kinds of plays.