Two hands 10nl: Pocket Queens

No real read on opponent. I did not 4bet since I would have position post flop(I try to 4bet QQ+ and AK if I wont have position after flop is this good or no?)
He took a long long time to bet flop, I called with the plan to bet almost any turn card if checked to. Is this an appropriate line? Turn bet could have been larger I know

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (5 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

MP ($6.10)
Hero ($9.85)
SB ($14.20)
BB ($17.30)
UTG ($17)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif, Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif.
2 folds, Hero raises to $0.4, 1 fold, BB raises to $1, Hero calls $0.60.

Flop: ($2.05) 2http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif, 5http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, Ahttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif (2 players)
BB bets $1.1, Hero calls $1.10.

Turn: ($4.25) 3http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $3

Ugh fuck this no reads. I want to call so incredibly bad, but I figure I am either facing a set or a combo draw or both. What do I have odds to call?
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (5 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver Cards)

BB ($4.20)
Hero ($11.80)
MP ($16.05)
Button ($15.15)
SB ($16.90)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/.../smiles/qs.gif, http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/.../smiles/qh.gif.
Hero raises to $0.4, MP calls $0.40, Button calls $0.40, SB calls $0.35, BB calls $0.30.

Flop: ($2) http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/.../smiles/8h.gif, http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/.../smiles/5s.gif, http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/.../smiles/3s.gif (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $1.5, MP folds, Button raises to $14.75, SB raises to $16.5, BB folds, Hero ?!!!!

hand one doesnt make sense ... why are you betting the turn? What are you representing? Are you bluffing or are you value betting? I'm not quite sure you even know.

While it's necessary to 4bet AK oop, i would just get in the habit of doing it at all times anyways. same w/ qq. only times you dont wanna do it is when villain is too nitty to stack off w/ worse preflop, but will stack off w/ like TT or JJ on a low board.

hand two ... w/ this many playres and this much action i guarantee at least one of them has a set. easy fold

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Marshall28

hand one doesnt make sense ... why are you betting the turn? What are you representing? Are you bluffing or are you value betting? I'm not quite sure you even know.

hand two ... w/ this many playres and this much action i guarantee at least one of them has a set. easy fold

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Marshall28

hand one doesnt make sense ... why are you betting the turn? What are you representing? Are you bluffing or are you value betting? I'm not quite sure you even know.

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Well I know he doesn't have an Ace here. And I know he is scared of the Ace. I think I am representing the Ace because that is what he is scared of. Anyone with an ace who is 3 betting pf will be the turn. So he doesn't have an Ace so I must or else why would I call a 4bet.

At least that was my logic.

Just check behind 1 and call reasonable river bets. You can even sometimes bet river when checked to.

Hand 2 easy fold, be glad you got away cheap.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ProZachNation

Well I know he doesn't have an Ace here. And I know he is scared of the Ace. I think I am representing the Ace because that is what he is scared of.

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Why do you want to represent an A. If you rep and A then he will call with better hands and fold worse hands. The only thing you might successfully bluff is a really weak A and its unlikely he'll fold it anyway.

Your bet looks more like a value bet for the times he has a draw, but you probably see a weak A as often (and with less equity) so Id look to showdown cheap.

hand 1: i check through sometimes and bet sometimes to take it down when villain is scared of the Ace. I dont mind taking down a 40bb pot here without a showdown.

hand 2: easy fold. you only invested 19bb and one of them definitly has a set. be glad they played it like this and allowed you to get away cheap.

Hand 2: Would anything change if the 8h was an 8s? Basically, my question is there a big difference between having AA nfd vs QQ/KK overpair & semi-nfd.

Edit: Actually, the decision is probably affected by the number of people in the pot, but what if it was only HU and hero was facing a shove?

wtf are you doing in hand 1? without insane reads its going to be a bad idea to bluff when there is only one hand between what you are representing and what you actually have. would you also have bet this turn with kings? if so, then you really need to think more about what might be accomplished by the bets you make

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ProZachNation

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Marshall28

hand one doesnt make sense ... why are you betting the turn? What are you representing? Are you bluffing or are you value betting? I'm not quite sure you even know.

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Well I know he doesn't have an Ace here. And I know he is scared of the Ace. I think I am representing the Ace because that is what he is scared of. Anyone with an ace who is 3 betting pf will be the turn. So he doesn't have an Ace so I must or else why would I call a 4bet.

At least that was my logic.

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your logic is like ... backwards. ... 1st of all, you can't by any means determine that an ace is out of his range. 2nd ... if he doesnt have an ace, why are you trying to scare him out of the pot? you beat everything except KK which is an extremely unlikely holding.

to assume he always bets the turn w/ an ace is a mistake.

you have a strong hand if he doesnt have an ace which crushes the rest of his range, so don't scare him away, keep the pot smaller so u can get value from him on the river