How play those rivers?

Hand #1

Villain is very loose preflop, probably donkish postflop. I don't know what his lead on flop means (but it's weak hand/draw most of the time), so I make small raise, with intention of betting brick turn, and checking behind with Ad draw if it flushes.

River gives me top two but I get insta-potted. His turn check was instant, too. Show it down?

BossMedia Game #1091651537: Table Table TH 932 - $0.05/$0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 21:23:27 - 2008/05/22
Seat 2: Kreozot ($11.78)
Seat 3: Afator ($1.85)
Seat 4: fifa1 ($13.60)
Seat 5: puffmutti ($12.02)
Seat 6: jeppesa ($8.94)
Seat 7: Sleieri ($10.00)
Seat 8: miyonety ($9.33)
Seat 9: _Vrax_ ($9.87)
Seat 10: flexal2 ($13.07)
flexal2 posts the small blind of $0.05
Kreozot posts the big blind of $0.10
_Vrax_ is the button
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to _Vrax_ [:Kc: :Ad:]
Afator folds
fifa1 folds
puffmutti folds
_Vrax_ raises $0.28
flexal2 calls $0.28
Kreozot calls $0.28
*** FLOP *** [9d 3d As]
flexal2 bets $0.63
Kreozot folds
_Vrax_ raises $1.26
flexal2 calls $1.26
*** TURN *** [:9d: :3d: :As:] [:6d:]
flexal2 checks
_Vrax_ checks
*** RIVER *** [:9d: :3d: :As: :6d:] [:Kh:]
flexal2 bets $3.36

Hand #2

vs 42/2/2.7 with infinity river aggression over small sample

After villains flop blocker, there was big chance he hit piece with his SC, or flopped draw. After getting his odds turn-fucked, he leads scary river for 1/3 pot. Show it down?

BossMedia Game #1091683459: Table Turbo TH 57 - $0.05/$0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 21:43:48 - 2008/05/22
Seat 1: Vilem3 ($9.49)
Seat 2: gominol ($17.10)
Seat 3: JBAAR42 ($3.60)
Seat 4: xxSTEVENxx ($10.61)
Seat 5: puffmutti ($8.53)
Seat 6: gy3pr3FOS ($30.61)
Seat 7: Mikeyboo ($9.78)
Seat 8: KAMATE ($11.41)
Seat 9: _Vrax_ ($13.01)
Seat 10: ermakeahPP ($10.29)
JBAAR42 posts the big blind of $0.10
gominol posts the small blind of $0.05
Vilem3 is the button
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to _Vrax_ [:Kc: :Ks:]
xxSTEVENxx folds
puffmutti folds
gy3pr3FOS folds
Mikeyboo folds
KAMATE folds
_Vrax_ raises $0.35
ermakeahPP folds
Vilem3 folds
gominol calls $0.35
JBAAR42 folds
*** FLOP *** [:7d: :3h: :8d:]
gominol bets $0.50
_Vrax_ calls $0.50
*** TURN *** [:7d: :3h: :8d:] [:5s:]
gominol bets $0.50
_Vrax_ raises $2.60
gominol calls $2.60
*** RIVER *** [:7d: :3h: :8d: :5s:] [:Ah:]
gominol bets $2.00

I think the complicated river decisions are a result of play in earlier streets - especially on the flop.

hand 1: raise more pre. If you think his flop bet means a draw then re-raise harder on flop. Turn check behind is good. River, hmmm. If the king hit his hand then you're way ahead. Sounds likely enough given reads, so does a flush. I don't expect to see a set here very often. Call.


hand 2: Raise the flop to $2, fold to a push. After the turn, I'd be scared. River is horrible for you, but i think you're good >20% of the time so puke-call

First hand I flat call, sometimes you're ahead and sometimes you're not.
Second hand I'm pretty sure you're ahead (unlikely he has an ace and he'd probably bet harder with a set, altho if he has the unlikely straight donks do bet small like that) but he won't call a shove with anything you beat (except maybe queens) so just flat call again.

call both

Quote:

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Originally Posted by daven

I think the complicated river decisions are a result of play in earlier streets - especially on the flop.

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Hand 1: This is 100% true your weak-passive flop play is really putting you in bad spots. In hand 1 minraising this flop is terrible, your hand has SOOO much value but is vulnerable. I would raise near pot, I like 2.25.

Hand 2: You hit a great flop, again your hand has TONS of value and theres tons of draws he'll pay with so why on earth would you ever think about smooth calling this flop bet. I would raise to full pot on a board this draw heavy, (to about 2.40).

If you play these flops aggressively then you can get away with calling rivers like these because your forcing them to put in so much money behind that paying them off on the river is fine.

Your asking the wrong question in this post. You really need to work on your flop play because the leaks demonstrated here are enormous.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by daven

I think the complicated river decisions are a result of play in earlier streets - especially on the flop.

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/agree

You should be planning these hands from the flop. Against terrible players like this I want to be all-in by the turn if possible, otherwise the river is fine.