blind battle and an overbet shove

Villain is 18/14/3.9 with a 26% A2S. He went into the tank before shoving river. I planned to call a PSB but when he overbets it makes me stop and think.





Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $4.00 BB (6 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

Hero (BB) ($525)
UTG ($159.90)
MP ($400)
CO ($406.20)
Button ($640)
SB ($536.40)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, Jhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif
4 folds, SB raises to $12, Hero calls $8

Flop: ($24) Jhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif, 7http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif, 9http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif (2 players)
SB bets $18, Hero calls $18

Turn: ($60) Jhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $40, SB raises to $105, Hero calls $65

River: ($270) 5http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (2 players)
SB bets $401.40 (All-In)

sure feels like you're smoked here, id fold pretty fast

wooooow i d be tempted to call

as in, i d call

I think I'd snap fold this. This turn c/r is pretty scary small too, he's just juicing this puppy up to get you committed to stacking.

and I'm not just sayin that cause I like making genitruc feel like the outcast :)

did i mention call

when you sent me the HH I thought there was a FD on the frop

now I lean towards....WTF

i think u see 89 and 9T here a lot

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Genitruc

i think u see 89 and 9T here a lot

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wow.. I would have said.. I think you see 89 and 9T here NEVER

why would 89 and 9T c/r this turn.. instead of c/c'ing? doesn't make much sense to me..hmmm

You'd see T8, 7's full/9's full or AJ a lot more often than 89/9T I'd imagine.

I'd be a lot more likely to call if he just bet bet bet.. than his turn small c/r and bomb river.

People just don't expect a Jx to fold here ever.. so at the end of the day, its a horrible bluffing spot... and so ppl are rarely bluffing here.

its gonna be a bluff very rarely, and the times it is, villain is going to have some kind of read that you are a good player capable of folding a jack. even then, its very difficult to bomb this river w/ an overbet knowing that you have a jack, since let's face it, your hand is face up.

the guy has to be pretty bluff happy to even consider calling here i think. i also agree that 89 and 9T are long shots here.

i dunno i just go with my gut

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Genitruc

i think u see 89 and 9T here a lot

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maybe if villain is on steaming monkey tilt.

I swear when you sent me this on aim it was a different opp description.

I'd just fold turn tbh.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan

I swear when you sent me this on aim it was a different opp description.

I'd just fold turn tbh.

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I didnt say anything about villain on aim, just shipped the hh.

The thing about this hand is if villain is bluffing on the turn he's probably shoving on the river, but he's not bluffing enough to call so we might as well just fold the turn.

I fold this river preety damn fast tbh, as once you call the turn you have a jack almost always and i doubt hes stupid enough to try and bluff you off trips. His overbetshove is just screaming that he wants to get max value from your hand.

what I dont get is that he tells a different story on the turn and river, raising the turn small to set up an overbet shove on a blank river?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bigspenda73

what I dont get is that he tells a different story on the turn and river, raising the turn small to set up an overbet shove on a blank river?

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doesnt want to lose his customer by raising the turn too hard, then tries to make up for lost value by overbetshoving the river?

maybe the fact that I'd need a stronger read to fold than to call is the reason my play is prone to swongs

and also the fact that I'd play lots of big draws as well as stuff like 9T as well as every big draw I pick up on the turn this way makes me project my play 2 much onto other people

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Genitruc

and also the fact that I'd play lots of big draws as well as stuff like 9T as well as every big draw I pick up on the turn this way makes me project my play 2 much onto other people

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Yah I honestly don't think most people would do this.

I might actually find a laydown here.

Depends if I think he's on tilt or something.

He's telling you so good of a story that I'm a believer.