QQ OOP

Only had a few orbits, but UTG is fishy and aggressive, something like 50/25. MP has been playing tight. Doesn't seem like an iso raise, but obviously I have to be alert to the possibility that the presence of the fish has widened his range. What to do?


Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $2.00 BB (6 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

UTG ($209.60)
MP ($200)
CO ($511.85)
Button ($311.90)
Heroine (SB) ($481.35)
BB ($554.40)

Preflop: Heroine is SB with Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif, Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif
UTG raises to $8, MP raises to $26, 2 folds, Heroine calls $25, 1 fold, UTG calls $18

Flop: ($80) 6http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif, Jhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, 3http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif (3 players)
Heroine checks, UTG checks, MP bets $60,

Call flop, and I would often fold to a decent sized turn barrel at my stakes. I can imagine that's too weak at yours.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by minSim

Call flop, and I would often fold to a decent sized turn barrel at my stakes. I can imagine that's too weak at yours.

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Yeah, same here, although I can't envision any point in this hand where we're making lots of money.

4bet or fold preflop. you wont be able to play qq profitably oop postflop in this spot.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nutsinho

4bet or fold preflop. you wont be able to play qq profitably oop postflop in this spot.

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I'm kinda suprised by this advice (unless you mean "you" as in specifically "me", because then it is spot on).

Could you explain the reasons? Is there something special about this spot, or are you talking in general about playing QQ OOP to a 3-bet?

Also, why would you rather fold even than call just for set potential?

My original plan for calling was to keep the fish in because he'll make a ton of mistakes postflop.

If you did 4-bet what size would you 4-bet and would you fold to a shove?

Sorry for all the questions. I can't always follow your line of reasoning.

What would you put yourself on if you were in MP?

I'd make it 58 and call a shove. (pre)

we dont have the odds to call for a set. plus people will put us on tt-qq if we call here and play well against us. Id rather call with 55 or AKs or AA for some deception. this is usually just a fold at lower stakes because its an utg raise followed by an mp 3bet. if i were facing the same bets from co and bu id be pretty happy about 4betting and calling a shove.

Nuts, don't you think that MP is isolating the fish often with JJ-, AK?

I'm just an ignorant noob surprised we're folding QQ here.

Given that UTG is fishy, I probably lead this flop a fair bit trying to get a call from the donk. I don't expect MP will bet this flop that often with worse than our hand, and will check through too often if we have him beat. I'd rather make sure we charge draws and make fish pay to tag along.

yea the only reason to call here would be to donk low flops like this into the fish and make the reraiser play honestly while getting value out of utg. you checked so its obvious you didnt have a particular plan in mind and now you should fold for sure when mp bets into 2 on this board. as far as isolating the fish with a wide range, i cant speak for everyone else but when a fish raises utg i usually call pretty wide but dont reraise all that wide, especially with 4 people to act behind me. if you have a read that this guy will isolate wide, then 4bet and get it in. calling oop to play fit or fold type poker fucking sucks especially when you have what he thinks you have.