2/4: 4bet pot deep

Here's a quiz for the ones with too much time on their hands.

I'm on the button, villain is a good reg 25/22 with 9% 3-bet.

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $4.00 BB (6 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

Button ($930)
SB ($697.30)
BB ($699.10)
UTG ($328.20)
MP ($74)
CO ($1401.60)

Preflop:
3 folds, Button bets $8, 1 fold, BB raises to $40, Button raises to $112, BB calls $72

Flop: ($226) 6http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, Khttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, 7http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Button checks

Turn: ($226) 10http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Button checks

River: ($226) 7http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Button bets $208, BB raises to $587.10 (All-In), Button calls $379.10

Total pot: $1400.20 | Rake: $3

After a mild headache.. I vote

Button has 8s7s, BB has AdQd.

Waiting on Fed to kick some ass, so I'll give ya a go

Ad8d vs 8h8c intrigues me here, this option makes the least sense, which means it actually makes the most sense b/c the HH as played makes ZERO sense. My biggest drawback on this hand and the K9o vs. 77 option is that I'm not certain how often (or how optimal) the BB is 3betting these hands PF, specifically his reaction vs. a minraise.

8s7s vs AdQd makes sense postflop, although I doubt you're 4betting 87s, make it 87o and I like this option a lot more.

QQ vs QQ makes sense in the fact that:

a. PF makes sense
b. 2 medium-strength showdown hands which get to a river. BB realized BTN is value-betting thin, doesn't think he'll make a tough call.

Ruling out you holding AK,KK,89o b/c of flop/turn action (and PF sometimes too with AK) and KsJs b/c of PF as well (same reasoning w/ 87s, hands play better as a flat in my mind at least).

fuck this shit, let's just go grab some sushi in LV!

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Originally Posted by bigspenda73

8s7s vs AdQd makes sense postflop, although I doubt you're 4betting 87s, make it 87o and I like this option a lot more.
!

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You could be right about this.

I just think BB having QQ on the river is the perfect card to simply c/c, so I think I want to rule out all QQ for BB.

I think Button will bet any K by the turn, so rule out all K's forbutton, including KK.
I think Button would definitely bet 89 on turn if he had it, so rule out 89.

So now we're left with my choice from before and:

Btn: QQ, BB: AKhh I think this option actually makes some sense, given stack sizes, that BB can show up with AK here and he turns hearts and doesn't feel the need to lead here. River QQ finally goes for some value and AK c/bombs.

Btn: Ad8d, BB:88 This option also makes some sense, though I feel like Btn would still bet this hand the majority of the time onthe flop, regardless of how much is behind. This hand is possible though, and BB decides to turn 88 into a bluff on the river which seems valid.

I think if I was going to change my vote I'd actually change it to A) now, since I think its more likely that AKhh chooses to flat OOP given stacks pre, than the nut FD not betting this flop. It's close between those two though, and I cancel my 8s7s vote.

what about 97s, some people flat those to 3bs, but I don't know whether op would (actually this deep he would)

button can obviously have QQ/JJ as well because BB's raise wouldn't be QQ so QQ=JJ here I think

I think someone played bad in every one of those options.

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Originally Posted by griffey24

After a mild headache.. I vote

Button has 8s7s, BB has AdQd.

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yah, and id fold if I were BTN

I voted 89o v TT

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Originally Posted by Alexos

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Originally Posted by griffey24

After a mild headache.. I vote

Button has 8s7s, BB has AdQd.

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yah, and id fold if I were BTN

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Fold a straight in a 4bet pot? I don't like that fold.

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

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Originally Posted by Alexos

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Originally Posted by griffey24

After a mild headache.. I vote

Button has 8s7s, BB has AdQd.

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yah, and id fold if I were BTN

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Fold a straight in a 4bet pot? I don't like that fold.

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trips.. w/e same thing

yah 89o vs TT makes sense too

either way they got flush or boat so we b/f those shipp the hand reading when they show AJo

Props to spenda and griffey for solid thinking and good comments. Props to iopq and para for having the best taste in women.

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

Props to spenda and griffey for solid thinking and good comments. Props to iopq and para for having the best taste in women.

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and the winner is....?

BB probably has diamonds and button is repping 7x but may just have nothing. I hate preflop though if the button actually has a 7 in his hand.

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Originally Posted by griffey24

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

Props to spenda and griffey for solid thinking and good comments. Props to iopq and para for having the best taste in women.

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and the winner is....?

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iopq avatar is the cutest, not close.

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Originally Posted by Massimo

BB probably has diamonds and button is repping 7x but may just have nothing. I hate preflop though if the button actually has a 7 in his hand.

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If you hate it then don't vote it.

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

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Originally Posted by Massimo

BB probably has diamonds and button is repping 7x but may just have nothing. I hate preflop though if the button actually has a 7 in his hand.

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If you hate it then don't vote it.

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That's not how it works in America :)

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Originally Posted by Massimo

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

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Originally Posted by Massimo

BB probably has diamonds and button is repping 7x but may just have nothing. I hate preflop though if the button actually has a 7 in his hand.

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If you hate it then don't vote it.

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That's not how it works in America :)

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looooooooooooooolllllllllllllll

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

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Originally Posted by griffey24

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

Props to spenda and griffey for solid thinking and good comments. Props to iopq and para for having the best taste in women.

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and the winner is....?

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iopq avatar is the cutest, not close.

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Oh man I so disagree.... but I meant results :)

griffey is spot on

I really wouldn't call river without a boat.

He's calling the 4bet OOP, this can't be 77, 88, 87s, QJs. I hate to be the nit of the bunch, but it really seems like AA (BB) and KK (BU) are the most likely holdings and the river raise is just a bluff shove.

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $4.00 BB (6 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

Hero (Button) ($930)
SB ($697.30)
BB ($699.10)
UTG ($328.20)
MP ($74)
CO ($1401.60)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Ahttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, 8http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif
3 folds, Hero bets $8, 1 fold, BB raises to $40, Hero raises to $112, BB calls $72

Flop: ($226) 6http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, Khttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, 7http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($226) 10http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks

River: ($226) 7http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $208, BB raises to $587.10 (All-In), Hero calls $379.10

Total pot: $1400.20 | Rake: $3

Results:
Hero had Ahttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, 8http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif (flush, Ace high).
BB had 8http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif, 8http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (two pair, eights and sevens).
Outcome: Hero won $1397.20

boooooooooooooooooooooom

P4's what are your thoughts about 3betting hands like 66-99 against a button minraise from a solid player like yourself?

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

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Originally Posted by griffey24

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

Props to spenda and griffey for solid thinking and good comments. Props to iopq and para for having the best taste in women.

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and the winner is....?

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iopq avatar is the cutest, not close.

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Just gonna throw this out there... Iopq has a history of putting up transexuals as avatars.

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Originally Posted by bigspenda73

boooooooooooooooooooooom

P4's what are your thoughts about 3betting hands like 66-99 against a button minraise from a solid player like yourself?

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Very nice spenda, very very nice. You outplayed some serious sharks in this hand. I would of course never 4bet 87s this deep in position, just like you said. I also can't understand why people think I would slowplay the flop or the turn.

I think 3betting 66-99 is fine if you want to maintain a maniac image, but it just sucks so bad to be 4bet this deep.

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Originally Posted by XxStacksxX

Just gonna throw this out there... Iopq has a history of putting up transexuals as avatars.

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What's wrong with transsexuals?

btw, don't forget to play some gauntlet this year P4's

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

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Originally Posted by XxStacksxX

Just gonna throw this out there... Iopq has a history of putting up transexuals as avatars.

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What's wrong with transsexuals?

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Nothing... Just wanted to let you know.

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Originally Posted by XxStacksxX

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

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Originally Posted by XxStacksxX

Just gonna throw this out there... Iopq has a history of putting up transexuals as avatars.

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What's wrong with transsexuals?

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Nothing... Just wanted to let you know.

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I'd still hit it.

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Originally Posted by bigspenda73

btw, don't forget to play some gauntlet this year P4's

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Why, you like loosing? ;)

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

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Originally Posted by bigspenda73

btw, don't forget to play some gauntlet this year P4's

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Why, you like loosing? ;)

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Nah, he needs all the help he can get to knock me out of my superior placing in the leader board.

Edit: In before Stacks makes some stupid comment about how he's in 1st even though his luckbox ass should have been rightfully knocked out by me in the 3rd game and even though he's played more games than me so suck it tagfish!!!

Edit #2: Also in before he makes reference to that damn 67o hand or the T8o vs T7s hand.

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

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Originally Posted by bigspenda73

btw, don't forget to play some gauntlet this year P4's

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Why, you like loosing? ;)

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I could lose to you all day big boy

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

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Originally Posted by XxStacksxX

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Originally Posted by pocketfours

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Originally Posted by XxStacksxX

Just gonna throw this out there... Iopq has a history of putting up transexuals as avatars.

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What's wrong with transsexuals?

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Nothing... Just wanted to let you know.

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I'd still hit it.

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it's not as funny if they don't act shocked :banana:

He probably made a good bluff, nh.

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Originally Posted by Galapogos

Edit: In before Stacks makes some stupid comment about how he's in 1st even though his luckbox ass should have been rightfully knocked out by me in the 3rd game and even though he's played more games than me so suck it tagfish!!!

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Your such a hater. And I was peer pressured into playing the PLO tourney, which I have no PLO experience whatsoever. So given my terrible score in that, you might just have a shot. I mean I doubt it because I'm going to busto your candy ass in the nlhe event later tonight, but who knows? Maybe you will run good one time?

i don't understand why you never 4bet 87s but 4bet A8s. They play virtually the same calling here (very well).

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Originally Posted by Renton

i don't understand why you never 4bet 87s but 4bet A8s. They play virtually the same calling here (very well).

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thats true, i prob wouldnt 4bet either of them

But you have blockers!!!

But we have A hi, who needs blockers !

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Originally Posted by Alexos

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Originally Posted by Renton

i don't understand why you never 4bet 87s but 4bet A8s. They play virtually the same calling here (very well).

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thats true, i prob wouldnt 4bet either of them

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QFT

just depends on the 3-bettor to, obviously.

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Originally Posted by Renton

i don't understand why you never 4bet 87s but 4bet A8s. They play virtually the same calling here (very well).

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My comment is still valid: it should be obvious that I don't 4bet 87s. The same isn't true for A8s, regardless of whether your statement holds, which I think it does.

yeah its tough to put you on a flush here, since the standard 4bet range are big hands and raggy offsuit air.

his shove seems pretty terrible since you are only gonna have air or a hand thats never folding when you bet that amount (for that reason i don't really care for your size). He should have just called if he wanted to get fancy.

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Originally Posted by Renton

yeah its tough to put you on a flush here, since the standard 4bet range are big hands and raggy offsuit air.

his shove seems pretty terrible since you are only gonna have air or a hand thats never folding when you bet that amount (for that reason i don't really care for your size). He should have just called if he wanted to get fancy.

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I agree 100%, and I don't quite get some of the comments to the opposite.