2 Royal Vegas $50 NL hands I screwed up with.

Sorry that these are from memory. I don't know how to get RV's hand histories.

Hand 1: Dealt AKo in late position. A few limpers. I raise 5xBB, 2 loose limpers call it.

Flop: T T rag rainbow.

Player 1 checks, Player 2 min bets. I hate interpreting min bets. I'm scared to death that Player 2 is loose enough to have a ten, and is value betting it rather than betting for info. I can't bring myself to fold 2 overs for a min bet though, and I call as does Player 1.

Turn: rag.

Check, Check? Now I'm not so sure if Player 2 has a decent hand. I tell myself this pot might be for sale, and fire out a near pot sized bet. Player 2 calls (crap!).

River: another blank, no help for me.

Player 2 fires off a tiny bet that just screams value bet, and though it kills my table image here I can't call it with ace high. Fold.

Post-hand thoughts: Check the turn. Trying a steal in a multi-pot with no show of flop strength on my part and with the possibility of slowplay by Player 2 was a poor play on my part.


Hand 2: A9 of clubs on the button. I limp, as does the BB and one other guy.

Flop: 5 5 2 of clubs.

BB checks, other guy bets about half the pot. I raise on a semi-bluff. BB calls, other guy does a modest re-raise (crap!). I call the re-raise because it is small and I have pot odds although I have no clue what the BB will do next. He pushes all-in (double crap!). He's the shortest stack so calling his all-in would put myself and the other guy almost all-in but not quite. I have to call $26 with the pot at $75. 4 to 1 on my money sounds good, but with the board paired my outs are tainted. I call, as does the other guy. No clubs come up, and we check it to the showdown.

BB had 52 for the full boat on the flop.

Post hand thoughts: Fold the freakin' flop. I don't quite have pot odds to chase, and probably not enough folding equity for the semi-bluff raise here. Failing that, don't call the AI! Way too much chance of having tainted outs, or worse....drawing dead (as was the case).

Thoughts?

Yeah I didn't know how to get em for awhile either but now I do. Simply click on the options button (I think its called options) in the main lobby part and go up to where it says playcheck. All your hand histories will be in there.

hey dr no!

hand 1

pf - fine

flop - if you're limpers are loose (as you said), with TT rag and a small bet (stupid bet, slow play, value bet??? :( ) to you, i'd fold on the flop. i'd be thinking 9T, TJ, JQ etc. for player 2. even if you hit a king or ace, i bet it's no good.

hand 2

pf - with just one limper, and the blinds ahead, i would either raise 3xBB to get it heads up (or win it preflop), or fold. if a flush possibility pops up, you may not get the odds to draw to a flush. heads up (based on the other players limping and checking), a9 would probably be good enough if an ace falls

flop - i like the raise, but the reraise is scary. since you have your odds, the call is fine. then the BB pushes AI - yup, it's a fold here.

Thanks for the feedback. You're right about A9s being a bad limp in hand 2. Would be fine to limp behind many limpers, but not behind just one. I should have raised pre-flop. Good point there.

I really have a lot of rust to shake off of my ring game. :wink:

Hand 1, I would have called the small bet on the river. Its not a matter of having the winning hand, but purchasing info on what type of hands he's calling you with and how he plays them.

Hand 2, I hate semi bluffing especially in multi-way pots.

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Originally Posted by SteveDonel

Hand 1, I would have called the small bet on the river. Its not a matter of having the winning hand, but purchasing info on what type of hands he's calling you with and how he plays them.

Hand 2, I hate semi bluffing especially in multi-way pots.

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Hand 1, if that was a tourney and not a ring game, by all means I call it. However, info in a ring game is worth less with people coming and going constantly and a dollar saved is a dollar saved.

Hand 2...Yeah, I need to do a bit fewer semi-bluff raises in multi-pots. I actually find semi-bluff bets when in position to work fairly well even in many multi-pots though when the action is checked to you.

Hand 1: With that much money in the pot and a bluff-friendly flop, I think I would have tested his flop min bet with a strong raise. If he re-raises or calls, then I'm getting out.

Hand 1: Agree. Check the turn, fold the river unless you think they have a fold in them.

Hand 2: Raise pre-flop! You should only *maybe* limp a small pocket pair in that spot.

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Originally Posted by DrNoChance

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Originally Posted by SteveDonel

Hand 1, I would have called the small bet on the river. Its not a matter of having the winning hand, but purchasing info on what type of hands he's calling you with and how he plays them.

Hand 2, I hate semi bluffing especially in multi-way pots.

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Hand 1, if that was a tourney and not a ring game, by all means I call it. However, info in a ring game is worth less with people coming and going constantly and a dollar saved is a dollar saved.

Hand 2...Yeah, I need to do a bit fewer semi-bluff raises in multi-pots. I actually find semi-bluff bets when in position to work fairly well even in many multi-pots though when the action is checked to you.

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I'm not sure if this applies to you, but a semi-bluff is only a semi-bluff when you think that there is a reasonable chance everyone will fold. I found when I was semi bluffing too much I was often neglecting to really consider how likely a fold around is.

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Originally Posted by Flatbush

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Originally Posted by DrNoChance

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Originally Posted by SteveDonel

Hand 1, I would have called the small bet on the river. Its not a matter of having the winning hand, but purchasing info on what type of hands he's calling you with and how he plays them.

Hand 2, I hate semi bluffing especially in multi-way pots.

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Hand 1, if that was a tourney and not a ring game, by all means I call it. However, info in a ring game is worth less with people coming and going constantly and a dollar saved is a dollar saved.

Hand 2...Yeah, I need to do a bit fewer semi-bluff raises in multi-pots. I actually find semi-bluff bets when in position to work fairly well even in many multi-pots though when the action is checked to you.

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I'm not sure if this applies to you, but a semi-bluff is only a semi-bluff when you think that there is a reasonable chance everyone will fold. I found when I was semi bluffing too much I was often neglecting to really consider how likely a fold around is.

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That's exactly why I'm trying to cut down on semi-bluff raises. Someone has already bet and shown some strength, therefore your folding equity is less. Semi-bluff betting when you have the button and the action is checked to you tends to have a much higher success rate as winning the pot right there is more likely.

Semi-bluff raising probably has more use in certain limit situations if you think it will get you the river card for free (if you think you'll get called but then checked to on the turn). Seeing the river card for free is useful in NLHE too of course, but more so in limit I would think since the bet amount increases on the turn vs. the flop.

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Originally Posted by Flatbush

a semi-bluff is only a semi-bluff when you think that there is a reasonable chance everyone will fold.

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A semi bluff is where you bet into a pot without a made hand. With any good draw, even several good draws, you do not have a good hand yet, but you can still make a good hand. Overcards, straight draw, flush draw, all can cause semi-bluffs. Often you won't mind if people call. Sometimes you WANT people to call.

I think the point you are trying to make is unless there is a chance others will fold, the bet is for value. There's no bluff about it. That is true... sometimes.

I have 9h Th

Flop comes 3s 7h 8h

I'm betting at this pot 8 days a week. With an outside straight flush draw and 2 overs. You can call my bet value or a semi-bluff. it's all the same. And I want callers.

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Originally Posted by Humphrind

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Originally Posted by Flatbush

a semi-bluff is only a semi-bluff when you think that there is a reasonable chance everyone will fold.

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A semi bluff is where you bet into a pot without a made hand. With any good draw, even several good draws, you do not have a good hand yet, but you can still make a good hand. Overcards, straight draw, flush draw, all can cause semi-bluffs. Often you won't mind if people call. Sometimes you WANT people to call.

I think the point you are trying to make is unless there is a chance others will fold, the bet is for value. There's no bluff about it. That is true... sometimes.

I have 9h Th

Flop comes 3s 7h 8h

I'm betting at this pot 8 days a week. With an outside straight flush draw and 2 overs. You can call my bet value or a semi-bluff. it's all the same. And I want callers.

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For a semi bluff to be a semi bluff then there MUST be a chance everyone will fold, that's what a semi-bluff is. It is one when you are pretty sure you are behind, and you think there is still a good chance to win if you are behind and you get callers....but you would generally rather win right there.

The draw need not be nearly as good as the one you describe above. In fact, I would think your draw is almost too strong to be a semi-bluff....cause you do want callers....like you said, its for value....it's NOT really a semi bluff.

I have seen much discussion of semi-bluffs being almosty passe in modern poker, and you can expect to often get VALUE 3 BETTED (bad grammar, sorry) if you semi bluff too often...which is costly.

I think we agree, but the possible fold is a nuts and bolts aspect of the definition of "semi-bluff".