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Originally Posted by griffey24
Originally Posted by Marshall28
oh, and the JJ hand ... its kind of a sick spot cuz of how deep we were .... If I raise you and get re-raised, you are only doing so w/ a larger set, AT or 9T. I can't know which it is, so if I call to draw to boat, it's bad reverse implied odds situation, you slow down if you have straight, and you nail me if you have bigger set. Besides, w/ my image there's no way you put me on a hand of that strength and will be valuing much weaker for three streets IMO, I mean, unless you understand that I realize how relatively weak bottom set is on that board while playing that deep.
I didn't think I could hear any justification for playing JJ that slowly but after reading this it seems like legitimate reasoning. I guess the only question is how often hero has KQ instead of AT, and how far hero is willing to take top two? If its not that far, then I think playing bottom set this slow is really goood. Also were there any flush draws on that flop?
I also really like the call down if hero will keep betting with AK. How should we play AK in this hand if we are getting called down? bet flop, c/f turn?
I think the problem here is that like, w/ top 2, hero should expect to get roughly the same amount of value as TPTK -- 2 streets. The other thing is, if we are 100bb deep, this hand is a no brainer, the flop is getting b/3b all in because I really hate to see an A or a T fall on turn or river either killing my action or beating me. There's a balancing act between two risks, one being, if I raise I can get pushed off my hand very easily, and two, if I call, there are 8 scare cards that really put me in a terrible situation. Not to mention if villain does have top two and I boat up .... It's like, if the river doesn't pair the turn, can I ever expect to get the money in good? I think probably not against a good thinking player.
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