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Good spot to pick up orphan pot?

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  1. #1

    Default Good spot to pick up orphan pot?

    Bet flop? Wait till turn? I assume river is a fold?

    PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

    Button ($153)
    SB ($83.35)
    Hero ($50)
    UTG ($49.50)
    MP ($50.70)
    CO ($57.95)

    Preflop: Hero is BB with 6, 7.
    2 folds, CO calls $0.50, Button raises to $2, 1 fold, Hero calls $1.50, CO calls $1.50.

    Flop: ($6.25) 2, 7, 9 (3 players)
    Hero checks, CO checks, Button checks.

    Turn: ($6.25) 9 (3 players)
    Hero bets $5, CO calls $5, Button folds.

    River: ($16.25) K (2 players)
    Hero checks, CO bets $6, Hero??
    Playing live . . . thanks alot Bin Laden.
  2. #2
    Nice turn bet, I'm almost always done with this hand on the river. I see no reason to put him on a worse hand.
  3. #3
    fold preflop, calling SC's from the blinds without a lot of people in the pot is -EV barring reads.
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  4. #4
    Knowing what's up with my opponents is much more important here than number of people in the pot. Need to have a gameplan for how you're going to get value before making this pre-flop call.
  5. #5
    the answer to the subject is "sure."
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  6. #6
    euphoricism's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fnord
    Knowing what's up with my opponents is much more important here than number of people in the pot. Need to have a gameplan for how you're going to get value before making this pre-flop call.
    Examples please? What influences your decision?

    If he routinely stacked off in the situations which arise when we flop hard, wouldn't he already be gone and busto? Wouldnt villain need to have QQ+ and us flop the nuts/bigcombodraw (and even then...) for us to get any sort of value out of this? And even then we'd need to count on him to be brainless enough to call a huge overbet somewhere along the line?

    I guess fundamentally I dont understand where the money is made in no limit 6max. In limit it was very clear to me. Profit came from the inherent human tendency to think "what if...?" rather than "whats likely/profitable?" and for this mindset to cause villains to simply call too much with second best hands.

    I dont see this tendancy in NL except in the "hero calls" unless you have a very LAG image.

    Soupie told me something in my latest verbal asskick. Eupho, mimic the fish. Make plays that look like bluffs when they arent bluffs. And when I was doing that, and doing it -well-, money was being thrown at me faster than I could collect it. Then I took a few bad-beats, doubted myself, and the whole shit fell apart.
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  7. #7
    Play tight/solid until you figure out what your opponents are up to. Then keep putting yourself in positions to exploit their predicatable tendencies.

    Gamble with the fish, all your outs are usually good against their crap.
    Make little gut-check bets and raises against tight players. Tell them their hand is no good just often enough to be plausable.
    Steal blinds from people who are playing too many tables.
    Put people on hands, figure out what they're trying to do to you.
    Figure out if you're stealing small/medium pots or swinging for fences. Both are very different approaches to the game.
  8. #8
    it s a fine stab

    i usually put mediocre players on trips or a bluff on this river fwiw
    when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
  9. #9
    euphoricism's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fnord
    Play tight/solid until you figure out what your opponents are up to. Then keep putting yourself in positions to exploit their predicatable tendencies.

    Gamble with the fish, all your outs are usually good against their crap.
    Make little gut-check bets and raises against tight players. Tell them their hand is no good just often enough to be plausable.
    Steal blinds from people who are playing too many tables.
    Put people on hands, figure out what they're trying to do to you.
    Figure out if you're stealing small/medium pots or swinging for fences. Both are very different approaches to the game.
    Thank you. My hand reading skills are improving, but I'm often a street too late.

    Your last point is intriguing to me, because no one is solely one or the other. So how do the approaches differ?
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  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by euphoricism
    Your last point is intriguing to me, because no one is solely one or the other. So how do the approaches differ? And which is "easier"
    You dont chose which way to play. The table dynamics dictate that for you. Its easier to steal on weak tight tight tables than to take down a couple of huge pots.

    Its easier to take down a couple of big pots and stay mostly out of trouble with stealing on a loose aggressive table.
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  11. #11
    Thanks for all the discussion.
    Conclusion
    I called the river thinking it was a bluff. Being new to the table, I didn't have the proper read to do so, but $6 just stunk too much for trips after I showed aggression on the turn.
    Villain showed Trip 9s

    Here's the thought process:
    I've always figured if the turn pairs the TP on the board that you can take this type of orphan pot down. Almost all opponents will bet a vulnerable TP on the flop unless the board is super scary. Most non-thinking/poor opponents aren't willing to battle over a hand where you might have top trips and they might be crushed. An astute opponent will play back at you, but I don't see many of those.
    Faulty thinking?
    Playing live . . . thanks alot Bin Laden.
  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan
    fold preflop, calling SC's from the blinds without a lot of people in the pot is -EV barring reads.
    Probably not the best play, but I was getting a BB discount and SC's are just soooo pretty.
    Plus when I first sit down, I am willing to make slightly -EV plays for image sake. Of course that may be stupid as most 50NL players don't pay attention to image.
    Playing live . . . thanks alot Bin Laden.

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