JJ: Horrible flop vs shortstack.

Both opponents are terrible.

SB is running 50/20/1.7

$2/$4 No Limit Holdem
5 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG ($995.90)
CO ($400.00)
BTN ($255.80)
SB ($205.40)
Hero ($503.00)
[CO posted $4]

Pre-flop: ($10, 5 players) Hero is BB
1 fold, CO checks, BTN bets $16, SB calls $14, Hero bets $64, CO folds, BTN folds, SB calls $52

Flop: ($156, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero?? ($137 effective stacks)

What's best here? Shove, c/c, or c/f?

I apologize if this spot is super standard. I just need some reassurance.

because of stack id shove.

In some ways this is actually a better flop than A69 rainbow because now 88 with a club will call your shove and you'll be ahead. Not much else you can do here.

Agree with Mcat. I treat these hands as an all in preflop and just hope I held.

Originally Posted by meeloche

Agree with Mcat. I treat these hands as an all in preflop and just hope I held.

Yeah, once you throw that much into the pot preflop this is the only way to go.

yeah id bang it in. i don't agree with treating it as all in preflop though just because theres only a PSB behind. If the flop comes AK9 rainbow im not putting in a nickel.

This must be why I suck at poker. I don't get this at all.

Why are we shoving here?

The guy called two good size raises from the SB. Even with his stats, it's hard to put him on any unpaired hand containing two clubs. It's also hard to put him on a big pair since he didn't 3-bet himself.

My read here is that he either has something like 88-TT, or some kind of Ace. The aces and 99 are definitely going to call if we shove.

It looks to me like his check on the flop could only be 1) a trap or 2) a surrender.

Why not just throw in a bet of $60 - $80. If we get check raised, we're most likely drawing to two outs and can fold. If he has nothing he'll fold and we risked less to find out that he has nothing good.

Originally Posted by nutsinho

yeah id bang it in. i don't agree with treating it as all in preflop though just because theres only a PSB behind. If the flop comes AK9 rainbow im not putting in a nickel.

well duh, but nice catch and good job posting this. I should have said I'm pushing it in on just about every flop. AK9 and a few others wouldn't be a good one to push on...

Originally Posted by Ghaleon

Why not just throw in a bet of $60 - $80. If we get check raised, we're most likely drawing to two outs and can fold. If he has nothing he'll fold and we risked less to find out that he has nothing good.

We don't do that because our bet could look weak to him and he'll shove with 88 or TT, causing us to (in your scenario) fold the best hand.

Originally Posted by Ghaleon

Why are we shoving here?

Why not just throw in a bet of $60 - $80. If we get check raised, we're most likely drawing to two outs and can fold. If he has nothing he'll fold and we risked less to find out that he has nothing good.

Simply put, he's retarded and will likely have a club in his PP that he's dumb enough to say fuck it and get it in with. And you can't bet half pot to "find out where you are" only to fold to a min-raise for his entire stack. People are pushing with a lot of hands we beat here.