QQ Deep - K turn, where's the value?

-Villain in this hand is a reg
-in general he doesn't fold to too many 3bets, and 4bets me fairly often (usually from the button - since I fold a fair bit)
-this type of spot he's def polarized and liable to bluff 4bet me, given the stacks, so I decide to flat pre
-not sure on his flop sizing, but didn't seem overly strong


$2/$4 No Limit Holdem
5 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG ($696)
CO ($738.90)
BTN ($134)
griffey24 (SB) ($1,259.45)
BB ($354.10)

Pre-Flop: ($6, 5 players) griffey24 is SB
1 fold, CO raises to $12, 1 fold, griffey24 raises to $40, 1 fold, CO raises to $112, griffey24 calls $72

Flop: ($228, 2 players)
griffey24 checks, CO bets $82, griffey24 raises to $175, CO calls $93

Turn: ($578, 2 players)
griffey24 checks, CO checks

River: ($578, 2 players)
griffey24 ??

Looks fine. I'd c/f, don't see how he doesn't have sdv here.

i dont get the flop cr at all .
given you made a flop cr id be jamming turn, why didnt u jam turn ?
as played, i dont see any other play besides jam river.

if you think he is bluff 4betting you fairly often, just 5bet call ?

Originally Posted by sauce123

if you think he is bluff 4betting you fairly often, just 5bet call ?

Doesn't this mostly negate the fact that he has a bluff, if I'm blowing him off it?

Checked turn because I felt my flop c/r was pretty polarized, and that he could perceive this as a good card to bluff/turn hands into bluffs. Ended up check check turn and I shoved river.

As for flop - Would have c/c down a drier board, but this board felt a little too drawy to just c/c down. Tried to keep the c/r small to encourage some more floats and re-bluffs.

Originally Posted by griffey24

Doesn't this mostly negate the fact that he has a bluff, if I'm blowing him off it?

Checked turn because I felt my flop c/r was pretty polarized, and that he could perceive this as a good card to bluff/turn hands into bluffs. Ended up check check turn and I shoved river.

As for flop - Would have c/c down a drier board, but this board felt a little too drawy to just c/c down. Tried to keep the c/r small to encourage some more floats and re-bluffs.

Although I think your assumption that 'a 5bet blows him off his bluffs and is therefore bad', is wrong, I'm going to assume it's true to make an important point.
First, there's only a few value ranges which stomp on QQ. KK+ AK or KK+ AKs or simply KK+. Let's assume he has KK+ AKs for the sake of argument. That leaves him with a 4betting range of 1.2% of hands for value.
Second, we've already assumed in your OP that opponent 4bets reasonably frequently here, let's assume this frequency is 3%. That leaves him with 1.8% of hands which are bluffs, which would be 60% of his 4betting range. I'm assuming also that you think that he will never 6bet bluffjam. In that case, rather than give a free card to 60% of his range with position, I'd suggest you min 5bet and get 60% folds preflop instead, planning on folding to a 6bet.

If it seems crazy that he will fold 60% of his range to a min 5bet, then I'd suggest your assumption that 'he will fold his bluffs' is wrong. If it seems crazy that he will only go broke with AKs KK+, then I'd suggest you 5bet/call QQ. If it seems like he will call a min 5bet, but fold his bluffs to a larger 5bet which leaves you priced into calling AI against a range of, say KK+ and some combos of AK, then I'd suggest that you 5bet small enough that you give his bluffing range a difficult decision preflop.
To sum up, QQ is a really strong hand.

Originally Posted by sauce123

To sum up, QQ is a really strong hand.

lol

great post, ty sauce

I think your practically turning your hand into a bluff on the flop.