Reverse Timing Tells

I've noticed if I use the Time bank before 4bet shoving, I get called more. If I insta-shove, I get called less.

With KK and AA I'm getting a lot more calls on 4bet shoves, it's great. Anyone do this?

any other ways to ,make ppl act how u want?

this, and to a lesser extent, pot size manipulation, are 2 things not so frequently discussed that are very important and u can make a lot of money with.

my general rule of thumb is this: routine decisions tend to not make so much time and genuinely tough decisons often do. these assumptions lead to exciting implications.

fwiw, my experience has always been that the very quick 4-bet shove is looked up a bit lighter than timing down a bit, because the quick decision makes it look like AK, but i'm probably saying too much for my own good now.

Originally Posted by Lukie

fwiw, my experience has always been that the very quick 4-bet shove is looked up a bit lighter than timing down a bit, because the quick decision makes it look like AK, but i'm probably saying too much for my own good now.

I'm wondering if this is all very limit dependant. I think it's rare people are ever using a timer with AA/KK at 100NL or 200NL. I believe you are at high stakes? I think it must be different for each, both worth examining

timing tells r so underrated

can we get some examples or ideas?

ive found it to be the opposite mostly. kindof what lukie said. insta shoves are looked up lighter and timing down gets more folds.

I think that it is also situation dependent. Like insta shove pf Looks like AA KK to me. while insta shove drawy board turn is combo draw a lot. Also it depends on how far down you let the clock run. Last second clicks have a certain air about them.

There are also some timing tells for people who call instead of raise. For example if someone insta-calls your c-bet they often times have a marginal hand because call is the only option whereas if they had a monster they'd have a lot of options and they'd have to think about how they wanted to play it.

Ive found that if i time down in position on the turn like im thinking about raising i get to see a cheap showdown with my opponents checking to me

i find that they vary from player to player. im happy to see though that im not the only one that weighs in timing to our decisions.

one thing i like to do against light 3 betters is take a little while, then 4 bet pretty small, so they think, oh he must be trying to fight back, and hes probably too big a pussy to call a shove.

i look at timing a lot. some of the more obv ones have already been said like quick call marginal hand. also in general an insta pot like on the river is generally a bluff. and timing down is usually value. i kind of think that regs see insta action from other regs as weaker and timing down as strong and fish see ista action as strong and timing down weak. all of that is really general though and can be different with everyone.

in my experience, instashoves in situations where your opp is expected to call (4 bet pots and such) are looked up less and instashoves in situations in which your opp is expected to fold (OOP open shove on river) are looked up lighter. Anyone else notice this?

In FR I have found a long pause followed by a check usually folds to my bet. They seem to be thinking about bluffing, then deciding not to and giving up.

http://www.liquidpoker.net/blog/viewblog.php?id=347476

this post is regarding a specific timing tell, but i think illustrates how to understand the deeper reasons behind why timing tells can end up being the deciding factor in a decision.

Originally Posted by Marshall28

http://www.liquidpoker.net/blog/viewblog.php?id=347476

this post is regarding a specific timing tell, but i think illustrates how to understand the deeper reasons behind why timing tells can end up being the deciding factor in a decision.

bingo.

thx will, glad u liked it.