Some hands

Opp is loose passive (somewhat exaggerating as he's a reg), he's really scared of thin vbets and doesn't bluff much. So fold river? Any different line you take?
POKERSTARS GAME #12790334295: HOLD'EM NO LIMIT ($2/$4) - 2007/10/22 - 23:04:11 (ET)
Table 'Havnia II' 6-max Seat #4 is the button
Seat 2: heybude ($795.50 in chips)
Seat 3: eric777 ($394.20 in chips)
Seat 4: BabyGrand ($1061.85 in chips)
heybude: posts small blind $2
eric777: posts big blind $4
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to heybude [8d Ad]
BabyGrand: raises $8 to $12
heybude: raises $32 to $44
eric777: folds
BabyGrand: calls $32
*** FLOP *** [As Qd 9d]
heybude: checks
BabyGrand: bets $44
heybude: calls $44
*** TURN *** [As Qd 9d] [5s]
heybude: checks
BabyGrand: bets $136
heybude: calls $136
*** RIVER *** [As Qd 9d 5s] [8h]
heybude: checks
BabyGrand: bets $280
heybude:

Opp is real loose preflop but idk about postflop, hasn't shown down much. I don't feel comfortable playing for stacks here but maybe i should've? River feels ghey T9 but can i rly fold?

POKERSTARS GAME #12789048762: HOLD'EM NO LIMIT ($2/$4) - 2007/10/22 - 21:55:25 (ET)
Table 'Bella III' 6-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: NickyOD ($582.95 in chips)
Seat 2: oyvindgee ($400 in chips)
Seat 4: heybude ($401.35 in chips)
Seat 5: DAPPOLO ($248.60 in chips)
Seat 6: TheFishHuntr ($427.20 in chips)
oyvindgee: posts small blind $2
langostafrio: is sitting out
heybude: posts big blind $4
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to heybude [Kh Jh]
DAPPOLO: folds
TheFishHuntr: folds
langostafrio leaves the table
NickyOD: raises $12 to $16
oyvindgee: folds
heybude: calls $12
*** FLOP *** [5h 7d Js]
heybude: checks
NickyOD: bets $20
heybude: calls $20
*** TURN *** [5h 7d Js] [3s]
heybude: checks
NickyOD: checks
*** RIVER *** [5h 7d Js 3s] [8h]
heybude: bets $60
NickyOD: raises $140 to $200
heybude:

Opp is fishy and weaktite is a reg who threebets kind of light. I'm expecting his threebetting range here is AQ+, TT, and sometimes 99, AJ, KQ. What's the best way to continue?

POKERSTARS GAME #12788964357: HOLD'EM NO LIMIT ($2/$4) - 2007/10/22 - 21:51:01 (ET)
Table 'Leto III' 6-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: heybude ($380 in chips)
Seat 2: BIG_KELLZ ($172 in chips)
Seat 3: jmoney7807 ($349 in chips)
Seat 4: tyson200 ($86.80 in chips)
Seat 5: DearDeirdre ($516.60 in chips)
Seat 6: Weak Tite ($398 in chips)
heybude: posts small blind $2
BIG_KELLZ: posts big blind $4
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to heybude [Qh Qs]
jmoney7807: raises $4 to $8
tyson200: folds
DearDeirdre: folds
Weak Tite: raises $24 to $32
heybude:

Opp is 29/14 but no other reads. I just hate playing for stacks here, but i hate b/f the flop...

POKERSTARS GAME #12789913514: HOLD'EM NO LIMIT ($2/$4) - 2007/10/22 - 22:41:37 (ET)
Table 'Innes' 6-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: heybude ($558.95 in chips)
Seat 2: VICKDAKICK ($400 in chips)
Seat 3: TheFishHuntr ($403.80 in chips)
Seat 4: new_wag ($655.35 in chips)
Seat 5: RunThisTable ($400 in chips)
Seat 6: ktai6666 ($707.10 in chips)
heybude: posts small blind $2
VICKDAKICK: posts big blind $4
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to heybude [Qc Qs]
TheFishHuntr: folds
new_wag: raises $12 to $16
RunThisTable: folds
ktai6666: folds
heybude: raises $44 to $60
VICKDAKICK: folds
new_wag: calls $44
*** FLOP *** [6c Jd 9d]
heybude:

hand 1: interesting spot...what's your image at the table like? i think i call here. although i would definitely cbet the flop.

hand 2: snap fold and don't think much about it.

hand 3: call and proceed with caution.

hand 4: i don't see a line better than b/f....you could c/c, but the purpose of that would be to get it in on a non-flush turn...stacks are pretty deep so i dunno...

1) fold turn.

2)I actually know this guy from an Irish poker forum. This is a fold against most players.

3) Call. I hate this spot.

4) c/c

Irish i think your missing the fact in hand 1 i have a fd or i would agree with you.

Hand 2 i kinda like a call. Your hand looks weak and his hand doesn't make a lot of sense.

Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan

Irish i think your missing the fact in hand 1 i have a fd or i would agree with you.

I'm not sure exactly how much your FD is worth when you're OOP here. I mean, what are you gonna do if the river is a diamond? open shove? c/r AI?

What am I missing about hand 1 that has made you play so passively? Didn't we just flop TP+NFD in a 3bet pot?

you missed the fact that we're 2 buys deep

hand 1- i like ur line now call

hand 2- Id 3bet pre and if i didnt u HAVE to c/r this flop vs a loose opponent cmon. river seems like a fold

hand 3- i think i call here against weaktite and a fishy/bad opponent. tho with my image id prob 4bet call shove

hand 4- bet/call lol?

1. call. I'm pretty sure i'd bet the flop with some regularity. I think i'd flip a coin and check/bet. I'm not saying this is good, i'm wondering if it is. Also after playing villain hu a little, im pretty sure you are underestimating his frequency of bluffing. If I recall correctly, he craied a flop with overcards in one of the first 3bet pots i played against him.

2. yeah fold. why is this a tough spot?

3. i would basically always call here with any hand i liked. i.e. i doubt i'd ever 4b with any hand, even AK.

4. I would call if i bet and got raised. But I think i'd crai the flop here mostly.

Originally Posted by sauce123

hand 2- Id 3bet pre and if i didnt u HAVE to c/r this flop vs a loose opponent cmon. river seems like a fold

i understand all the posts except this part.

Flop is J75r, we have KJ OOP vs loose player. Wouldnt c/r'ing flop be a bad move?? Instead c/c flop, turns checks round then we VB river. If opp bets turn then we evaluate based on bet size,timing and reads.

hand 2- Id 3bet pre and if i didnt u HAVE to c/r this flop vs a loose opponent cmon. river seems like a fold.

Sauce, can you comment a bit more into why c/r-ing the flop is better?
- We don't want to get bet of the best hand at the turn or river, which could quite easily happen when we c/c flop, check turn?
- Some worse hands call because that have position?
- If we c/r flop, do we c/f turn if called?

What's wrong with c/c flop, lead turn?

Originally Posted by minSim

hand 2- Id 3bet pre and if i didnt u HAVE to c/r this flop vs a loose opponent cmon. river seems like a fold.

Sauce, can you comment a bit more into why c/r-ing the flop is better?
- We don't want to get bet of the best hand at the turn or river, which could quite easily happen when we c/c flop, check turn?
- Some worse hands call because that have position?
- If we c/r flop, do we c/f turn if called?

What's wrong with c/c flop, lead turn?

I agree with sauce that i should threebet this some amount, and that c/r on the flop is probably better.
c/c and lead turn is just not a line anyone should really take ever, however there are some rare times when i'd do it sometimes.

Originally Posted by Renton

1. call. I'm pretty sure i'd bet the flop with some regularity. I think i'd flip a coin and check/bet. I'm not saying this is good, i'm wondering if it is. Also after playing villain hu a little, im pretty sure you are underestimating his frequency of bluffing. If I recall correctly, he craied a flop with overcards in one of the first 3bet pots i played against him.


4. I would call if i bet and got raised. But I think i'd crai the flop here mostly.

Yeah ive had the same experience HU versus BabyGrand, but watching him play 6 max ive been paying a lot of attention and he has been playing like a nit.

Here let me tell you about this hand. I would give the HH but i dont remember exactly what i had.
I get to the river with very little action, the pot is only 80 against babygrand. There is also 4 cards to a straight on the board. I decide to go for a c/r because he's not going to call with worse than a straight and he may very well bet worse than it. So i check. BabyGrand tanks and i mean tanks, and bets $8 into an $80 pot. I raise to $88. and he goes.

"I knew i shouldn't have bet"

Which makes me highly doubt he insta vbets AK or AJ or something like that, but hell even i dont. But this hand also makes me think he's a pussy.


Explain why you think c/r on hand 4 would be better than bet/bet.

Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan

Originally Posted by minSim

hand 2- Id 3bet pre and if i didnt u HAVE to c/r this flop vs a loose opponent cmon. river seems like a fold.

Sauce, can you comment a bit more into why c/r-ing the flop is better?
- We don't want to get bet of the best hand at the turn or river, which could quite easily happen when we c/c flop, check turn?
- Some worse hands call because that have position?
- If we c/r flop, do we c/f turn if called?

What's wrong with c/c flop, lead turn?

I agree with sauce that i should threebet this some amount, and that c/r on the flop is probably better.
c/c and lead turn is just not a line anyone should really take ever, however there are some rare times when i'd do it sometimes.

Can you go into a bit more detail about the flop play; why c/r is the better play? We won't fold out better hands and I don't think that a lot of worse hands call....or do they? (68, QJ)

Or does being OOP just sucks so hard that we don't want to c/c c/f or c/c c/c c/f?

Jx, floats, draws all call/raise.

We don't allow the worse hand to draw us out.

hand 1 i like a nice big c/r on flop. you have TP +nut FD.

Hand 1: As played call the river but I would bet the flop though. This is a great board for our hand.

Hand 2: 3-bet preflop against loose opponent. I would just fold the river but then you played it so passively that with reads I would call here sometimes.

Hand 3: Call but if the board comes in all unders we might have to play for stacks here.

Hand 4: Bet the flop. Bet the turn on a non diamond.

wtf in hand 1 the guys river betting range is like AA/QQ/99/AQ given the read. I mean do we think that he thinks we will call this river with AJ?

Originally Posted by Irisheyes

wtf in hand 1 the guys river betting range is like AA/QQ/99/AQ given the read. I mean do we think that he thinks we will call this river with AJ?

Yeah seriously guys i think its a clear fold too, i gave you exact reads that would make it this way, I think most are just blinded by my weak line and the fact we have two pair.

Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan

Explain why you think c/r on hand 4 would be better than bet/bet.

Well first of all it has to do with the fact that I 3bet from the blinds a total shit ton. Ergo, my range on like any flop isn't very strong. Ergo, I must check and give up a ton. Ergo, I must check with a large chunk of my good hands as well.

The other reason is that it removes me from any tough spots, while I'm certain im making a profitable play. If i bet here and get raised, im like well fuck maybe i should fold this. Its a tough spot. If i check here, he bets, i know that the amount in the pot vs his stabbing range vs the strength of my hand makes it a super easy shove.

As to whether its a better play than betbet, who knows.

Very strong points, nice post. I agree if we're threebetting a lot your line is at least debatably optimal. I hadn't been threebetting a ton though at this table and it was the only one opp was on so i think b/c is prob better.

Oh right guys results
Hand 1: I called and immediately told max how i thought it was a fold and i made a bad call. He ofc had AQ.
Hand 2: He had T9, wow did i butcher that.
Hand 3: I raised to 100 and immediately thought it horrible given my image, for a lot of reasons. He shoved with KK.
Hand 4: I bet/called and he showed TT but i really mulled over it before betting.

4: Why do you consider bet/folding flop? bet/3bet/stackeroo
Only hand you fear now is JJ, if he has it, I pay him off