Caribean Sun Rakeback questions

[The_Bankroll]

A friend of mine uses Carribean sun and seems to like it, and I was thinking about signing up via the FTR link for the rakeback, and I just had a couple questions:

1. Does the rakeback only count hands I am involved in, or if I fold pre-flop am I still getting %25 of the rake back?

2.Does the %25 include SnGs, for example if I play a $5+$1, do i get $0.25 back?

3. My friend mentioned they have some kind of refferall bonus, am i still eligible to recieve a refferall from my friend if I use the FTR link?

[Eric]

[NEW INFO EDIT 28-JULY-2005
Mark, our Caribbean rep, checked with the software company and it is true that you get rake back even on hands where you did not enter the pot (as long as you were dealt cards). Sorry about the confusion]

The_Bankroll,

I'm glad to see you are taking advantage of our rakeback program. Our rakeback programs are a great way to help with the number one leak for good players - rake. I've asked Mark, our Caribbean Sun rep, to take a look at your questions. In the mean time I can give you some feedback.

[This original answer below in quotes is incorrect, see Mark's clarification further down in the thread. I originally wrote:]

1. You get back 25% of all the rake you put in regardless of how hands play out. This means if you were the big blind and you fold pre-flop then you would get back 25% of the amount that your blind contributed towards the rake.

2. I think so but Mark will confirm. I know for our True Poker rakeback program players get back a percentage of the tournament fees.

3. I think so but Mark will confirm. The rakeback program is driven through our link but I think you can also type the name of a friend in one of the signup text boxes.

[The_Bankroll]

so, It's only %25 of money I contribute. so I fold pre-flop, and contribute no money, I get no rakeback?

[Eric]

so, It's only %25 of money I contribute. so I fold pre-flop, and contribute no money, I get no Rakeback?

That's right, if you don't put any chips in the pot then you didn't contribute any rake for that hand and there is nothing to get back.

[BoondockSaint]

well damn that sucks - other rakeback programs just split the table rake by the number of players so you can fold everytime and you still get a decent rakeback

[koolmoe]

That's right, if you don't put any chips in the pot then you didn't contribute any rake for that hand and there is nothing to get back.

You should double check this. I am familiar with nearly 10 rakeback programs, and all of them credit the player with (rake/players) for each hand they are dealt in whether the player contributes to the pot or not.

[Sun-Poker]

Hello FTR members,

2.Does the %25 include SnGs, for example if I play a $5+$1, do i get $0.25 back?

You do not earn a rakeback percentage on SnG's, since no rake is generated.

3. My friend mentioned they have some kind of refferall bonus, am i still eligible to recieve a refferall from my friend if I use the FTR link?

Yes, you are still eligible to receive the referral bonus if you use the FTR link, granted your friend meets the referral bonus criteria.

Please let me know if anyone has any other questions and I would be happy to answer them.

Have a great day.

Mark

[vqc]

There is no rakeback for that fee you pay for playing SNGs. Doesnt that +1 in a 10+1 tourney coutn as rake? You guys dont need to pay the dealers do you ? =D

[Sun-Poker]

Hi Vqchuang,

The $1 does not count as rake. Some of that $1 goes to the software provider for licensing the software.

Mark

[vqc]

Do you think that at any point in time you guys will start paying rakeback for the +1?

[Sun-Poker]

vqchuang,

I do not know what the owners will do in the future. I suspect if there is a high demand, they will look into the matter. Right now though, rakeback is paid on rake generated only, not tournament fees.

Are you currently involved in any rakeback sites and do they pay on tournament fees? If so, how much of your rakeback consists of a percentage of tournament fees?

Mark

[BoondockSaint]

Yo Mark ,

Can you confirm that you have to actually have money in the pot to get money back through rakeback. I know of programs where it makes no difference if you fold preflop the rake of that specific hand gets split between all players at the table.

[Sun-Poker]

Boondock,

I will double check on this one, but I am fairly certain that the player does not receive rakeback unless they contribute to the pot. If you fold without posting a bet, you do not receive rakeback. I have not heard any other rakeback programs offering this. Which ones are you familiar with that offer this?

Mark

[BoondockSaint]

Well hopefully KoolMoe comes back and responds cause he said he knows of at least 10. I just know thats how the party poker skin rakebacks worked im not sure of the others because I have not done any others - ill PM KoolMoe and get the sites.

[BoondockSaint]

These are the sites he got back to me with. All of them you dont have to be in the pot for u to get your 1/10th of the rake counted to you at a full table.

Euro-bet
Em-pire
Ultimate-Bet
Absolute
Multi-Poker
Full-Tilt
Bet Hold Em
Inter-tops

[Eric]

Well hopefully KoolMoe comes back and responds cause he said he knows of at least 10. I just know thats how the Party skin Rake-backs worked im not sure of the others because I have not done any others - ill PM KoolMoe and get the sites.

Many of the rake-backs with party skins are being shut down because they are illegal. They are done with 3rd parties and they may calculate things differently. Our program with Caribbean is directly with the poker room.

I'm curious if you have examples of this calculation from rooms where the rake-back is directly through them. In other words, with our programs you go directly to Caribbean and True Poker to check your rake stats. Do you have examples of programs where you go directly to the poker room to check your stats and see rake even when you did not put money in the pot?

[BoondockSaint]

I dont but kool moe does - i know about em being shutdown so they are done sort of in secret now or whatever but this is how I am 99% sure it works.

You get a hand and fold preflop

pot gets up to 60 dollars

Rake of 3 dollars is taken by the house

there are 10 people at the table

3 divided by 10 - u get 30 cents

then with your 25% or whatever you get like 7-8 cents of this hand back even though u didnt put a penny in it

[koolmoe]

Many of the rake-backs with party skins are being shut down because they are illegal. They are done with 3rd parties and they may calculate things differently. Our program with Caribbean is directly with the poker room.

I'm curious if you have examples of this calculation from rooms where the rake-back is directly through them. In other words, with our programs you go directly to Caribbean and True Poker to check your rake stats. Do you have examples of programs where you go directly to the poker room to check your stats and see rake even when you did not put money in the pot?

None of the programs that I am familiar with are directly through the poker site.

As far as whether a revenue sharing plan is "illegal," that is entirely dependent upon the T&C's of the affiliate agreement. Party expressly prohibits revenue sharing in their affiliate agreement. There are Party skins that do not prohibit revenue sharing. I know this because I have seen the affiliate agreements. Affiliate agreements are always subject to change, however.

In the end, the two calculations will be similar, but for tighter players the quiotient method is preferrable.

[Sun-Poker]

To all,

This is the reply I received from Cryptologic (software provider) in regards to the calculation of the rake.

"If a rake is generated in a hand then this is split equally among the players on the table that were dealt cards and is part of the licensee’s income. If you are giving rake back to players it is a percentage of the rake generated attributed to their playing, so if you have 10 players and all receive cards, and a rake of $1 is generated then each player will effectively have earnt $0.1 in rake."

Hope this clarifies. Thanks!

Mark

[Eric]

Mark,

Thanks for the clarification