KK

[daluchy]

Should I just laydown the turn to aggression or go for the cheapest showdown possible?

Game # 223810807 - Texas Hold'em No Limit EUR 0,25/0,50 - Table "Eskilstuna"
Game ended 2006-01-20 15:29:23 GMT+01:00

Players:
daluchy (EUR 63,35 in seat 1)
scrolli (EUR 36,53 in seat 2)
elritsa16 (EUR 51,05 in seat 3)
Carro23_ (EUR 58,30 in seat 4)
ssdc1 (EUR 31,17 in seat 5)
rampent5 (EUR 47,75 in seat 6)
zerik78 (EUR 48,88 in seat 7)
lenco3 (EUR 20,27 in seat 8)

Dealer: rampent5
Small Blind: zerik78 (0,25)
Big Blind: lenco3 (0,50)

daluchy was dealt: Kc - Kh

daluchy Raise (2,00)
scrolli Fold
elritsa16 Call (2,00)
Carro23_ Fold
ssdc1 Fold
rampent5 Fold
zerik78 Fold
lenco3 Fold

Flop Td - Ts - 6s

daluchy Bet (4,00)
elritsa16 Call (4,00)

Turn Td - Ts - 6s - 9s

daluchy Bet (6,00)
elritsa16 Raise (16,00)
daluchy Call (10,00)

River Td - Ts - 6s - 9s - 4h

daluchy Check
elritsa16 Bet (10,00)
daluchy Call (10,00)

[Fnord]

The turn bet is horrible. Stop dark tunnel betting. Just stop.

[Bo G]

Either bet or check.

[Fnord]

Either bet or check.

Quality post. Thanks for sharing that.

[Jimmy Mac]

What's "dark tunnel betting" ?

[Fnord]

What's "dark tunnel betting" ?

What he did.

[arkana]

Either bet or check.

Quality post. Thanks for sharing that.

Maybe hes just making sure daluchy doesn't open fold.

[Bo G]

When I say bet I mean bet with meaning. The turn bet looks weak and is just asking to be squeezed.

[Fnord]

I can't see much good ever comming out of betting the turn.

[Bo G]

If you don't bet a hand like JJ or QQ can push you off the pot. By putting you on AK. If you bet $10-12 range (3/4 pot). You will get a sure sign of strength.

[Irisheyes]

Why not bet the turn? I see JJ, 99, 88, 77 all calling the flop bet.

I fold the turn to his raise though.

[Fnord]

If you don't bet a hand like JJ or QQ can push you off the pot. By putting you on AK. If you bet $10-12 range (3/4 pot). You will get a sure sign of strength.

...or a smooth call and you'll get pwned on the river.

[Bo G]

If you don't bet a hand like JJ or QQ can push you off the pot. By putting you on AK. If you bet $10-12 range (3/4 pot). You will get a sure sign of strength.

...or a smooth call and you'll get pwned on the river.

If you get called on turn then you have to reevaluate the situation but would you seriously check/fold turn on that board? Without even taking one more shot at the pot.

[Fnord]

I see JJ, 99, 88, 77 all calling the flop bet.

Me too, check.

[Fnord]

If you get called on turn then you have to reevaluate the situation but would you seriously check/fold turn on that board?

I didn't say check/fold. I said check.

Without even taking one more shot at the pot.

With air or a strong hand I take shots. With stuff in between and air I check. If he makes a habbit of betting turns big when I check, I'll start c/r bombing the turn. This is pretty ABC poker. You silly TAggs just mash away like it's a limit game...

Lots of hands call this turn too and that puts us in a tough spot on the river with an even bigger pot. When I play a big pot I want easy decisions.

[Irisheyes]

I you check this turn then he just bets for you, leaving the difficult decision back on you without gathering any extra information. Unless your planning to check raise (which just makes an even bigger pot) then betting gives you 2 ways to win A) he folds his 99
B) he calls and you showdown a likely better hand

and you give him a chance to tell you your beat, like he did here. 99 wont raise this turn, a Ten will.

[daluchy]

I can't see much good ever comming out of betting the turn.

Ok, so let's say I check and get a 3/4 to a pot bet in return. Am I calling and re-evaluating the river or just deciding he's showing strength on a dangerous board and cutting my losses right there?

[Fnord]

B) he calls and you showdown a likely better hand

What's your river plan if called on the turn? Just keep throwing weak bets at him? That's a pretty exploitive/exploitable line to run without a read.

and you give him a chance to tell you your beat, like he did here. 99 wont raise this turn, a Ten will.

Yeah, trips should raise but may or may not. I think a boat smooth calls here a lot, for better or worse, then pops you on the river.

[Fnord]

Ok, so let's say I check and get a 3/4 to a pot bet in return. Am I calling and re-evaluating the river or just deciding he's showing strength on a dangerous board and cutting my losses right there?

What'cha know about him? If it's legit strength more often than not, then fold to the implied threat. Otherwise, congrats, you just drew a bluff from a worse hand on a really scary board.

[daluchy]

Nothing at that moment. Op was fairly new at the table.

A couple more hands after however if he had something he'd probably let you know with a nice bet/raise...which would of been nice to know for this hand.

[Fnord]

Nothing at that moment. Op was fairly new at the table.

Why the hell do you want to play a big pot here against an unknown?

If no one ever bluffed me out of a pot, I'm taking my hands too far. There is an opener + c-bet in the pot. I can give this one up.

For what it's worth, I think checking gives him more room to do something stupid since I don't see how we can protect against a 4rth spade on this board without giving up too much to hands that have us smoked.

[Irisheyes]

B) he calls and you showdown a likely better hand

What's your river plan if called on the turn? Just keep throwing weak bets at him? That's a pretty exploitive/exploitable line to run without a read that he attacks weakness, but then again, if he attacks weakness then I C/R the turn.

Since when is half the pot against 1 opp a weak bet?
If he calls the turn then I'm checking and considering calling a small bet. More likely a fold without a read.

and you give him a chance to tell you your beat, like he did here. 99 wont raise this turn, a Ten will.

Yeah, trips should raise but may or may not. I think a boat smooth calls here a lot, for better or worse, then pops you on the river.

I don't really consider a boat when I'm playing a one pair hand like this. I lump that possibility in with trips.

[Galapogos]

Either bet or check.

Quality post. Thanks for sharing that.

Hehe, I haven't been on here for ages. My how Fnord has gotten grumpy in his old age.

But just for my two bits. There's not really any debate here unless you have an accurate read on your opponent for playing like this on the turn. That's one scary-ass board out there for one lonely pair...