aggression or a river bluff?

[Chopper]

this is meant to be "generic." no reads.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

UTG ($17.60)
UTG+1 ($23.40)
MP1 ($21.95)
MP2 ($27.30)
MP3 ($32.35)
CO ($30)
Hero ($19.90)
SB ($26)
BB ($25)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 9, 9.
3 folds, MP2 calls $0.25, 1 fold, CO raises to $0.5, Hero calls $0.50, 2 folds, MP2 calls $0.25.

Flop: ($1.85) 2, 6, 3 (3 players)
MP2 checks, CO bets $1, Hero raises to $2.5, MP2 folds, CO calls $1.50.

Turn: ($6.85) 4 (2 players)
CO bets $1, Hero calls $1.

River: ($8.85) J (2 players)
CO bets $7.75, Hero ??

tested him on flop, and he still led turn? was that my message? but he led so small...



another...

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (8 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver Cards)

UTG ($15)
UTG+1 ($20.40)
MP1 ($26.55)
MP2 ($26.45)
CO ($35.30)
Button ($36.95)
Hero ($15.65)
BB ($24.15)

Preflop: Hero is SB with , .
UTG calls $0.25, 1 fold, MP1 calls $0.25, 1 fold, CO calls $0.25, Button calls $0.25, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: ($1.50) , , (6 players)
Hero bets $0.75, BB folds, UTG folds, MP1 folds, CO calls $0.75, Button folds.

Turn: ($3) (2 players)
Hero bets $1.75, CO raises to $3.5, Hero raises to $5.25, CO calls $1.75.

River: ($13.50) (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $4, Hero ??.


and do you call this? why? or why not?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (8 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver Cards)

BB ($23.65)
Hero ($18.05)
UTG+1 ($25.40)
MP1 ($14)
MP2 ($29.65)
CO ($17.40)
Button ($8.50)
SB ($32.30)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with , .
Hero raises to $1, 3 folds, CO calls $1, 3 folds.

Flop: ($2.35) , , (2 players)
Hero bets $1.75, CO raises to $4, Hero ??.

is this a test of a cbet, or a frisky draw, or something that beats me?


is this a push?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

BB ($23.30)
Hero ($14.70)
UTG+1 ($35.90)
MP1 ($10.75)
MP2 ($29.30)
MP3 ($19.25)
CO ($4)
Button ($32.80)
SB ($12)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with K, K.
Hero raises to $1, 5 folds, Button calls $1, SB calls $0.90, 1 fold.

Flop: ($3.25) 6, J, 5 (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $2, Button raises to $7.5, SB folds, [color=#CC3333]Hero??

[Chopper]

i know. i know. the minraise in hand 2 blows chunks. i miss-clicked before i could size it correctly.

[wufwugy]

1. A donkey hit his spade.
2. Call the turn raise and probably call down.
3. Tough situation. Call and evaluate.
4. You can't fold and you can't call.

[Chopper]

1. A donkey hit his spade.
2. Call the turn raise and probably call down.
3. Tough situation. Call and evaluate.
4. You can't fold and you can't call.

1. agreed, but wanted to be told so by someone else
2. the more cards came, the more i felt a better 2 pair hit...the turn lead was fine? i wondered about the slightly more than half pot bet, and if it showed weakness?
3. are you saying not to fold TPGK, as the aggressor, when your flop bet is raised...as a general rule?
4. figured it for an easy shove. by the time i looked at my stack, a normal raise leaves me with about $2-$4. so, its commitment time now, i suppose.

[wufwugy]

2. He's playing his cards, not yours; he slowplays to the turn a lot; he doesn't raise AK on the turn a lot; just value the whole way.
3. Typically, I don't. Worse raises often enough. I do not know how to play this situation well, though.

[Chopper]

3. Typically, I don't. Worse raises often enough. I do not know how to play this situation well, though.

this would be worth discussing in more depth. anyone care to jump in here, too?

do you just call, or do you RR?

if you only call, what then on turn when you dont improve? you lead again? or c/c again?

[martindcx1e]

stop freaking playing short-stacked vs. all of the donkey terribads!

[Chopper]

stop freaking playing short-stacked vs. all of the donkey terribads!

this is temporary. my run lately has me trying to emulate EXACTLY what i did when i beat this level handily. and that includes buying in for $20 at a $25 table. i try to reload when under $15, but miss it sometimes.

[martindcx1e]

stop freaking playing short-stacked vs. all of the donkey terribads!

this is temporary. my run lately has me trying to emulate EXACTLY what i did when i beat this level handily. and that includes buying in for $20 at a $25 table. i try to reload when under $15, but miss it sometimes.

it's all in your head...buy in for $25

[wufwugy]

3. Typically, I don't. Worse raises often enough. I do not know how to play this situation well, though.

this would be worth discussing in more depth. anyone care to jump in here, too?

do you just call, or do you RR?

if you only call, what then on turn when you dont improve? you lead again? or c/c again?

3betting is bad.

I said, evaluate. That means evaluate. Maybe c/c, maybe c/f, maybe c/r. Maybe even donk bet. You might be ahead, you might be behind, and it's difficult to tell when you're which.

[wufwugy]

And buy in full.

25nl is ridiculously easy. I kinda wanna go down there and play like 90/70 and kick ass.

[Chopper]

25nl is ridiculously easy. I kinda wanna go down there and play like 90/70 and kick ass.

i appreciate the help/confidence boost. i consider myself a solid player, but my confidence is seriously rocked right now.

as for the buying in full thing...

is a superstition. like a ballplayer wearing a pink wristband on mothers day (because the ownership told him to), but he goes 3 for 4. do you think he's taking off the wristband tomorrow? hell no.

[bode]

hand 1: raise the flop bigger. And raise the turn as played, this is almost always a donk trying to chase his FD cheap.

hand 2: bet bigger every street.

hand 3: push.

[Khabbi]

Hand 1: Your flop re-raise needs to be bigger, make it $3.50. If he calls that shut down, the only hands you beat here are 77 or 88. The turn call was alright, assuming you gave up on the hand. When the spade hit it's all over for you, continue with your original plan to fold.

Hand 2: I'd make a bigger than 1/2 pot bet with 6 players in the pot. But I'd also be careful. As played push the river. If you had started with a full stack, I'd call the river.

Hand 3: Fold pre-flop KQo is not a hand you want to play out of position (see example from your post).

Hand 4: Bet $3 on the flop, as played push. Too many times your bet looks like a c-bet and the villain is trying to push you out here.

[Chopper]

khabbi,

i like the comment of "looking like a cbet." but bigger bets, in my experience, get called/raised all the same. if i bet 3/4 there, it still gets "tested." if i bet pot, habitually, it still gets tested...maybe not quite as much, but it doesnt encourage 2nd best hands to come along, imo. and, furthermore, if i get called oop, the turn practically commits me (if i 2 barrel), and anything that called will fire if i check the turn.

at least thats what i tend to see. is that right? or pussy thinking? (if you choose pussy, please explain why with numbers)

oh, results?

hand 1...i folded. thought flush, too.
hand 2...i called river w/ those "decent" odds. villain had A7.
hand 3...i folded flop figuring to get out cheap.
hand 4...i shoved. villain had the J.

[Jack Sawyer]

Buy in full. I used to buy in short too, but realized its definitely -EV. Buy in full.

[shysti]

1. A donkey hit his spade.
2. Call the turn raise and probably call down.
3. Tough situation. Call and evaluate.
4. You can't fold and you can't call.

my god man who the hell is that chick???

[Pythonic]

Hand1) Villian is controlling the pot size for his flush draw, this is a very typical line.

Hand2) Should probably fold this preflop but why not raise here preflop and take down the blinds. I would just call turn cuz this looks like set or higher 2pr. Have to probably call river now too because already attached to this pot. A2 stinks man, try to stay away from this hand.

[Chopper]

Hand1) Villian is controlling the pot size for his flush draw, this is a very typical line.

leading out oop is not "controlling the pot." its either blocking (not contolling the pot...its scared of a bigger bet from the guy in position), bluffing, or value betting. ok, i'll give you the blocking thing as "controlling" the size, but i wont give the bluffing or value betting.

putting money in the pot isnt "controlling" the size, its selling something else...in this case, it was to "throw me off" the flush draw so he could slam it when it hit, and get paid by me thinking it was a bluff.

and, it is prolly a typical line for betting itno donkeys or deception. i used to use it against the old party villains all the friggin time.

[Pants_101]

Not sure what you're on about here Chopper you can certainly control the pot size and hence the odds by betting OOP as we see from villains turn bet. $1 into a $7 pot and you just call - he's priced himself in for a flush draw with more to spare. If he had checked you would have bet at least half the pot right?

[Chopper]

Not sure what you're on about here Chopper you can certainly control the pot size and hence the odds by betting OOP as we see from villains turn bet. $1 into a $7 pot and you just call - he's priced himself in for a flush draw with more to spare. If he had checked you would have bet at least half the pot right?

which is why i said, "i'll give you the 'blocking bet' as controlling the pot."

[Pants_101]

Guess I'm having some trouble understanding your posts, they seem a little incoherent and rushed lately

[spoonitnow]

as for the buying in full thing...

is a crock of shit that's hurting your ability to make money at this level so you can move up but no matter who tells you this you still won't do it so nevermind

[martindcx1e]

putting money in the pot isnt "controlling" the size, its selling something else...in this case, it was to "throw me off" the flush draw so he could slam it when it hit, and get paid by me thinking it was a bluff.

and, it is prolly a typical line for betting itno donkeys or deception. i used to use it against the old party villains all the friggin time.

that move is not deceptive at all. draws do this all the time. they are scared to put much money into the pot so they bet a little each street hoping that their opponent will just call or even fold. it doesn't throw people off.

[Chopper]

as for the buying in full thing...

is a crock of shit that's hurting your ability to make money at this level so you can move up but no matter who tells you this you still won't do it so nevermind

thats a bit rude. but, fyi, i've bought in full for the past several sessions because i feel i've got a better handle on where i'm going wrong. it is a "superstition," i said. i never said there was any logic behind it. so, i dont understand the pissiness. the idea i was using was a bit of a stop-loss, and/or getting committed before the river easier to lessen the decisions i am having trouble with currently.

and, if you have any problems with buying in short, you can read a post by fnord, who recently made some good points about no longer playing deep. just search the name.

[spoonitnow]

no matter who tells you this you still won't do it so nevermind

yeah i come across as a dick sometimes. oh well.

the players are such at 25nl that you should be playing with a full buyin.

like 4-5 people have noted this so far, and buying in short as a superstition is a really bad reason.

there are times when playing short has advantages, but 25nl is not one of those times.

[Jack Sawyer]

there are times when playing short has advantages, but 25nl is not one of those times.

QFMFT