HM Data Mining Articles - 100nl 6max

[Robb]

Curious about typical 3bet stats? Cbet%? Reports from a huge data-mining project (1800+ players at 100nl or lower, each of whom had 5k+ hands!!) are included in the "Articles" menu of Holdem Manager. Each stat has 5 ranges or quintiles - each range includes a win rate - so you can see where the profitability points are. What you find, of course, is that lots of styles can work. But several DON'T work.

Example, the old pokey 2+2 article suggested a minimum of 2 to 1 VP$P to PFR ratio, or that you should raise at least 50% of the hands you play. In today's 6max small stakes world, players usually MUST raise at least 60% of the hands they play to show a profit. Great breakdowns for about 25 different stats.

If you haven't, you should download the Holdem Manager trial version (free!!) just for these two data-mining articles. They're copyright material, so no links/quotes without attribution. Putting them online would be wrong (it's already happened, I'm sure, but I won't link to it, and please don't either). It's just silly not to get them "free" and authorized with a trial version download.

[minSim]

Thanks Robb, I didn't know of this but have HM, I'll check it out once I get home.

[noble007]

I have holdem manager but i dont know where to find these articles.
I went on the website but under articles it says coming soon

[reprisal]

Open HM, read across the top row Files, Options.....Articles

[thizzSantaCruz]

what was the average 3 bet % for winning regs?

[Robb]

what was the average 3 bet % for winning regs?

6 - 7.5%

[bode]

what was the average 3 bet % for winning regs?

6 - 7.5%

yesssssssssssssssssssssssssssss

[noble007]

Am I being completely stupid maybe I need to download an update or slap myself across the face

When I open HM, There are 3 tabs in the top left
File Options Help

If I scroll over options I get sub options
HUD Options
Player Aliases
Configure Auto Import folders
Database Management
rakeback & bonuses
Hands view colum section
miscellaneous options
import notes

Wtf is articles?

[lolzzz_321]

[Robb]

vnh

[noble007]

Thanks for that Triptanes, looks like I need an update then, Im running an old version 1.05.07

[noble007]

Interesting stuff! thanks for letting me know about it

[bjsaust]

Yeah, time for an update by the looks of it.

[lolzzz_321]

yeah version 1.06.01p is the latest

[bigred]

Where's the fish symbol next to your name?

[Jager]

what was the average 3 bet % for winning regs?

6 - 7.5%

Actually I find this to be very interesting. I am not doubting the data, but I think that the LESS you are 3 betting the better. If you are 3betting 6%+ you are probably table/seat selecting like shit. If you have a 50/2 and a 30/10 on your right you aren't going to be 3betting that much. If you have 2 TAGs/LAGs on your right you will be 3betting a lot more IP and OOP from the blinds.

[lolzzz_321]

I'd be interested to see results of 3b the CO and button out of the blinds

[bigred]

I'd be interested to see results of 3b the CO and button out of the blinds

Yeah, I think this would be a great stat to see.

[Fnord]

If you are 3betting 6%+ you are probably table/seat selecting like shit.

I 3-bet loose players all of the time for value.

[Jager]

Its not about how loose thay are, its about their low PFR. You are more likely to be iso raising than 3betting.

[Robb]

what was the average 3 bet % for winning regs?

6 - 7.5%

Actually I find this to be very interesting. I am not doubting the data, but I think that the LESS you are 3 betting the better. If you are 3betting 6%+ you are probably table/seat selecting like shit. If you have a 50/2 and a 30/10 on your right you aren't going to be 3betting that much. If you have 2 TAGs/LAGs on your right you will be 3betting a lot more IP and OOP from the blinds.

DL and read - it's all interesting stuff. Calling a Cbet stats, for example, were all over the damn place. Lots of styles work. But folks who were only 3betting 2% were not (on average for the database) big winners. Some of the stats show obvious trends - like VP$P - trending high from 18% through about 24%, then diving off the cliff into huge -EV numbers, just the kind of stats we see everyday from the solid 6max players here on FTR. PFR trends up and up through 17.7%, then levels off. Aggression trends up to about 4, then dips.

I found it to be really interesting, and it verified that lots of styles will work out okay - there's no one correct stat (like so many noobies here seem to think) that makes you a winner. But it also can point out some leaks and irregularities in your game. I may be 3betting a bit too much right now (9%), but a lot of that is in blind battles.