WTF?

[MrSlippery]

Could someone please explain this to me?

PokerStars Game #678990826: Tournament #2617548, Hold'em No Limit - Level I (10/20) - 2004/09/09 - 15:46:31 (ET)
Table '2617548 1' Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: ebeseken (1460 in chips)
Seat 2: cashfan (1520 in chips)
Seat 3: ecBart (2940 in chips)
Seat 4: SYF21 (1440 in chips)
Seat 5: Swami (1520 in chips)
Seat 7: DiogenesDog (1410 in chips)
Seat 8: KDawg0002 (1400 in chips)
Seat 9: Morphy3 (1810 in chips)
ecBart: posts small blind 10
SYF21: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to KDawg0002 [Kc Ac]
Swami: folds
DiogenesDog: folds
KDawg0002: raises 20 to 40
Morphy3: folds
ebeseken: folds
cashfan: folds
ecBart: folds
SYF21: raises 1400 to 1440 and is all-in
KDawg0002: calls 1360 and is all-in
*** FLOP *** [4d 5s 6d]
*** TURN *** [4d 5s 6d] [9s]
DiogenesDog said, "omg"
Swami said, "wow"
*** RIVER *** [4d 5s 6d 9s] [4s]
ecBart said, "how did you know"
*** SHOW DOWN ***
SYF21: shows [3s 7d] (a straight, Three to Seven)
KDawg0002: shows [Kc Ac] (a pair of Fours)
ecBart said, "lol"
SYF21 collected 2810 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 2810 | Rake 0
Board [4d 5s 6d 9s 4s]
Seat 1: ebeseken folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: cashfan (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: ecBart (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 4: SYF21 (big blind) showed [3s 7d] and won (2810) with a straight, Three to Seven
Seat 5: Swami folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: DiogenesDog folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: KDawg0002 showed [Kc Ac] and lost with a pair of Fours
Seat 9: Morphy3 folded before Flop (didn't bet)

I mean anything can happen but...

[mike4066]

I'll start by addressing the minimum raise.
Raise for a purpose.
To add money to the pot or to put someone out of a hand.
Minimum raises don't serve either purpose.


Calling an all-in with AKo? Bad Idea.
It's a tiny pot, 50 chips, don't bother with it. Your getting horrible odds. Let him risk 1500 chips to win 50. Don't feed into him.

[Humphrind]

Calling an all-in with AKo? Bad Idea.

His AK was suited. But I will still agree with you. On a drawing hand, with this pot, in a tournament, fold. You will have plenty of chances to win pots later. Preflop you have to assume that anyone who would make SYFs move will have a pocket pair and you will probably be in a coin flip. In tournament play, you want to wait for a little better odds before you push all your chips in, especially on a call.

Mike was right. Raise, don't call. And I'm sure people will disagree with this, but don't call this all in with AKs. At least not in this situation.

[MrSlippery]

First of all, it was AKs. Second of all, I min-raised because I wanted someone to play the hand.

Two hands before that I raised 3XBB on TT and everyone bailed. The dude went all-in on 73os. Do you think he would have played any differently had I raised 5xBB?

[KidThreat]

I'll tell you the same thing a guy told me after putting me out of a tourney with QQ vs T6o. "Any two cards can win."

[Humphrind]

Do you think he would have played any differently had I raised 5xBB?

Yes.

Unless this is a crazy player who is just trying to leave, or planned to bluff this pot before he saw the cards, this player is not going to re-raise into a big raise, but a minimum raise shows you don't have much strength, and he is just trying to steal your blinds. Maybe this is what you wanted?

Your minimum pre-flop raise will promote 4-6 players (possibly including the big blind no matter what he has) but you want to play this heads up or 3 way at the most.

[mike4066]

First of all, it was AKs. Second of all, I min-raised because I wanted someone to play the hand.

Two hands before that I raised 3XBB on TT and everyone bailed. The dude went all-in on 73os. Do you think he would have played any differently had I raised 5xBB?

Your right it was sooted, sorry I missed that.

You took down the blinds with TT. Thats a good raise, especially late in a tourney. Early on it doesn't make that much of a difference. If I see TT and I take down the blinds I'm happy I didn't have to fight the over cards. If they will bail to a 3xBB raise then keep 3xBB raising. Don't change your game for then, they will adjust to you. Pick a Preflop raise and stick with it. Don't change, don't give them more information than they need.


How about thinking about it like this.
You raise 3x BBs everyone folds. 2 hands later you make a weaker minimum raise. The BB thinks this is a weak raise and feels he can push you off your pot with an all-in bet and tries it. He's screwed when you call, but catches a miracle board.
That is why I say don't vary your preflop bets. You 3x raise TT, Minimum raise AK, 4-5x raise KK 8x raise AA. Do you see a pattern? the stronger someones hand the stronger the preflop raise? I'm not saying your this transparent but I see it all the time in the low level SnG's. People throw ALL-IN with QQ,KK,AA and hopes someone cold calls with AK and the QQ holds up.

If he would have had KK you would have been dominated, AA and you would have been screwed. The point is your in a tournament, you should try to AVOID coinflips whenever possible. The guy could have been moving all in With 22-QQ and you would have lost to a coinflip.

Try to avoid putting all your chips in at any given time.
DEFINATLY try to avoid putting all your chips into a coinflip (unless your very short stacked).

If he would have turned over 66 and you lost would you still be so upset?

I'm not trying to be a jerk, we've all been through the same thing. Next time you run into a hand like this post it without the showdown results, and I think receive similar comments from some of the tourny players.

[MrSlippery]

Listen, I'm not even pissed. Mostly, I found it amusing which is why I posted it.

But if you can guarantee me that every time I have AKs that someone will go all-in with 73o, I will call it every time and take my chances.

I'm not calling this a bad beat. I'm not crying about it. I just got outdrawn and found it amusing.

[krazyace5]

People get crazy in some tournys, this guy read you for weak and got lucky.

You should always raise the same amount preflop whether it is AA or AK or TT....even AK sooted! Maybe the occasional rags if you have a good read on the table. That way no one will ever be able to put you on a hand.

Trust me, they might fold a time or two but sooner than later they are gonna get mad and think you are stealing and start calling you. Look at the all-in morons(maybe not?) they go all in alot and people start calling them with weaker hands cause they are sick of it.


This reminds me of a sit n go I had last week, first hand and I am third to act and look down at AA. I thought what the heck when will I have this chance again and I go all in. Everyone folds and I take down the measly blinds. A few players went nuts moanin and groanin about what a nut I was, of course they did not know what I had. And rest of tourny they thought I did not know what I was doing. Ended up going out in third, but it was one of the funnest SNG I have done in a long time, wish I woulda saved a transcript of that chat, actually I may have it, if I do I will post it in a separate thread.

LOL, Sorry to hijack your thread.