Tell me my play was correct here

[TylerK]

Until the river card, I had the best hand. Should I have bet bigger at any point to try to drive out drawing hands? My fear was that someone else may have hit a set.
CARDSON
***** Hand History for Game 1278624458 *****
$25 NL Hold'em - Thursday, December 09, 08:00:53 EDT 2004
Table Table 23835 (Real Money)
Seat 6 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 2: joeshaggs ( $10.75 )
Seat 5: shen266 ( $27.05 )
Seat 9: brizmt ( $94.95 )
Seat 10: urbeatfold ( $23 )
Seat 4: TylerK_ ( $19.1 )
Seat 8: olythegoalie ( $22.45 )
Seat 1: Leikar ( $11.25 )
Seat 3: monarch1111 ( $84.3 )
Seat 7: elbo99 ( $28.05 )
Seat 6: Manoukian ( $22 )
elbo99 posts small blind [$0.25].
olythegoalie posts big blind [$0.5].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to TylerK_ [ 3d 5d ]
brizmt folds.
urbeatfold folds.
Leikar calls [$0.5].
joeshaggs calls [$0.5].
monarch1111 calls [$0.5].
TylerK_ calls [$0.5].
shen266 calls [$0.5].
Manoukian calls [$0.5].
elbo99 calls [$0.25].
olythegoalie checks.
** Dealing Flop ** [ 9c, 3h, 5h ]
elbo99 checks.
olythegoalie checks.
Leikar bets [$2].
joeshaggs folds.
monarch1111 calls [$2].
TylerK_ raises [$4].
shen266 calls [$4].
Manoukian folds.
elbo99 folds.
olythegoalie folds.
Leikar calls [$2].
monarch1111 calls [$2].
** Dealing Turn ** [ Qd ]
Leikar checks.
monarch1111 checks.
TylerK_ bets [$4].
shen266 calls [$4].
Leikar is all-In.
monarch1111 folds.
TylerK_ calls [$2.75].
shen266 calls [$2.75].
** Dealing River ** [ 9s ]
TylerK_ checks.
shen266 bets [$8].
TylerK_ folds.
shen266 shows [ 9h, 8h ] three of a kind, nines.
Leikar doesn't show [ Jh, Jd ] two pairs, jacks and nines.
shen266 wins $8 from side pot #1 with three of a kind, nines.
shen266 wins $38.25 from the main pot with three of a kind, nines.
monarch1111 has left the table.

[lolzzz_321]

First of all don't call the blind to play 35 suited . This crap always end up happening to you.

I do not think betting bigger woukd have driven out anyone here. Shen was probably commited to his flush draw, plus he had top pair on the board. And you know leikar can't lay down those Jacks, seeing as he can beat the board. Once that 9 comes at least you know you're beat, good laydown.

The other players were commited to their cards, so there was no way to drive them out.

[Fnord]

Better bigger earlier. Worse hands will gladly call.

[a500lbgorilla]

Better bigger earlier. Worse hands will gladly call.

TylerK_ raises [$4].

You were leading them on with bottom two pair.

-'rilla

[|~|ypermegachi]

definitely raise the size of the pot on the flop to stop any potential flush drawers.

[Fortune 500]

Your biggest mistake was calling with a 3-5 preflop. Unless you're checking from the BB, you gotta make that lay down. If you do play it, bet bigger on the flop to scare out the draws. You're only going to get action from higher pairs and two pair here. When that last 9 falls, you've gotta back off. You're beat, and it's quite obvious.

[TylerK]

Your biggest mistake was calling with a 3-5 preflop. Unless you're checking from the BB, you gotta make that lay down. If you do play it, bet bigger on the flop to scare out the draws. You're only going to get action from higher pairs and two pair here. When that last 9 falls, you've gotta back off. You're beat, and it's quite obvious.

Ok, that's the second time starting hand selection has been mentioned in this thread. This isn't limit. Playable hands depend on the situation, not on some chart.

So no, playing that hand wasn't a mistake, multiple people have already mentioned betting bigger on the flop, I DID check/fold on the river, so your post essentially has no content in it. What exactly do you think you're accomplishing by adding another post to this thread?

[|~|ypermegachi]

playing 35s was not a mistake in this hand. from the looks of it, it was a VERY passive table. by limping he's already getting 8:1 odds. in limit this would be a terrible move as 53s is too weak and doesn't get lucky enough. in NL the implied odds are their entire stack. definitely worth it in this passive table.

{This post has been removed}

[TylerK]

Hyper I totally disagree that he should be playing this hand for anything other than the flush. If someone is betting top pair....his to pair gets spanked if the board pairs. Too many ways to get beat here. I play this hand only for the flush or if I happen to land trips on the flop with a paired board. Especially if there is a raiser ahead of him which there was. This is a no brainer fold pre flop

No raise preflop...

{This post has been removed}

[TylerK]

ohhhh my bad :P

This is not to say that I would never call a raise with these cards in certain situations.

[LeFou]

I say play 'em when the time is right. This is not a starting hand problem.

As ripp implies, it's a "what are LSCs (little suited connectors) good for?" Flushes. Straights if you really know your way around. Not trips -- at least not for many chips Not pairs. Maybe two pairs. Definitely not "three pair" -- which you know and made it an easy if painful river fold.

I like to think I'd immediately go all-in with the 2pair. You want one caller, and here are the types who'll call

people who think you're bluffing (overcards) - you're a 90% fav
TPTK: you're 69%
overpair: 71%
flush draw: 56%
top pair w/flush draw: 48% -- coinflip, you're a tiny dog
sets (9s unlikely w/no PF raise) -- 90% dog. If you've got a strategy for beating sets, I'd love to hear it.

In short, you're way way ahead, but any card that comes out will likely hurt you. End it if you can.

[TylerK]

I like to think I'd immediately go all-in with the 2pair.

You're just saying that because all 4 of the 2 pair are red cards.

Seriously though, nice post. That's exactly what I should have done...I guess I was worried someone might have hit a set or something, and I really don't know why.

Edit: didn't even see your last line about sets. Well said.

[Fortune 500]

Ok, that's the second time starting hand selection has been mentioned in this thread. This isn't limit. Playable hands depend on the situation, not on some chart.

So no, playing that hand wasn't a mistake, multiple people have already mentioned betting bigger on the flop, I DID check/fold on the river, so your post essentially has no content in it. What exactly do you think you're accomplishing by adding another post to this thread?

You're right. I didn't read closely enough that you made the laydown at the end, and that's my fault.

I also had no indication that this was a passive table. You can argue if you like about starting hand selection and situation, but 3-5 preflop is bad starting hand selection anywhere other than the big blind, as far as I'm concerned.

[TylerK]

Ok, that's the second time starting hand selection has been mentioned in this thread. This isn't limit. Playable hands depend on the situation, not on some chart.

So no, playing that hand wasn't a mistake, multiple people have already mentioned betting bigger on the flop, I DID check/fold on the river, so your post essentially has no content in it. What exactly do you think you're accomplishing by adding another post to this thread?

You're right. I didn't read closely enough that you made the laydown at the end, and that's my fault.

I also had no indication that this was a passive table. You can argue if you like about starting hand selection and situation, but 3-5 preflop is bad starting hand selection anywhere other than the big blind, as far as I'm concerned.

Didn't mean to rip your head off. But I really think this is a playable hand either
a) at a passive table with a lot of people seeing the flop, unraised PF, or
b) against 1, possibly 2 players in a raised pot if the player(s) have a stack equal to or larger than mine.

[TDM100]

I blame this hand on Leikar & his J's.
If he would have done what he was supposed to do,
raise pre-flop, you, I think, would have NOT been there.
Serves him right for losing!
Ha!
Teach you to slow-play those damn things.

Best you could have done was to go AI on the flop.
But I sense Leikar would have followed, you would have lost anyways.
Can't say I would AI there, bottom 2 pr and all.
I'm not raising there either, I think I understand why you did it tho.
I wouldn’t be that proud with bottom two pair there, myself.
That many people on a "cheap" flop, there’s always a 9 out there.
A9 K9 Q9 T9 89 and such.
Rarely fails.
Be thankful shen266 Bet $8 on the river, for if it was me, I would have tried to milk ya.
$2 bet there maybe, trying to get ya to challenge me.
Good FOLD BTW.
Count it up as just another chitty hand with Luck toying with your ass.

I wrote this and then read the other posts to see if I added anything new.
<I think I did, I blamed the JJ’s>
I AIN’t blasting ya for playin 35 suited here!
Sometimes you gotta F’in gamble you know.
That nine on the River could just as easily been a 5 or a 3 black.
Then you would have looked like a fricking GENIUS!

I find it more pleasing playin 53s
any day
at anytime
over the prospect of going on STRIKE over my dumbass kid’s and doing so by moving my ass to a tent in my front yard!
lol
Compared to that you are a Genius!

[LeFou]

Best you could have done was to go AI on the flop.
But I sense Leikar would have followed, you would have lost anyways.

Not so. Maybe in this hand. But overpairs are exactly who you WANT to be calling. All you have to fear (i.e. try to read) are sets and top-pair with flush draw (which you shouldn't fear anyway, as I said it's a flip)

That many people on a "cheap" flop, there’s always a 9 out there.
A9 K9 Q9 T9 89 and such.

All of which get pwned by you over the long run.

[jokerindapack]

Sometimes for a change of pace you might want to play hands like 3/5s or higher to switch things up a bit and let the players at the table know that you don't mess around (especially if you hit on the flop and raise huge).

Looking at the hand further IMO I think the only way you win this hand is if you push AI on the turn. Leikar checks seeing the Q and if he's TPa he might fold the Jacks (it would also save him some embaressment since he didn't raise with it pre-flop). Shen has about a %20 chance to make his hand and if he is TPa as well you could've taken down the pot. Again JMO any thoughts to this Tyler...or anyone else for that matter.

Other than that you played the hand well.

[TDM100]

Not so. Maybe in this hand.

I am only talking about this hand!
I understand with what you’re saying and depending on the situation, other than this one of course, I tend to agree.
The quote you highlighted is to be read in TOTAL with my other remarks as to why I wouldn’t go AI here, for this situation.
Heck I have no other knowledge that any other players are slow-playing pocket 9’s for instance!
With that many players on this flop, there’s a good chance they are!
You wanna do it LeFou, Go Right Ahead bud!
I’ll pass!
As I already explained, I know there is a 9 out there.
It’s a high probability in my opinion he gonna have a kicker too!
Proper to play A9s hearts here for example.
Aint no reason whoever holding that is NOT going to be there waiting for the turn either.
He sure enough gonna be following anything I’m gonna be doing with 53d!
It would be proper to call my AI!
Jesus!
I aint stepping into that by going all in.
By all means LeFou, you go right ahead holding that 53 diamonds!

I just witnessed the EP BET $2, another guy call, four more to go after me!
HELL NO!
Thank you very much.
Aint gonna do it!
As I stated, I wouldn’t be raising such as TylerK did.
I understand why he did though, as stated.
I would be tempted to do the same.
Just way too many players involved and me being in MP, I’m not doing it!
I have no idea what the four behind me is holding!
I have a pretty good idea what the two in front are saying tho, with a $2 bet.
ALL OF WHICH WAS THE PROPER THING FOR THEM TO DO BTW in hindsight!
I am comfortable waiting to see if anybody else is going to call that $2! And in hindsight, I aint knocking either of those two out of here by going AI!
Hell they just told me they are playin for some of this pot!
FROM THE EP Position!
In front of five other dudes!
No thank you!
Aint my style of play.

*******************************
I'm new here, and also new to this type of board,
how does one get the name of the quoted person to appear in your post.
I failed to find a help link anywhere to assist me.

[|~|ypermegachi]

if you're not going to raise with 2 pair what are you going to raise with? constantly assuming someone has a better hand will make you fold a lot of winners.

[lolzzz_321]

If u would have gone all in after the flop, u know u would have lost... It is Party Poker, no way they r gonna lay their hands down.

But in other hands maybe not. Start an exepriment by going all in with the bottom two pair, I always get screwed when I do. I think I have a post on it.

I went all in with bottom two pair here:

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...611&highlight=

[/url]

[Bite]

It doesn't really matter if he would have lost the hand if he got his money in on the flop. The other guy would have made a huge mistake by calling him and that's what counts. Getting ur money in when ur a favourite. The turn bet was really weak. Bet at least pot and if u do this u might as well get ur whole stack in since u'll be commited anyway. The flop bet was almost ok (could have been a little bit bigger). Turn bet was terrible imho.

About the preflop play. I can't be arsed to count on it seriously but with these small stacks (compared to blinds) the implied odds really shrink up and playing big cards preflop and getting the rest in on the flop if u hit should be more +EV than limping with garbage on a table like this. You have to take into considerations the times u DO hit ur hand but doesn't get paid as well. And on PP+skins they don't favour good flop play with a max buyin of 50bb.