tough KK hand

[IowaSkinsFan]

Game #1384313591 - (blinds $0.05/$0.10) No Limit Texas Hold'em - 2006/03/30-21:33:32.7 (CST) Table "Dominica" (real money) -- Seat 7 is the button Seat 1: dabastone ($0.00 in chips) Seat 2: rustyy ($18.79 in chips) Seat 3: JMW01 ($9.30 in chips) Seat 4: spade321 ($23.80 in chips) Seat 5: zaphodb73 ($17.30 in chips) Seat 6: Z.E.P. ($9.85 in chips) Seat 7: bacmayday ($8.50 in chips) Seat 8: redgrape ($27.10 in chips) Seat 9: smarauder6801 ($6.96 in chips) Seat 10: skibum455 ($4.90 in chips)
redgrape: Post Small Blind ($0.05)
smarauder6801: Post Big Blind ($0.10)
Dealt to redgrape [ Kh ]
Dealt to redgrape [ Ks ]
skibum455: Call ($0.10)
rustyy : Fold
JMW01 : Call ($0.10)
spade321: Call ($0.10)
zaphodb73: Call ($0.10)
Z.E.P. : Fold
bacmayday: Fold
redgrape: Raise ($1)
spade321 said, "go all n"
smarauder6801: Fold
skibum455: Fold
JMW01 : Fold
spade321: Call ($0.95)
zaphodb73: Fold
*** FLOP *** : [ 5c 8s 2s ]
redgrape: Bet ($2)
spade321: Call ($2)
*** TURN *** : [ 5c 8s 2s ] [ 9d ]
redgrape: Bet ($4.50)
spade321: Call ($4.50)
*** RIVER *** : [ 5c 8s 2s 9d ] [ 6h ]
redgrape: Bet ($7)
spade321: Raise ($16.25)
spade321 said, "go all n"
redgrape said, "wow this sucks"
redgrape: Fold
spade321: Winner -- doesn't show cards
*** SUMMARY ***
Pot: $28.10 | Rake: $1.40
Board: [ 5c 8s 2s 9d 6h ]
dabastone didn't bet
rustyy didn't bet (folded)
JMW01 lost $0.10 (folded)
spade321 bet $23.80, collected $37.35, net +$13.55
zaphodb73 lost $0.10 (folded)
Z.E.P. didn't bet (folded)
bacmayday didn't bet (folded)
redgrape lost $14.55 (folded) [ Kh Ks ] (a pair of kings) smarauder6801 lost $0.10 (folded)
skibum455 lost $0.10 (folded)

[IowaSkinsFan]

It's not that i'm fearing a 7 here, though it's possible... i think he slowplayed a set.

[jackvance]

So.. on the river, after the reraise, you would have to put about $9 into $47 pot. Or 1/5. A 7 has you beat, as does any set. The hands that could prompt him to do this minraise could be plentiful that you beat too: like A9, A8, K9, QQ, JJ, TT. I'd say that's well worth the 1/5th you have to pay at this point! (plus he called a 10BB raise.. pp is possible, but anything with a 7 isn't all that likely) I'd actually say you have more of a chance of being ahead than behind here.

Call it!

About the play before that, your raises are rather small compared to the pot.. it's profitable for your opponents to chase draws this way. Plus they won't pay off as much on your good hands. (and KK on that flop is a GREAT hand)

[Miffed22001]

check raise the flop.

[IowaSkinsFan]

check raise the flop.

1. How do i know he's gonna bet?

2. why?



on jackvances post:

yeah i didn't really think about pot odds at the time... Although i really find it hard to believe this person would raise the river into someone who's bet close to pot every street. It could be a bluff, but i have no read...

[jackvance]

Put yourself in his position. He doesn't know what you have. All he sees is a low board and if he has A9 or TT/JJ/QQ he might think you're trying to steal the pot easy. That last $7 might have also come off as a weak attempt at a bluff. And remember, you only have to invest 20% here, so you don't need to be even 50% sure you can win!

[Renton]

Well played, except check/fold the river.

[jackvance]

Well played, except check/fold the river.

This is 10NL. They'll throw this stuff on the river even with Q9.

Here's how my last hand on 10NL played out. One limper, everyone fold to me on the BB. I'm holding A6o. Nothing flop with an A. Possible flush draw. Let's see if he has the A, I raise. He thinks long and calls. Hm. Blank on the turn. I raise again, hope he folds, otherwise I'd be in trouble. Due to my read I knew he wouldn't have a great hand, but A6 is kinda low. He calls. River gives me a 6. Pfew! I know I win now. I raise what I think he'll call. He pushes me all-in! Call. You know what he had?

A4.

[Renton]

Even 10nl players make sets.

[jackvance]

In the long run, you'll lose out on money if you're gonna fold these kinds of situations all the time.

[Miffed22001]

1. How do i know he's gonna bet?

2. why?

1. You dont. But look at that board. It isnt likely to have helped your hand in most cases. Therefore offer guy behind a chance to buy it or bet if he has something. Although it does mean were playing a big pot at times with *only* KK but at 10nl that probably means opp likes tp (any pair!) enough to stack off against our better hand.

2. I only use it at times, not a lot. So just add it to the different lines you can use to play a flop of undercards with a big pp. One of the great things about 10nl is that players make horrible decisions. So a check raise on a raggy flop just looks like bullshit to a lot of 10nl players so playing big pots at times with donks here is something a check raise will achieve because they'll call the raise with any part. The problem of course is not paying better hands.

You know what he had?

A4.

Flush draw or any pair more often imo. Id just push the turn if opp hasnt shown any ability other than to be a calling station.

Note, i play for stacks with a lot of these guys because i know theyll call with weaker holdings. So while the check raises are rather large its becasue i know they suck that bad.
This guy was just shit so my player notes said.

- r5samyng87 sitting in seat 1 with $20.70
- BLONDSUSAN sitting in seat 3 with $14.67
- Miffed sitting in seat 4 with $11.05 [Dealer]
- sisimi sitting in seat 5 with $2.75
- billythedraw sitting in seat 6 with $9.50

sisimi posted the small blind - $0.05
billythedraw posted the big blind - $0.10
** Dealing card to Miffed: Jack of Diamonds, Jack of Spades
r5samyng87 folded
BLONDSUSAN called - $0.10
Miffed raised - $0.60
sisimi folded
billythedraw folded
BLONDSUSAN called - $0.60

** Dealing the flop: 7 of Hearts, 3 of Spades, 6 of Clubs
BLONDSUSAN checked
Miffed bet - $0.80
BLONDSUSAN called - $0.80

** Dealing the turn: 10 of Hearts
BLONDSUSAN checked
Miffed went all-in - $9.65
BLONDSUSAN called - $9.65
BLONDSUSAN shows: 10 of Clubs, Ace of Hearts

** Dealing the river: 5 of Spades
Miffed wins $21.95 from the main pot

And this is how horrible some players are to a check raise

- darshan19 sitting in seat 1 with $4.95
- misirlou13 sitting in seat 2 with $9.16 [Dealer]
- Flippe83 sitting in seat 3 with $10.40
- Miffed sitting in seat 4 with $18.39
- rykopoker sitting in seat 5 with $17.52
- imutata sitting in seat 6 with $3.55

Flippe83 posted the small blind - $0.05
Miffed posted the big blind - $0.10
darshan19 posted to play - $0.05
** Dealing card to Miffed: Ace of Spades, Queen of Clubs
rykopoker called - $0.10
imutata called - $0.10
darshan19 called - $0.10
misirlou13 folded
Flippe83 called - $0.10
Miffed bet - $0.50
rykopoker folded
imutata called - $0.50
darshan19 called - $0.50
Flippe83 folded

** Dealing the flop: 4 of Hearts, Jack of Spades, Queen of Diamonds
Miffed checked
imutata checked
darshan19 bet - $0.90
Miffed raised - $2.70
imutata folded
darshan19 went all-in - $3.60
Miffed called
darshan19 shows: Jack of Diamonds, King of Diamonds

** Dealing the turn: 3 of Hearts

** Dealing the river: 8 of Hearts
Miffed wins $10.40 from the main pot

[freechus9]

I check/call a reasonable bet on that river but play the rest the same. I don't think opp has a set here that often. Looks like a shitty attempt at a bluff to me. What did he show down?

[IowaSkinsFan]

he didn't show down... so i have no idea

[jackvance]

Very nice c/r miffed. You had two callers, TPTK, one of em must have hit something below you. A reraise is so much of a challenge it's often hard to resist lol