HU 5/10: 5 bet shove AJ OOP preflop?

[pocketfours]

I've been facing a lot of 5 bet shoves from AJ lately by HS regulars (when playing with 100BB deep stacks). My 4 bet (IP) has been about 35BB. Why do they think a shove with AJ is profitable? What do they think I'm 4 betting with IP? Garbage?

I only need to put in 65BB to a 135BB pot (getting slightly better than 2:1) so I almost never fold. 95% of the time I have at least AQo when I 4 bet IP and I'm very happy that they keep doing this against me, just wondering what I'm missing here. Are they playing -EV for metagame or what?

[crazycrazy]

except AJ, what is their shove range against 4 bet ?
cant i t have something to do with ur other actions or they do it against other ppl too ?

[pocketfours]

Well AJ is the worst hand I've seen shoves with regularly. JJ+ are obvious shoving hands.

I very rarely 4 bet in HU before the stacks get 150BB deep or more, but I got baffeled when I saw this scenario happen three times in just a couple of days.

I'm sure they do it against others as well since they can't think that I 4 bet weak (because I don't) and they can't think that I fold easily to a shove (because I don't).

[IowaSkinsFan]

Seems like they suck if that's the case, or are just completely misplaying you. If you get into some huge light threebet/fourbet wars AJ is an okay hand but really not very good still.

[pocketfours]

Seems like they suck if that's the case, or are just completely misplaying you. If you get into some huge light threebet/fourbet wars AJ is an okay hand but really not very good still.

Yes, exactly what I'm thinking. And in these cases I was talking about there was no betting wars going on at all.

Perhaps they think I'm folding AQ because it's only 25% against QQ+, AK? LOL if that's the case.

Here is another hand from last week with overplayed AJ. This villain is multitabling 5-8 1knl - 10knl tables and he shoves from the button. Only the second hand in the session.

Texas Hold'em $10-$20 NL (real money)

Seat 3: BUTTON ($990.00 in chips)
Seat 8: HERO ($1,010.00 in chips)
ANTES/BLINDS
BUTTON posts blind ($5), HERO posts blind ($10).

PRE-FLOP
BUTTON bets $25, HERO bets $125, BUTTON bets $960 and is all-in, HERO calls $855.
BUTTON shows [ AH,JC ]
HERO shows [ QS,AS ]

I don't get it...

[crazycrazy]

if he 8table HS tables he is prolly not total moron... i mean,cos u dont fold AQ dont mean many ppl wont, they still fold there big range and his move may not be so bad and among u 2 next time he do it to you he do it with KK+ and u give him EV- call.

[sauce123]

seems kinda dumb

[pocketfours]

if he 8table HS tables he is prolly not total moron... i mean,cos u dont fold AQ dont mean many ppl wont, they still fold there big range and his move may not be so bad and among u 2 next time he do it to you he do it with KK+ and u give him EV- call.

Yes, probably not a moron. I haven't seen this 4 bet shove with AJ more than this one time though. The 5 bet shoves are more common and make slightly more sense if they think I will fold AQ.

He can't tighten his 5 betting range to only KK+. It would mean that he would almost always need to fold to a 4 bet. Besides, you can never fold AK/QQ+ in HU preflop for 100BB.

[crazycrazy]

if he 8table HS tables he is prolly not total moron... i mean,cos u dont fold AQ dont mean many ppl wont, they still fold there big range and his move may not be so bad and among u 2 next time he do it to you he do it with KK+ and u give him EV- call.

Yes, probably not a moron. I haven't seen this 4 bet shove with AJ more than this one time though. The 5 bet shoves are more common and make slightly more sense if they think I will fold AQ.

He can't tighten his 5 betting range to only KK+. It would mean that he would almost always need to fold to a 4 bet. Besides, you can never fold AK/QQ+ in HU preflop for 100BB.

hm. why couldnt he ? i mean just against u. he dont shove his shoving range everytime. sometime he jus call and play pots with them or i'm wrong ?

[pocketfours]

hm. why couldnt he ? i mean just against u. he dont shove his shoving range everytime. sometime he jus call and play pots with them or i'm wrong ?

You can't really call a 4 bet OOP and 'play a pot'. Usually better to just shove (or fold of course). The money is going in on the flop most of the time anyway if you just call.