Slevins lets do things properly

[LuckySlevin]

This is a fresh start for me. Over the past eight or so weeks I have had great success .... at being a losing player. It's clear to me that Poker is going to be a fairly large part of my life over the coming years, and yet I have a huge way to go before I even make it into a break even player.

The amazing consistency of my... below average play didn't seap in until I decided to browse my shark stats...



They say a picture speaks a thousand words and well I need to find a fix to this before it gets any worse!

My plans for the coming month or so is to start building some momentum behind my $300 bankroll which I'll be depositing in about 8 days.

I've recently watched Phil Gordons final table poker, and feel my insight into the game has doubled. Just because of the way it's consolidated various points that were there but not quite connected in my mind.

I feel myself getting to know forum regulars a little better now and am enjoying being able to develop a bit of a feel for who I'm speaking with. I'm enjoying becoming more active in peripheral non poker discussions, and I'm also enjoying being a sponge to information - instead of offering what little bits of fragmented poker knowledge I possess up to new members.

I'm not enjoying not playing poker... which is the situation I'm in at the moment thanks to having spent my bankroll and not being in a position to collect my pay cheque from work (have been working from home last week or so) - so I now have 8 days of watching poker to do. I'll remember this feeling and hopefully it will be a reminder next time I feel like calling that 'all in'.

I'm also going to read Skalinsky and Harrington, but I'm going to go and buy the books - because the ebooks just don't do them justice, since I've discovered poker I've spent more time in front of this computer than I have in my life, and considering I used to work in IT that's saying something. I'm 26 so have time to learn to become great at the game I think. But first things first, I need to at least start breaking even at the piddly stakes. I also need to take a more rounded approach to the game, there's more to it than simply becoming part of the furtniture in the poker stars lobby all day. This operation is going to stay with me for at least a year - hopefully I'll be able to look back on this first post this time next year and smile

[LuckySlevin]

OK. I've just had a mini realisation. They say the most profound things are the simplest.

I was laying in bed, with random thoughts floating around my head, not thinking about poker consciously and all of a sudden I get this thought. The thought is that if I had just joined a forum of neurosurgeons and had been talking with some of them, getting bits of advice here and there... the fact that I could pick up a scalpel and properly make a small incision without killing myself wouldn't mean I could perform surgery and it also wouldn't mean I could expect to make any money at all as a professional surgeon. Well in that instant it became clear to me that I've just had completely unrealisitic and lunatic expectations from my time in the forum and my small foray into the world of poker.

Just because some very experienced poker players are kind enough to give their advice and help complete amateurs, and just because I can 'play' poker at a whim thanks to the ease of online poker, does not mean that I should expect to be a winning player.

Poker is a profession and I need to look at it as such. You can't expect to climb the tiniest of tiny rungs on any career ladder in 8 weeks and yet that is what I've expected and more from my poker.

I had to come and write this while it was still fresh in my head. From now on I am not going to put unrealistic expectations on myself or my game. I am not going to expect to be anywhere near as good as advanced players that are making a living from the game, just because they post summaries of how they do it and are humble enough to speak to beginners in a down to earth unassuming fashion. This should not disguise the fact that most are virtual, if not, actual, professionals - and as such the chasm in understanding, ability, and earnings is huge between where I am now as a novice and where they stand.

This epiphany has also made me realise how lucky I am to be in such a community where a complete beginner has the benefit of so many different peoples experience and skills. I can not think of any other profession in which you can get virtual 1-1 tuition with experts who expect nothing back in return for their time than knowing that their time is not being wasted.

I should head back to bed now Where all this came from just before I was about to fall asleep I don't know, but I'm pleased it became clear to me, my perspective on what I expect from my game has changed big time, as has my appreciation of how lucky I am to have the benefit of so many talented players expertise.

[bjsaust]

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...nt-t73667.html

Notice how that thread was responded to by winning regs and ignored by losing beginners? Its not sexy, but its true.

It took me 3 months to become a winning player, and I was addicted to FTR from the start. Over a year later and I still have a LOT to learn and a lot of improvment ahead of me.

[Erpel]

Humility is so becoming. Now you just have to tackle your inner attention whore.

Solid couple of posts.

Don't think you won't ever have your ego inflate again. It will - be ready for it and be ready to nip it in the butt.

Don't think you can't play because you have no money on a site. I'm not saying play money (though I could) - you could play freerolls.

Watch poker instructional videos and not just WPT or WSOP coverage - the selection on FTR is pretty good. And of course read Sklansky, Harrington, Miller etc if available. Think about how you want your brain to be working and what you want your brain to be taking into account when you are stuck in a hand.

Sit down at 4 play money 'cash' tables - play for an hour to the best of your ability - spend the next 3-4 hours analysing your top ten winners and losers for that hour. Perform EV calculations, combinatorial hand reading, formulate your own ABCD ranges for every decision on every street etc etc. The fact that no money is at stake does not mean that there isn't a right and a wrong decision in each situation. Know which is which.

Also - don't deposit $300. You've managed to prove that you will go degenerate and gamble away a whole bankroll - there's no reason to put more than a minimal amount in before you have proven to yourself that you can play poker without just burning money. Deposit $100 and play 5nl buying in for only $5 even though the tables allow $10. You need to be used to stack sizes around 100bb. As some recent posts in the beginner forum pointed out - how expensive do you want your lessons to be? That's where you should play. You're not a winning player - you are (hopefully) a learning player.

When thinking of applying the ABCD theorem to the hand ranges you play, and how you play them you can do this on a completely level 0 level of thinking. By this I mean - it doesn't matter if the opponent is an idiot and makes stupid spewy plays - you need to know what the right decision is in a vacuum before you take the opponents tendencies into account - otherwise you'll just be spewing yourself. Know which decision is the right one and which hand ranges are most profitable. This argument supports learning those lessons even at play money or 2nl, but you want some action and have decided on 5nl - fine. Just don't give yourself enough of a bankroll that you think you can 'take shots' right off the bat. There's also nothing wrong with playing a $2 stack at 2nl. Judge success by lessons not by winnings.

You need to get to know your inner degenerate and find out how to prevent him controlling all your poker decisions. You should probably make it a point to read Chardrian's post that he linked in one of your threads once per week or once per month until you feel that you have formulated a response to your inner degenerate that is effective.

[redpalo]

Also - don't deposit $300. You've managed to prove that you will go degenerate and gamble away a whole bankroll - there's no reason to put more than a minimal amount in before you have proven to yourself that you can play poker without just burning money.

Maybe a little of my current mindset can add to this thought and help you prepare right for your paycheck. I am expecting a large bonus, in fact it's late coming in the mail, should have been here by now. Over 12,000.00. Frankly, I am terrified.

Since I knew it was coming, I have been working very hard on my poker, knowing I need to hone my skills now, before it comes... so I can invest a small portion of it in my poker.

I'm investing that money in myself, and I'm not yet 100% convinced that "I" am the best place to put my money. I am playing now with my tiny BR, always thinking... if I can manage this well, I won't squander that bonus. If I can learn not to tilt now, work through the basics of the psychology with myself, prepare myself, learn to play solid poker, I can invest some money in myself, and know that at least the investment is safe from being lost and eventually will turn out (hopefully) to be the best investment I ever made.

So, well it's just how a I am, but if I were you I would learn to fear your paycheck, then make only a tiny investment to test yourself, and see if you're ready.

Good luck Slev

[LuckySlevin]

Thanks for the support guys. You speak a lot of sense and I think that's what I'll do. Just deposit small when my cheque clears and prove to myself I am capable of controlling a bankroll however small before upping my investment. After my realisation in the early hours of this morning I feel like I can see the wood from the trees a bit - which means I'm open to your good advice. Before my ego would have got in the way (I had a hard time persuading myself to deposit $300 from forum advice, it was going to be $1000 before others here persuaded me to lower it),

I'm going to check out a few free rolls today and give them 100% and analyse my hands afterwards.

[Erpel]

My problem (not much of one) with freerolls and sit and gos is that when you play them the correct play varies hand by hand based on stack sizes and blinds. A cash game is a somewhat more static set of parameters within to learn. I think cash is better for foundation lessons myself.

Consider the play money thing - remember you're not playing to win you're just playing to produce some hand history material that you can analyse and learn from.

You could use previously played cash/tournament hands, but with historic data it's tempting (to me) to dismiss a play as a stupid one I wouldn't do knowing what I know now - when you produce a small sample of hands deciding to play your very best then you don't have that excuse - in that moment, that was your best. Now learn from it.

[LuckySlevin]

Just a minute update guys, I was out this evening with my pool team it was our end of season meal. My salary still doesn't clear until next week, but I spent less than I budegeted for this evening so was able to deposit $40 into my PS account which I'm playing with now.

So far so good about 1/4 of a buy in up and Ive been playing 20 minutes. I love this game so much. I get a lot of enjoyment from it, and am looking forward to the day when I am a good player.

By the way I just pulled a bit of a stunt on the table - and would like to know your thoughts about it ,I haven't posted the Hand History but hopefully you will get the idea from my commentry. I have K 9 suited,and checked the blind. Flop comes queen, 2 queen, everyone checks to me and I bet .10 (5 bb's) everyone calls. So I'm guessing they are up to my bluff. Next card is another queen, checkd around to me again - I'm thinking the only way I'm winning this is with a bluff, so I bet $1 - a huge bet by our standards, represeting quads, everyone folded and I scoop the jackpot - 0.30 - was this an OK play? and did I play it well? I don't just want to win hands because I got lucky, but I felt the chances of one of them havinga queen after they all called my 0.10 raise was slim. I thought the only way I could win was with a good bluff, and it seemed to have worked. What do you think guys?

Thanks, Gary.

[CBAT]

Just a minute update guys, I was out this evening with my pool team it was our end of season meal. My salary still doesn't clear until next week, but I spent less than I budegeted for this evening so was able to deposit $40 into my PS account which I'm playing with now.

So far so good about 1/4 of a buy in up and Ive been playing 20 minutes. I love this game so much. I get a lot of enjoyment from it, and am looking forward to the day when I am a good player.

By the way I just pulled a bit of a stunt on the table - and would like to know your thoughts about it ,I haven't posted the Hand History but hopefully you will get the idea from my commentry. I have K 9 suited,and checked the blind. Flop comes queen, 2 queen, everyone checks to me and I bet .10 (5 bb's) everyone calls. So I'm guessing they are up to my bluff. Next card is another queen, checkd around to me again - I'm thinking the only way I'm winning this is with a bluff, so I bet $1 - a huge bet by our standards, represeting quads, everyone folded and I scoop the jackpot - 0.30 - was this an OK play? and did I play it well? I don't just want to win hands because I got lucky, but I felt the chances of one of them havinga queen after they all called my 0.10 raise was slim. I thought the only way I could win was with a good bluff, and it seemed to have worked. What do you think guys?

Thanks, Gary.

Lets say someone is slow playing their Q, you are making a HUGE bet at a pot that is just not worth it.

[LuckySlevin]

true but would they slow play to that extent? checking my initial raise, and then checking the thrd queen!?

[CBAT]

true but would they slow play to that extent? checking my initial raise, and then checking the thrd queen!?

I guess you're right, but the level that you are playing at, who the hell knows what these people are thinking/doing. It's pretty unpredictable. I just don't feel that $1 should be bet into a pot of $.30

[Muzzard]

you suck, but i hope you get better soon. Sorry to be negative but alot of your post are egocentric, just stop sucking and get better imo. Also stop asking dumb questions, research. If u cant find the answer then post, or else it looks like ur a lazy dumb fuck.

[LuckySlevin]

hmm thanks for your highly productive post. By the way a gutter mouth is usually indicative of an extremely low intellect. There's a saying.. something along the lines of if you haven't got anything to say don't say it. You *might* make yourself look like less of a twat if you heeded it. Second thougts I doubt it would make much difference. Knock yourself out.

[Muzzard]

*I'm too bad for this guys operation thread*

[Squeaky_Midget1]

Zeebo's Theorem - Nobody ever folded a full house.

Reasoning: Nobody is good enough to fold a monster. Most players aren't even good enough to fold a hand that looks like a monster but really isn't.

Application: There are two basic applications to this theory. The first is that if you put your opponent on a full house and you can beat them, don't be afraid to overbet/push the river. This is particularly true when there is three of a kind on the board. Players will call with an incredible range of full houses in that spot. It is true that some villain may fold 22 on a board with three aces. However, you have no way of knowing if they have 22 or TT so go ahead and felt them. You are losing value if you don't. And sometimes they'll call with 22 anyway.

The second thing to realize is to never try to bluff anyone off a full house. If you have 22 on a board with three Aces, don't expect to be able to push 66 off his hand.

This theorem also generally applies to any monster over monster situation, from straight flush over quads/FH/nut flush down to set over set.

Reliability: This is the most reliable theorem. Nearly 100%. Somebody will post and argue that it is actually 100%.

[LuckySlevin]

hmm thanks for your highly productive post. By the way a gutter mouth is usually indicative of an extremely low intellect. There's a saying.. something along the lines of if you haven't got anything to say don't say it. You might make yourself look like less of a twat if you heeded it.

Yeah ur right, i suk. I have no intellect and I'm a twat.sorry

Apology accepted. Now please (seriously) refrain from posting in my operation thread. Thank you.

[LuckySlevin]

Zeebo's Theorem - Nobody ever folded a full house.

Reasoning: Nobody is good enough to fold a monster. Most players aren't even good enough to fold a hand that looks like a monster but really isn't.

Application: There are two basic applications to this theory. The first is that if you put your opponent on a full house and you can beat them, don't be afraid to overbet/push the river. This is particularly true when there is three of a kind on the board. Players will call with an incredible range of full houses in that spot. It is true that some villain may fold 22 on a board with three aces. However, you have no way of knowing if they have 22 or TT so go ahead and felt them. You are losing value if you don't. And sometimes they'll call with 22 anyway.

The second thing to realize is to never try to bluff anyone off a full house. If you have 22 on a board with three Aces, don't expect to be able to push 66 off his hand.

This theorem also generally applies to any monster over monster situation, from straight flush over quads/FH/nut flush down to set over set.

Reliability: This is the most reliable theorem. Nearly 100%. Somebody will post and argue that it is actually 100%.

Thanks man, I see where you're coming from.

[chardrian]

learning to take advice/criticism from players, even ones w/potty mouths, will help you a lot more than disregarding them.

[LuckySlevin]

Well this guy actually sent me numerous pm's that were obscene, and edited his offensive post in my thread, it was far worse - he also 'offered me out' and wants to meet on the 30th... for a 'fight'. Trust me if there's one person I don't want advice from it's him. thanks for reading my thread though Chardrian I appreciate it.

[badgers]

Well this guy actually sent me numerous pm's that were obscene, and edited his offensive post in my thread, it was far worse - he also 'offered me out' and wants to meet on the 30th... for a 'fight'. Trust me if there's one person I don't want advice from it's him. thanks for reading my thread though Chardrian I appreciate it.

too funny

[Erpel]

If your Stars username is slev1n7 I'm seeing you sitting on 6 25nl tables.

I don't think this is wise.

[Erpel]

So I'm guessing they are up to my bluff. ... I'm thinking the only way I'm winning this is with a bluff....

I do this myself at times too - and it very quickly becomes a bad habit, especially if successful.

A good rule of thumb is that if you can only win through a bluff - stop right there. And fold. This case is made worse by your own suggestion that you think they know you were bluffing already. If you THINK they already see you as bluffing - why would you want to try bluffing again.

Now read this thread and think about it:
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...up-t74840.html

Bluffs require you to be able to tell what an opponent is going to do - and for this you need to know how he is thinking about poker and what he is thinking about you as a player. And bluffing should be relatively rare. Most bets should be backed by equity.

[LuckySlevin]

Hi Erpel I hope my new plan works only four days until I get some money and start propper.

lol 6 25nl tables I wish, my stars username is LkySlev1n - it's the -100% ROI on sharkscope, with 0 tournament cashins ;p

In fact I'm thinking of checking out some of the coaching sites and taking a coach on because I just seem to keep donking my money away - I've played a number of tournaments over the past few days while i've been waiting for my bankroll, just small ones like .10c upto $1 in all of them I haven't cashed once. So I think it might be time to seek out a good teacher before I start on any more money even when I do get paid on Thursday.

[bjsaust]

Seriously, its all here. Read the stickies in the relevant forums. It'd make a lot more sense to play a bunch of $1.20 tournies and read up on FTR then paying a coach with your roll.

[Biglines]

If you cant at least play break even poker at micro stakes based on the infomation that is available on FTR it might be an idea for you to give up playing poker.

Not being able to play break even poker based on the advice here points to a lack of discipline in your play. If you play in an undiscplined manner you will be playing hands that you should not be playing, and thus losing money.

A coach is not going to make any difference to your self discipline. That is something that only you can change. It sounds like you are trying to find a quick fix solution to being a poor player.

The way for you to get better is to actually accept that the people here know what they are talking about, and to follow the advice 100% of the time, rather than when you just feel like it.

Also rather then spending time posting stupid questions, use it to read the strategy articles on FTR.

[Muzzard]

Looks like things aren't improving greatly

[LuckySlevin]

muzzard if you still want to meet to 'fight' im happy too.

it's fucking pathetic though so sort it out fella.

there's enough idiots out there to ruck with till we're dead, I come to this forum, and this thread, for inspiration - it's the best online experience i've had. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt - maybe you was completely wankered or something when you was being a complete dick? I don't really care. I'm not interested in carrying on dicking around. I come here to improve my poker.

Good luck. Just forget it mate.

Gary.

[LuckySlevin]

Biglines - I'm open to most advice,with the exception of 'give up' it's not a phrase in my dictionary my friend.

thanks for the advice though, genuinely thanks for taking the time to write my friend.

[LuckySlevin]

Bjaust and Chardrian, thanks guys - I had a bit of a result today, deposited 40$ onto my card in a shop (it's a pay as you go card) and they screwed it up and put $60 on there, they spotted the mistake but couldn't reverse it and I convinced them there was no error so they let me have it. So I'm 20$ up before I even start. I'm going to grind 1$ odd 9 man sng's for the rest of the night, I'll hopefully have some decent results to post next update.

[LuckySlevin]

I've received an 'affiliate bonus' into my PS account is that part of my first depost bonus its 25$ which was nice!

[LuckySlevin]

>>> SBR : $57.62

Playing just SNG's for now the mini operation is to see how well I can do with this bankroll following good play, and BR management.

[CBAT]

I've received an 'affiliate bonus' into my PS account is that part of my first depost bonus its 25$ which was nice!

I think it means that you "referred" someone and they deposited onto Pokerstars.

[daven]

In fact I'm thinking of checking out some of the coaching sites and taking a coach on because I just seem to keep donking my money away - I've played a number of tournaments over the past few days while i've been waiting for my bankroll, just small ones like .10c upto $1 in all of them I haven't cashed once. So I think it might be time to seek out a good teacher before I start on any more money even when I do get paid on Thursday.

dude, not worth it. All the information is available here. I suggest avoiding the commune and blogs and ops forums for the next month, deciding on what your game of choice is gonna be (I suggest full ring cash cos it's gravy), reading all the relevant stickied posts, reading through a whole page of posts and really thinking about what's going on, etc. Your major leak to date has been discipline and playing with respect to sound bankroll principles. As for not cashing in tournaments, runs of 20 tournaments without cashing are not unheard of even for tournament pros playing their A-game. Don't stress it.

An offer - decide what games you're gonna play and we can do a hour or two session together sometime via teamviewer and skype - for free. I'm only suggesting this because I think explaining myself on standard plays may be of use to me, i'm not as altruistic as it may initially sound. And also because I'm taking a two week break from poker play to prove a point to myself... Best option is probably me playing a few tables of your game of choice at your limit of choice and playing super-standard ABC lines - I don't claim to be a good player, but I can generally beat micro-stakes no limit and limit holdem...

[Muzzard]

Looks like you lost the whole $60



I'm not trying to be an arse, just trying to get you to take some responsibility with your money and your roll. Keep reading and learning new things, it looks like ur game has serious leaks.

[badgers]

slevin it doesn't matter how good you are if you suck at BRM you will lose at poker. If you don't understand that give up now.

[daven]

slevin it doesn't matter how good you are if you suck at BRM you will lose at poker. If you don't understand that give up now.

qfmft

[kmind]

Good luck man. People are being (extremely) hard on you which sucks right now but just take a step back and read through posts/guides/free videos/programs/etc before you play again imo. Go through a bunch of hands and use different lines to see what hands will continue, what will fold, etc. Always think about their range and how it adjusts when you make a move. Think about every last detail in each hand and see what certain plays will make your opponents make a mistake. Sorry I can't really help out personally anymore, a little too busy rigt now.

[Muzzard]

slevs will probably not post here again.

[Jack Sawyer]

Um... WTF?

102778883 18-Aug-08 23:47 TURBO PL Omaha $11 4 -$11.50
102981402 18-Aug-08 23:13 NL Holdem $21.25 2 -$22.25
102960811 18-Aug-08 23:12 NL Holdem $10 45 -$11
102965198 18-Aug-08 23:03 FL HORSE $10 2 -$10.50
102970009 18-Aug-08 23:02 NL Holdem $1 9 -$1.20
102969670 18-Aug-08 23:01 NL Holdem $1 9 -$1.20
102971361 18-Aug-08 22:50 NL Holdem $1 9 -$1.20
102968425 18-Aug-08 22:47 NL Holdem $1 9 -$1.20


Patience, it seems, is not one of your virtues, young grasshopper

[swiggidy]

Hilarious

[Muzzard]

bump for update? Keep up the good BRM

103774939 23-Aug-08 06:42 NL Holdem $1 9 -$1.20
103772950 23-Aug-08 06:10 NL Holdem $1 9 -$1.20
103751135 23-Aug-08 04:46 TURBO NL Holdem $11 180 -$12
103654040 22-Aug-08 19:12 FL 7 Card Stud H/L $50 2 $47.50
103648637 22-Aug-08 18:52 FL 7 Card Stud H/L $20 2 -$21
102778883 19-Aug-08 03:47 TURBO PL Omaha $11 4 -$11.50
102981402 19-Aug-08 03:13 NL Holdem $21.25 2 -$22.25
102960811 19-Aug-08 03:12 NL Holdem $10 45 -$11

[lolzzz_321]

will someone like watch him play and tell him what he is doing wrong?

[daven]

will someone like watch him play and tell him what he is doing wrong?

i offered him a free hour of that (see my post above) - he doesn't seem interested...

also, note that he's playing omaha, stud, and no limit! That he has no ability to stick to bankroll management stuff. Etc. Another donor to the poker economy - i guess that's what he wants.

[kmind]

will someone like watch him play and tell him what he is doing wrong?

I offered to "coach" him for awhile for free but I kept telling him how important BR management was an he seemed to ignore that as well as post irritating things in the beginner's circle. Both things don't bode well with me. He's been really nice to me though and I like him, he just needs to be a bit more mature about this whole thing imo.

[animal_chin]

Needs to pay more attention to the title. Maybe he needs to donate a few more rolls before the importance of bankroll management starts to seep in.

[LuckySlevin]

Well you guys don't miss a trick good detective work!


Animal Chin, Badgers, Bjaust, Cbat, Chardrian,Erpel, Daven, Jack Sawyer, Kmind, Redpalo, Swiggidy, Squeeky, Triptanes - I salute you thanks for the comments!

Will be not quite as active over the coming couple of weeks. Will be easing off on poker for a bit, having just thrown another 100$ into the black hole that is my poker!

On the positve side I went to my first live game local the other night and lost just before the final table, it was a 2 tabler so not too bad for my first live game, I really enjoyed it.

I did commit more than one mistake though, in fact you could probabally have turned it into a mistakes to avoid video! haha... dropping a card when I was dealing the flop... Putting a card down too hard and slightly bending it... and calling and then changing my mind when I realised the blinds had gone up, were the three that spring to mind!

They were a great bunch though I was with a friend they knew which helped, they over looked all my mistakes after pointing them out and even gave me some poker magazines to read so all in all a good night

Daven thanks very much for your offer it's really appreciated. I'm having a break from poker now but may well take you up on that if you don't mind at some point in the future.

Kmind your past efforts at coaching me were much appreciated thanks again

For those that are interested just a quick update on where I am with things at the moment. I quit my job about a week ago, I'd been there four years, but cut a long story short - was given the option of a new job role which didn't appeal or leaving so I've left. My last pay check is next month so I plan to sort out a new job this coming week.

Tomorrow I'm playing in a pool competition, in a kind of funny way poker has helped me out there, because it makes me appreciate how 'good' I am at pool, it's all relative, but I'm a much better pool player than poker player lol!

Anyway thought I'd let you all know where I'm at - it might be a few weeks before the next update. Perhaps even longer who knows! But there will be an update eventually, and when I do start playing online again it will be with a vengence and AFTER having read quite a bit more than I have.

3:30am now I think I'll watch an epsisode of the sopranos that Triptanes friend kindly sorted out for me! Such a great series the Sopranos, watching the sopranos is in my top 5 favourite things to do at the moment! Thanks triptanes you the man

My nature is quite impulsive and compulsive (as you've probabally realised) two qualities which don't sit well with decent bankroll management. I will have another go but before I do I will commit to a month or so of dedicated study. Even after then if I will be able to manage a bankroll I don't know but I'll give it one more go!

I'm not going to play again until I've settled into my new job and have some money behind me, I've lived carefree and reckless so my poker degeneracy is more or less a reflection of my character. Once I've stablised into a decent job have some savings and have moved (all things that I want to do shortly) then I'll play again, and I'll probabally find I'm that much better at being responsible once those things are sorted.

Good luck with your poker everyone, although I won't be as active in my posting over the next couple of weeks I will certainly be checking up with all your operation threads - they're great reading. Cheers! Gary.

[sil693]

next time you make a deposit just deposit more and play the same stakes as me, whether im at 25NL or 50NL - people will respect your raises etc.

and if i can sit on your left it'll be gooooooooot imo.

[LuckySlevin]

well it's sunday evening bank holiday monday tomorrow I have no plans and a good few hours of boredom ahead of me. So I'm going to break my rule and deposit $40. I'm going to play just the 1+.10 $ sng's on pkr.com -this is my promise to myself, not to ONCE ignore this rule.
By typing this I hope it will force me to obey good br.

[LuckySlevin]

well I stepped outside of the rule slightly but definately within reason I'm pleased to say for the past hour or two I've managed to stick to the game plan and not be a poker degenerate. I did come close though - I nearly entered a 10$ tournament and then my past misdeeds and everyone from this forums advice came flooding to me before I entered and I chose otherwise. Instead I entered another 1$ and lost on the first hand to a set of 2's, against my two pair 7,8 on the flop - all in. I think someone up there is showing me as if it wasn't clear already why you play within a back roll. So I'm pleased I did.

At the end of the session my 40$ is now 50$, I entered two 1$ sng's, didn't place in one, and won the other which gave me a profit of about 3$. I also entered a cash game with a maximum buy in of 4$ , I bought in for 2$ and despite losing my first 2$ I managed to get the second buy in up to 20$ before losing some back to 12 odd $ and then deciding now would be a good time to leave the table.

So my 40$ is now 50$. It's late now about 3am so I'm going to get a bit of sleep, peaceful in the new found knowledge that I might at last be getting some sense, and possibly dare I say it, be starting to adhere to a BR plan!

I'd like to play some more but I was out most of the day and am feeling tired, and for the second time today I'm actually going to apply something I learnt from the forum and quit as I'm feeling tired.

*as I write i'm drinking bottled water, why does cold bottled water always taste that much more refreshing than a cup of tap water?! - or maybe it just tastes sweeter because I'm pleased with myself for the first time of actually sticking to a plan with my poker... it's only taken me almost two months!*

[daven]

I'm pleased to say for the past hour or two I've managed to stick to the game plan and not be a poker degenerate. I did come close though - I nearly entered a 10$ tournament and then my past misdeeds and everyone from this forums advice came flooding to me before I entered and I chose otherwise.

................. then

for the second time today I'm actually going to apply something I learnt from the forum and quit as I'm feeling tired.

very nice work. You may get there after all!
To succeed when starting out in poker you need:
a) Good bankroll management
b) a grasp of poker basics, and
c) ability/desire to learn are all you need...

sounds like you have c).
You understand the why of a), you just need to stick to it.
As for b) - hard to tell, but you're on FTR so if you're not there already then you'll be there soon. Go to the sitngo stickies and read:
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...id-t16942.html and
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...-0-t41170.html

and then:
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...nly-t8202.html
and
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...gs-t33894.html

wait until you have the basics from the first two posts firmly digested before reading the next two. Don't bother with the rest for a while longer.

also, start posting your thoughts on the hands and situations as they are posted in that forum - you'll be right sometimes and wrong other times. When you're wrong, it will be pointed out to you, including why - this is one of the best ways there is to learn! Don't get upset when you're called stupid (it's kinda inevitable that every regular poster here gets called stupid a lot!), laugh about it.

Best of luck. Oh, and share your pkr signature so that we can keep an eye on you on sharkscope - make sure you're sticking to good brm etc

[LuckySlevin]

Thanks they look really useful I'm going to keep them by me and refer to them frequently. I'm so pleased I seem to now for some reason be capable of sticking to the BR. I went down 20$ today but once again resisted the urge and it was a strong urge to gamble higher stakes. Four hours later and I've won my 20$ back plus 6$ which considering my whole BR is 50$ is really useful. Definately seeing the advantages of sticking to BR - it's not as if it wasn't already pointed out to me like 20 times previous just now I've finally it seems developed the discipline to stick to it. My pokers much more enjoyable for it, and I have you guys to thank, so.. thanks

[Muzzard]

Oh, and share your pkr signature so that we can keep an eye on you on sharkscope - make sure you're sticking to good brm etc

[Monty3038]

Slevin, welcome to the operations thread first off. Good Luck in the long run. I've watched you start to get a grip around here and wish you well. You need to stick to the rules, stick to the plan. I know it is hard, I've been there. I've turned it into a break even proposition, moving from SNGs to cash over the last 6-8 months and I'm still a long way from being profitable in the long run.

Read everything you can here, feel free to jump into convos but be sure to let people know you're just starting out... I'll keep an eye on how you are doing... maybe I can offer a pointer or two.

[kettleofish]

Lol, there's a lot of tough love in this here thread.

[swiggidy]

How did you drop $20 in one day? You're still doing something terribly wrong.

[LuckySlevin]

Well I've lost another bankroll but I'm pleased to say it was not through not following bank roll management. I did lose 12 consecutive table buyins which didn't help! From now on after the fourth I'll take a break and go for a walk.

The majority (not all.. but the majority) of the losses were through bad beats, i.e. I have top two pair against JJ and he hits a jack on the river etc... so I'm pleased with that.

I've been reading a fair bit lately which is a nice luxury I have as I have a bit of time on my hands, and I've decided to finally get around to some hardcore poker study. I 'used' to be a fairly good student, so hopefully it should go fairly well.

I'm going to read a number of poker books and make detailed notes on them all and try to combine the notes into one overall strategy guide for myself. It'll take some time but I'm hoping it will be worth it.

Can you guys tell me your thoughts on the books I'm going to use, I've included six here in the order I plan to study them, if you can think of any reasons for changing the order or adding or removing any please let me know!

Thanks.

1. Doyle Brunson's Super System - A Course in Power Poker.
2. No Limit Holdem Theory and Practice - Sklansky/Miller
3. Harrington on Holdem I, II, III.
4. Hold'em Poker for Advanced Players - Sklansky/Malmuth

[d0zer]

Start with harrington, then move on to sklansky. Harrington is an easier read and explains a lot of the same concepts in an easier way. Sklansky is deeper, but better read once you got the basics that harrington lays down IMO.

I think it's better for novice tourney players than brunson's book as well.

[gosam]

About the books : I'm a complete noob, so take my word with a grain of salt.

I've read the first three you've mentioned, and the ones I found useful were the Harrington ones. They may be too tournament centric for my taste, but they give you the basic tools you need to know about holdem.
I found Super System to be a level above my head. Might be because I read it when I was really just starting out, so it didn't help as much as Harrington's.

[swiggidy]

OMG, read Harrington I and II. Find the review threads and read what people say. If you've read anything in the SnG forum there is no way you should lose 10-20 $1 SnGs in a row.

Don't read 2 until you think you have an idea what you're doing.

1 isn't that good for HE. Entertaining read though.

4 was written for limit and isn't anything special anymore.

[Muzzard]

Srsly, you don't need these books to beat $1 SNG's.

Read the forums, posts some hands. That's is all you need to beat this level - just be semi-competent, as your opponents suck.

[WillburForce]

Srsly, you don't need these books to beat $1 SNG's.

Read the forums, posts some hands. That's is all you need to beat this level - just be semi-competent, as your opponents suck.

qft

to lose 10+ straight $1SnGs you're doing something wrong. My guess is its you're starting hands and position.
To beat this level all you need to do is play good hands in the correct position and play them strong. This is a bit simplistic but basically true.

post some hands and you'll soon be told what you're doing wrong.

[Deuce Blue]

PKR Results

Recent Results Show Last 50 Results (1 Search)
GameID Date (CST) Type EntryFee Entrants Profit
6573862 24-Aug-08 21:48 NL Holdem $1 6 -$1.10
6573078 24-Aug-08 20:06 NL Holdem $1 10 $3.90
6560888 23-Aug-08 19:41 NL Holdem $20 10 -$22
6560801 23-Aug-08 19:37 NL Holdem $5 10 -$5.50
6560522 23-Aug-08 19:22 NL Holdem $3.60 10 -$4
6560437 23-Aug-08 18:41 NL Holdem $1 10 -$1.10
6543353 22-Aug-08 23:30 NL Holdem $50 67 -$55
6552890 22-Aug-08 21:21 TURBO NL Holdem (Sat) $0.25 32 -$0.02

[Muzzard]

PKR Results

Recent Results Show Last 50 Results (1 Search)
GameID Date (CST) Type EntryFee Entrants Profit
6573862 24-Aug-08 21:48 NL Holdem $1 6 -$1.10
6573078 24-Aug-08 20:06 NL Holdem $1 10 $3.90
6560888 23-Aug-08 19:41 NL Holdem $20 10 -$22
6560801 23-Aug-08 19:37 NL Holdem $5 10 -$5.50
6560522 23-Aug-08 19:22 NL Holdem $3.60 10 -$4
6560437 23-Aug-08 18:41 NL Holdem $1 10 -$1.10
6543353 22-Aug-08 23:30 NL Holdem $50 67 -$55
6552890 22-Aug-08 21:21 TURBO NL Holdem (Sat) $0.25 32 -$0.02

Not suprising, how'd u know his PKR name? I guess he started playing on PKR so we couldnt see what a degen on stars he was.

I don't know how many times you need to be told about BRM, but I'm guessing most ppl will just give up now. It doesnt seem to be sinking in - I very much doubt ur that 'sponge' you suggested in some thread somewhere.

[Deuce Blue]

Not suprising, how'd u know his PKR name? I guess he started playing on PKR so we couldnt see what a degen on stars he was.

Just guessed. LuckySlev1n is the PKR ID

[redpalo]

I think the people on FTR are incredibly nice and helpful and positive...... Amazing!

However in my humble, newbie opinion, it's getting a bit nauseating. Sorry if I'm out of place commenting since I'm somewhat new to the site.

Epic suck-out imo and -EV, it's truly painful some of these posts over the past couple months to see how frustrating the repeated, blatent slaps-in-the-face to the awesome regulars here who put up with our noobie questions so patiently and tell us the same things over and over.

Wrap it all up in a digest and call it "How the really big fish think" and call it a day, would probably be best for the community.

From Slev's Blog (http://poker.blogvis.com/about/)

"I’m going to get rich in the world of poker or die trying!"
"This blog is the story of my journey as I battle to climb the world of online poker and realise my dream of becoming one of the greatest players and money earners the game has known."

While looking for that blog link I remembered from awhile ago, I ran across what he was doing when he wasn't around here for about a week (which was a nice break) ... getting himself banned trying to get staked here : http://forum.parttimepoker.com/showthread.php?t=377617

getting to the point of annoying now, seriously.

[Muzzard]

I think the people on FTR are incredibly nice and helpful and positive...... Amazing!

However in my humble, newbie opinion, it's getting a bit nauseating. Sorry if I'm out of place commenting since I'm somewhat new to the site.

Epic suck-out imo and -EV, it's truly painful some of these posts over the past couple months to see how frustrating the repeated, blatent slaps-in-the-face to the awesome regulars here who put up with our noobie questions so patiently and tell us the same things over and over.

Wrap it all up in a digest and call it "How the really big fish think" and call it a day, would probably be best for the community.

From Slev's Blog (http://poker.blogvis.com/about/)

"I’m going to get rich in the world of poker or die trying!"
"This blog is the story of my journey as I battle to climb the world of online poker and realise my dream of becoming one of the greatest players and money earners the game has known."

While looking for that blog link I remembered from awhile ago, I ran across what he was doing when he wasn't around here for about a week (which was a nice break) ... getting himself banned trying to get staked here : http://forum.parttimepoker.com/showthread.php?t=377617

getting to the point of annoying now, seriously.

lol, quality investigative work IMO

[redpalo]

True confession is, every time I see a post in this thread or by slevin I have some sick wierd desire to go read it to see what rediculous thing has been added to the drama, and then I get more annoyed. I know that sounds wierd but it's interfering with my learning lol.

[LuckySlevin]

LOL.

[LuckySlevin]

Redpalo also by the way this is an operation thread it's the one place I'm permitted to write exclusively about my poker, without fear of posting inapropriately so if you don't like it you know where the door is. I just about had it up to here with the minority of people that still try to big themselves up at others expense. It has the opposite effect and makes them look ridiculuous but it is none the less still annoying.

And muzzard your tag team antics with him don't befit my thread either. I've already asked you not to post in my thread but if you insist at least make sure you have something contributory to add to my thread.

I am not egotistical, I am a fairly easy going guy. I have learnt alot from my stay here so far, and am respectful of peoples experiences. I have had enough of jerks though so apologies any other readers if this last post of mine was offensive in any way.

[Muzzard]

My contribution is this:

We have continually ('we' as in the whole forum) expressed the importance of BRM. You have continually ignored this advice. Sure blow your money on poker, that's fine, if that's what you want to do.... But the fact you are a) on this forum and b) posting in an op thread, suggests otherwise.

You want to be a winning poker player, you want to progress as a player.

Do do this you need to:
a) Take on board ppls suggestions, people with a lot of 'poker' knowledge - especially people who have posted here for years and have thousands of posts.
b) Stick to one game; one where you think you can gain/or have an easy advantage.
c) Don't mix games and limits without either knowing that gae inside out or having the appropriate roll at that level.
d) Have 1 roll and decided this is the time to go robusto or go completely broke never to deposit again'.
e) Be happy that ppl are trying to help you
f) Be happy that ppl are helping you for free
g) Learn the game you decide to play, not say you will learn it, but actually learn it. Since you've started I've seen no progression in your game at all - from the point of view of sharkscope anyway.
h) Posts some hands so ppl can see where your going wrong and offer advice of how to improve.
f) Don't read any more books until you can beat $10 SNG's by the power of reading this forum and listening to ppl on here.
g) Don't ask anyone to stake you

That's about all I can think of....

[LuckySlevin]

I dont want your advice I have told you many times, why do you continue to post in my thread?

[d0zer]

f) Don't read any more books until you can beat $10 SNG's by the power of reading this forum and listening to ppl on here.

That's silly. I think the best thing he could do for his game right now is to properly digest Harrington's tourney books.

[daven]

I dont want your advice I have told you many times, why do you continue to post in my thread?

muzzard's advice is good here....
ummm, you're proud of sticking to good brm this time - then why are you playing $50 buy-in tournaments?
seriously dude.
You're best off to never deposit again.

[LuckySlevin]

I'm not playing 50$ buy in touranments daven?

And muzzard has offered to fight me via pm as indicated earlier in the thread so I just have no time for him Daven.

[d0zer]

I don't get why everyone's ripping on this guy. Fek, let him do what he wants. All the information about BRM is out there, he's been told countless times, he knows.

Leading a horse to water, then berating him for not drinking is...at best futile. Some people need to get burned a few times before they really learn not to touch the hot stove. I certainly did.