And The Right Call Is.....

[EasyT]

Here's an eventful hand from last evening. I had the big stack and was feeling confident.

***** Hand History for Game 1692487956 *****
$25 NL Hold'em - Sunday, March 06, 01:15:02 EDT 2005
Table Table 37036 (Real Money)
Seat 3 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: PorkChopMone ( $88.47 )
Seat 2: DieseLakers ( $5.53 )
Seat 3: MUEagle84 ( $32.35 )
Seat 4: DLowe2JTek ( $27.69 )
Seat 5: Camrydog60 ( $31.45 )
Seat 6: HarryCaray69 ( $32.05 )
Seat 7: beatle78 ( $32.03 )
Seat 8: jdk2222 ( $44.35 )
Seat 10: Vyllyn ( $20.15 )
Seat 9: booser1 ( $5 )
DLowe2JTek posts small blind [$0.1].
Camrydog60 posts big blind [$0.25].
booser1 posts big blind [$0.25].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to PorkChopMone [ Ad Kd ]
HarryCaray69 folds.
Camrydog60: but I will still have your money little boy
beatle78 raises [$2].
jdk2222 calls [$2].
PorkChopMone: good calls, DJ
booser1 calls [$1.75].
PorkChopMone: DL
Vyllyn folds.
PorkChopMone raises [$3.75].
DieseLakers is all-In.
MUEagle84 folds.
DLowe2JTek folds.
Camrydog60 folds.
beatle78 folds.
jdk2222 calls [$3.53].
booser1 is all-In.
PorkChopMone calls [$1.78].
** Dealing Flop ** [ Ks, 2h, Th ]
jdk2222 is all-In.


Now this was a $38.00 raise into a $20.00 pot (at a .10/.25 table-- how many BBs is that?)!! I had one of the best starting hands, re-raised, got re-re-raised and still had a 4-way pot before the flop (I know, you can read).

More insight: My PokerTracker rates jdk222 a calling station: VP$ 32% (170 hands). His aggression overall is 0.52. His aggression rating on the flop is 1.31. Not that I had time to check this, but I'll give you the information to consider. (By the way, I downloaded PlayerView so I WOULD have access to this info mid-hand, but it keeps giving me errors related to DLL files- any suggestions?)

Have at it, fellas.

[JeffreyGB]

With the info you give about his PT stats, I'd put him on KT or (maybe, but less likely) KK. Possibly KQ, but doubtful since he raised (and doesn't seem to do so very often).

[Fnord]

Re-raise more pre-flop. All-in is looking good.

Pot is big enough to call this with TPTK.

[lolzzz_321]

Re-raise more pre-flop. All-in is looking good.

Pot is big enough to call this with TPTK.

Agr33t, but I'd be scared as fizzuck. You can't really fold... 1010 or K10?

[EasyT]

So Jeffrey put him on KT or less likely KK.
Fnord says call it (and be more aggressive before the flop).
Triptaines suspects maybe a TT.

What about this possiblilty: AK. Just like me?

But does everyone think you cannot fold this hand. Is that the consensus?
You're scared to hell of AA, KK, KT and TT, but you gotta call this anyway?

[Fnord]

Reading hands and reading palms have a lot more in common than one would think. Call.

[Trikflow77]

At this stakes, that is an auto call. The turds could easily have KQ/QQ/ or even a flush draw. This call is +EV all day long. If he does have you beat, oh well, you pay him off.

[johnnyawe]

Reading hands and reading palms have a lot more in common than one would think.

Deserves repeating.

[EasyT]

Perhaps this is why I'm still struggling with this game. You only get like 20 seconds to think...this is still driving me nuts on tough calls. At my home games when the bet is big (a full buy-in or more) it's not uncommon to deliberate for more than a minute or two. But I'm still learning.

Let me say, as I have at SOOO many other posts, my bankroll is short. I've read "BankRoll 101" and I know this. The $50 I was up at this table was literally 1/3 of my BR! So to ring him up and pay him off sounds easy but is especially tough for me...
...and we're back to BR 101!

My thoghts went like this, as I imagine.

"Oh Shit!"
$38.00!!"
"I was gonna raise, too!"
"What do I do. What do I do!"
"I don't want to call that?"
"Calm down. What could he have?"
"AA, KK, KT, TT, Flush Draw, Straight Draw, or HELL, just JJ"
"No, not JJ. Not him."
"$38.00!!"
"Oh, Shit what do I do?"

dit dit dit dit dit dit...you have 18 seconds left to act...

"Oh, shit."
"What if he has AK. Split pot."
"What about the other two. If one has AA, I'm losing to the rake on a chop."
"Hey, I only have $5 invested here. I'm still up $80"
"You want to bet $40 to on THIS guy NOT having a hand?!?"
"This table is great. Wait for a hand without a difficult call."
"I put them on the difficult calls, not them on me."
"I can't believe I'm folding AK!!!!"

And the rest is history...

** Dealing Flop ** [ Ks, 2h, Th ]
jdk2222 is all-In.
PorkChopMone: can't believe I'm folding AK
PorkChopMone folds.
** Dealing Turn ** [ 4s ]
** Dealing River ** [ 4d ]
jdk2222 shows [ Qs, Kh ] two pairs, kings and fours.
booser1 doesn't show [ 8s, 8c ] two pairs, eights and fours.
DieseLakers doesn't show [ Qc, Qh ] two pairs, queens and fours.
jdk2222 wins $38.82 from side pot #2 with two pairs, kings and fours.
jdk2222 wins $1.54 from side pot #1 with two pairs, kings and fours.
jdk2222 wins $21.25 from the main pot with two pairs, kings and fours.


On a side note: Why do I always ONLY think about the hands that beat me when deciding to call a hand. I've made some bold calls before in spite of my bankroll. But not without good cause. But when considering a big bet, all of a sudden everyone might have AA. Or JT if that's what makes the nut straight.

I lost $5 on this hand and I'm ok with that. But I had the best hand and could have won $100. I waited for another hand, and when it came an hour later, I won $25 more. I'm still HAPPY with my lay down, and wonder if THAT is a problem.

[sykotik489]

But could you have laid down 88 like our sykotik friend booser up there should have done.

[Greedo017]

this is a consequence of playing shortrolled plain and simple. In a situation like this, i would definitely be really scared he made a set, but i think >50% of the time, he has junk like KQ, and 100%+ of the time, i am calling.

[bspahn]

what i dont get is why so many people were in there with an early position 8x BB raise and some callers... ?

i always think what the hell when i see someone putting in a 3-5x BB raise on a table and they hold A8 or 66 or some other hand that really shouldn't be raised ... this is likely why i'd rather play half-decent people where you can expect more standard play and raises - how do you all deal with erratic players who dont seem to read any poker books etc?

[bspahn]

what i dont get is why so many people were in there with an early position 8x BB raise and some callers... ?

i always think what the hell when i see someone putting in a 3-5x BB raise on a table and they hold A8 or 66 or some other hand that really shouldn't be raised ... this is likely why i'd rather play half-decent people where you can expect more standard play and raises - how do you all deal with erratic players who dont seem to read any poker books etc?

[Bmxicle]

what i dont get is why so many people were in there with an early position 8x BB raise and some callers... ?

i always think what the hell when i see someone putting in a 3-5x BB raise on a table and they hold A8 or 66 or some other hand that really shouldn't be raised ... this is likely why i'd rather play half-decent people where you can expect more standard play and raises - how do you all deal with erratic players who dont seem to read any poker books etc?

When you get a good hand you take as much money as possible from them, occassionally you will get burned by an even better hand, but their looseness more than makes up for that. Literally when i play in a full ring game filled with fish i don't bluff, i may be aggressive with marginal hands like Missed AK and middle pair, but i don't bluff.