...

[aokrongly]

...

[aokrongly]

I'm at Zero!!!

(Highest # of consecutive ITM to date is 1)
(Latest win 5th in $25K guaranteed PokerStars rebuy madness)

[DWDuck]

I like it.... I'm in. I only do about 4 MTTs a week (at least that's what I'm starting right now), so my rate won't be as fast. I think that's a great idea though.

So far I'm at 1 in a row.... woohoo! 6th in $1000 guaranteed on Empire.

My l'il side personal goal will be to get 5 in a row at first... baby steps. I'll give myself a gold star for that. I think my 4-year old has a few she can give me.

Darkwing

[Radashack]

The one problem I see Tony is that Online poker and golf are two very different beasts, The cutoff in golf wouldn't equal the money in poker. If you want to put yourself in position for a win in MTT's it has to be in the mental arena. ITM is just a variable %age. Plus if you are playing to get into the money you aren't putting yourself in a position to win, you are putting yourself in a position to make a tiny return.

example: You limp in with 3xbb, all the money is at the top and you effectivly took yourself out of position to win any of it (unless you pull some miracles). However if you play to win the whole thing you come into the money with 20xbb and are really in a great position to win.

It is extremly important to put yourself in position to win, but thats not making it to the money. I used toi think it was and I ran 40-45% ITM in MTT's, but I NEVER cashed in.

[Laeelin]

I'll try =) ..

In a $5 MTT right now (well, in 120 seconds)

I have a suggestion though..

Dont add a new post when you win/lose/ect..

Edit yout post accepting the challenge

It is extremly important to put yourself in position to win, but thats not making it to the money. I used toi think it was and I ran 40-45% ITM in MTT's, but I NEVER cashed in.

My line of thought is that I need to learn to take chances better... (aka, to go for the coinflips when you should, but be able to camp better when you should )

If i'm posting every fail and sucess on the form, it will help me stay on top of my game... Thats the plan anyway

==============================

Attempt one: FAIL ... in like 3 min, took a coinflip, didnt hit it (still made the right move though )

[aokrongly]

I understand and respect what you're saying Rada. And you have a very good point. But I think this is a good exercise for me and I think there are others who can gain from it or enjoy it.

And I think the results in both ITM and large wins will be more impressive than expected.

[Laeelin]

I understand and respect what you're saying Rada. And you have a very good point. But I think this is a good exercise for me and I think there are others who can gain from it or enjoy it.

And I think the results in both ITM and large wins will be more impressive than expected.

I'm thinking that this is +EV in the long run for me, but -EV for thoes games ( aka, will help become a better player, not help we win thoes 20 games )

[SteveO]

I'm in. Not to burst any bubbles but 10 ITM finishes is virtually impossible, especially online where you really play hard and fast and the blinds escalate very quickly. Odds become even worse in large online fields.

I had a run of 6 ITM in home games last year and was tourny leader in 18-24 person home tournys.

I have a run of 6 ITM online in small fields, ie. 30 to 100 entries. One bad beat and your counter gets set to 0. It's a fun goal and only attainable if you get lucky.

On Absolute I had a week where I was top 5 in the 100, three times in one week, then a run of no money for 3 weeks. I played same opponents and the same basic game, but didn't hit the flops.

My own personal record that I think I will never break is two 1st place finishes in MTT's in a single day. Again, relatively small fields but great payday.

Luck factor is far more important in poker than in golf. Good luck.

[aokrongly]

SteveO,

I know what you're saying and am glad you're taking on the challenge anyway. Let me share my vision with a couple of concepts.

First, back to Tiger. It's not like other players got close before. Right now the closest is at 16, last year Singh was up to about 33. But Tiger absolutely blew through was was considered possible before. Why? He's not a robot, he's not mechanically perfect, that's for sure. When he "makes a run" on the weekend he can look downright horrible.

The difference is in how he mentally aproaches the tournament. This goes along with his skills, but even though he's probably better than most on the tour, he's not 10x better. He's probably not even twice as good as the field mechanically. He hits farter, but not Twice as far, he putts better, but not Twice as good.... etc.

The absolute #1 difference is his mental approach, competiive thought processes and the emotional consistency he brings to every tournament. And I'm saying that we can discover the Poker equivelant if we set our minds to it, our efforts to it, and make it a passionate, long-term quest. That's my MTT quest. Because, while you can add techniques, get better reads, makes better card/poker decisions over time, all those skills rest on a bedrock that is your mental approach to the tournament. And that's what this quest is about. The #1 absolute greatest thing about Poker to me is that it's played 100% in the 6 inches between your ears. It has no favorites. It requires no special background. It is an open puzzle that can be solved by anyone and pays you off in so many ways other than just money.

Point #2 comes from Anthony Robbins, a success consultant. Generally, I'm no big fan of motivational speakers, etc. I've read most of them and find almost all to be fluff and regurgitated versions "Think And Grow Rich" was was written at the turn of the 20th century. But Anthony Robbins is different. He has made some amazing new insights. And Point #2 is one of his.

"People overestimate how much they can accomplish in a year and underestimate how much they can accomplish in a decade." I add the word "drastically". They drastically overestimate and underestimate.

So, for me this isn't a "let's see what happens over the next few months" sort of goal. It's a multi-year quest. Do you think if you, or anyone focused on improving on ITM finishes as a goal for 10 years they can make 20, 30, 50 in a row at some point? I'm absolutely convinced you can, I can, anyone can.

If we work on it together and mentor each other, then we accelerate that learning process and compress it exponentially.

I was talking with Soupie and Rada, and others last night and Soupie pointed out one amazing thing. In less than a year this group of people who have focused on extraordinary success in poker all of a sudden went from talking about hundeds of dollars won to thousands and then tens of thousands per month. Success bred insight which bred greater and greater success that none could have done alone, and all enjoy together. My experience has been the same. Going from break even to hundreds of dollars per week to breaking thousands recently. And tens of thousands is a nut-cinch certainty.

So, that's what this is about. Using combined experiences in a long term quest for extraordinary success that defies logic.

And I'm glad you're part of it.

[Radashack]

Not to burst any bubbles but 10 ITM finishes is virtually impossible

Not even. 10 is plenty obtainable. As is 20, its not a cake walk, but I gurentee its possible.

But I think this is a good exercise for me and I think there are others who can gain from it or enjoy it.

No doubt there will be benifits, i'm just simply saying this isn't going to impact massivly your winnings. On 1 level anyway.

However by doing this, the mental strength you will develope will be invaluable. I will be writing a post on this soon.

-------------

Your last post is awsome Tony. There is a lot to be taken from that, and another thing that coincides: Your winning potential will be that of the 5 people you surround yourself with the most. Hence why this community will continue to grow leaps and bounds in winning's.
[/quote]

[aokrongly]

Rada,

It's easy to look like a smart when I just restate what you, Soupie and others have taught me. lol

[aleksandr]

Game on
I'm in
Just let me pull together a bankroll

[Wet_DreaMer]

"Finally, this is on the honor system. If you want to lie at any point, then just lie now and say you're already made 20 in a row."

Made 21 straight yesterday.
Was multi-tabling.

[Theeggman]

I'd be surprised if someone could acheive this goal before 2020. I just can't imagine that you could make all the right calls for 20 consecutive MTTs. With the number of bad-calls-turned-good by bad players (not unlike myself). I think it would entail laying down the nuts on the turn at least 10 times to make it happen.

After reading AOKs posts I think if anyone can do it it would be him or another of the resident experts, but I think the conditions make it almost impossible. I really hope you can attain it and I'm all for goal setting, but my feeling is that goals must be attainable and this one just seems too lofty. Make me eat my words.

[TanO]

I love a challenge !

I'm at one, finished 51/501 last night in the Interpoker 100k GTD, 60 places paid and boy was it a long slog !

Also I'm on hold for the next 3 weeks, 'cause i'll be in vegas baby !

(do live tourneys count ?!)

[drmcboy]

Unless rule # 1 of your play is never go AI against a bigger stack, you're going to have to get very very lucky to make this happen.

[aokrongly]

Any MTT counts.

And yes, it's a very tough assignment. But what fun to keep it in the back of your mind and try to work toward over time.

[Theeggman]

I'm sure it will be fun and by doing it you are bound to gain a lot of skill so I think it is a great challenge to keep you from making "wtf" pushes (which are my biggest mistakes). I just envision you being on tourney #18 and not pushing when you should b/c you're afraid of resetting the counter.

[DWDuck]

I'm sure it will be fun and by doing it you are bound to gain a lot of skill so I think it is a great challenge to keep you from making "wtf" pushes (which are my biggest mistakes). I just envision you being on tourney #18 and not pushing when you should b/c you're afraid of resetting the counter.

Oh man, I hope I get in this situation. Sure, I may make the wrong choice, but I can't see much bad in finishing ITM in 17 straight.

Darkwing

[SteveO]

2 in a row. 3# gtd. on IP and live game this weekend. Hope this posts. Said I was banned last time.

[maxxscam]

so far 3/3,
3rd in small live multi top 4 pays
1st in 30+3 on stars
1st on 11$ rebuy for 350k seat on stars

[SteveO]

3 final tables and counting. Unfortunately no win.

[Spook]

erm do 2 table SnG's count?

[edit] nvm.. 100 player min... missed it [/edit]

[jmrogers7]

I see tremendous value in taking on this challenge. Mentally, this will help most everyone that takes it on.

However, I will say that achieving 20 ITM finishes in a row will be EXTREMELY difficult. The one constant that is always present in any MTT (and to a lesser extent in a ring game) is that of the factor of luck. Whether anyone wants to believe it or not, you have to get very lucky AT LEAST once per MTT if not more to finish respectably.

Unfortunately, luck is the one factor which is out of our control. We are all at it's mercy and when you don't have it there is absolutely nothing you can do about it.

Again, though, I see many positives in taking on this chalenge.

[DBL0SVN]

I see tremendous value in taking on this challenge. Mentally, this will help most everyone that takes it on.

I agree. My biggest problem is making one stupid play after an hour or two of solid play ... and busting out. This will keep me focussed on avoiding any -EV plays and even the coinflips. No point in these until you're ITM or perhaps shortstacked on the bubble.

However, it will be extremely tough, even for the good players. So, to set myself a more manageable short term goal, I'm going to gun for 20 ITM finishes in 20 person SnGs. I think I'll get the benefit of the challenge within a more achievable setup

[Tim Vecchioni]

well, this has been my goal since i started playing mtt's. I always goal to make it ITM hoping im around average stack. Then i go from there. To keep you up to date, I have placed ITM 3 in a row now, 6th, 50th and a 102.

[DWDuck]

I need a rule clarification here. I played in 3 MTTS tonight. ITM in two of them (won my first one!), and OTM in the other. Now... the last two I finished I was ITM. These were not the last two I started though... if that makes sense. I was ITM in one I started at 8pm, and one at 9pm, and OTM in another one at 9pm which finished BEFORE the one at 8pm. Does this still count as 2??? I vote yes.

I'm at 2. (or 1)

Darkwing

[aokrongly]

To get a ruling on that you need to type it up in triplicate and send it to our judging panel of international lawyers in Switzerland. Here's the address:

The Miniscule Difference Ministry
1234 Jeez Louise Lane
IDon'tThinItMatters, Switzerland

Wait... the ruling is in. If you think it counts then cool. In the end 20 is a big #, so as long as you don't "forget that loss" that occurred the next day before your next 2 ITM's you won't be sanctioned, fined or imprisoned.

[SteveO]

Well I ran up to 4 in a row final tables, no 1st places, 3d was best. Then I just bubbled out 3 in a row. Sadly my streak has come to an end. Guess i'm back to 0.

[Spook]

How about just stretching for the highest aggregated MTT ITM's within a given Calendar Month. Target of 20 for a gold star, tinfoil hat, whatever.

An ITM counts as a +1
An OTM counts as a -1

A bit less harsh and allows for more competition while acheiving much the same goals.

----

Just a thought, I like the orriginal too.

[DavSimon]

I generally try to be supportive of fresh unconventional ideas, and this certainly qualifies as unique. It is an excellent way to encourage youself to really play solid poker and develop mental discipline, however I have to agree that 20 consecutive ITM finishes in MTTs would be almost impossible. Regardless of perfect play, it would require an unimaginable amount of luck. How many four-of-a-kinds can you lose to in a single day? I can answer that question.....How many four-of-a-kinds can you lose to in a single week? Radashack can anser that question. Even when you are at the top of your game, bad and very unlikely things can and do happen.
While I can clearly see the benefits of this exercise, I can also see where this could hurt a player as well.
How do you develop mental toughness or push past a particularly tough beat. You talk about the long term and how one single hand or tournament does not define you as a player. With this exercise you are focusing on the short term...specifically the current tournament you are playing and trying to make it into the money. Lets say for instance you have had an extraordinary amount of good fortune and you have acummulated 8 consecutive ITM MTT finishes...In the 9th tourney sitting on the bubble you take a bad beat - what are you going to be focusing on....the 8 great tournaments you played until this point or the idiot that just called your bet with a rediculous hand, sucked out on you and knocked you back to square one in this competition? Do you see where I am going with this??
I think what Spook suggested puts a more positive long term focus on the competition, because 1 failure that may be completely beyond your control does not undo everthing you have accomplished until that point. Anyway, just my 2 chips....it is something to consider though.

[hazelblue]

I'd consider it, but luck would be too much of a factor.
And given that I've lost 13 SnGs in a row (before winning two, and then losing two more), I'm not sure.

I will admit though, it sounds exciting.

Rada and DavSimon have a point.

[aokrongly]

I'm open to a change if the others want it. What say ye, fellow challenge accepters. Is dropping "consecutive" a puss move or just common sense?