Do you fold AA?

[vqc]

***** Hand History for Game 2350429878 *****
200/400 Tourney Texas Hold'em Game Table (NL) (Tournament 13862820) - Tue Jul 12 02:36:31 EDT 2005
Table Table 11211 (Real Money) -- Seat 6 is the button
Total number of players : 5
Seat 4: TheMangler (1190)
Seat 6: christoff925 (1264)
Seat 7: Mikeydmarco (1607)
Seat 9: TheGrindHer (2015)
Seat 10: barronm (1924)
Mikeydmarco posts small blind (100)
TheGrindHer posts big blind (200)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to TheGrindHer [ Ah, Ac ]
barronm folds.
TheMangler raises (1190) to 1190
TheMangler is all-In.
christoff925 raises (1264) to 1264
christoff925 is all-In.
Mikeydmarco raises (1507) to 1607
Mikeydmarco is all-In.
TheGrindHer ?????

What do you do.

(PS. This hand actually did happen, but instead of having aces I had Ah 5c. Just htought that it woudl be good for discussion)

[Bmxicle]

No because even if you do lose you go out in third, and when you win that hand you will be in a position to take first.

[vqc]

Brilliant I didnt notice that, IM THE BIG STACK!
So regardless of what happens in the ahnd Im guaranted a minimum of 20% of hte prize pool.

What happens if Im not hte big stack?

[DaNutsInYoEye]

Still call everytime. Even though so many people in the hand lesson your chances of winning, you're still the favorite. The likely hands here probably aren't things like 67s or 10Js. They are probably pocket pairs making you big favorite or big cards like AK or AQ making you an even bigger favorite than over a pocket pair. It's also likely some people are sharing each other's outs.

[WhiteFingers]

I agree because you have the other three outchipped you should make this call, even if you lose the hand you will go out in third and if you win then you have the othe player dominated in terms of checks. Also irrespective of the amount os cash you have you should call with aces even with three people all in, because they probably dont have hands like 10Js. They are more likely to have pocket pairs or AK, which is great for you.
However if it was any hand less than aces, even kings i would fold.

[Muxy]

Never lay down AA preflop - EVER

[future_proof]

You don't set easy questions do you ?! I've started playing £5 + £0.50 and I'm trying to work out the best ITM strategy, so I'm just going to write my thoughts and see if it makes sense.

My first instinct is to call; it's the best starting hand, nothing else can beat it etc. etc. blah blah blah. But if your tactic is based on getting in the money and having a decent chance at winning, then maybe it's not such an easy decision.

If there are 3 all-ins and you have AA, then there's a chance that someone else has A-x (suited or not), meaning that it's more unlikely you're going to hit a set, so the board has a better chance of improving someonelses hand than your own (against other PP etc.).

As big stack, if you lose to MikeyD then you're left with 400 chips which will only last one orbit at those SB/BB of 100/200 - you get 3rd place.

Whereas if you fold and whoever wins then you still have your 2000 and a decent stab at winning 1st, as whoever else is left from that pot if MikeyD loses is not going to last at those limits.

It hurts me to say this, because even though if you win you are in 2nd straight away and dominating the remaining player, but I'm folding...(did I just say that??). Now let's see me try to follow that advice if I ever face this situation...

[daluchy]

Never lay down AA preflop - EVER

Even if my life depended on me winning a Sit and Go, I don't think I'm ever folding AA.

What can people have? You're sharing Aces w/anyone w/AK/AQ, so technically you have the best A-kicker.

If anyone has a PP, you are dominating them too.

Why wouldn't you want to put all your money in with the best hand and the best chance of winning?

[DavSimon]

Never lay down AA preflop - EVER

Buzzzz. can you say: "What is the wrong answer Alex"

Lets say you have been playing a Satellite for a $650 seat to the WSOP final for 4 hours. 3 People get seats and it is nearly bubble time (5 left), you are middle stacked about 250K UTG. You are dealt A-A and raise 4x to 48K....the button pushes all-in for 160K.... low and behold the big stack in the small blind also pushes for 450K.....
First place gets you nothing more than third, fourth gets you about $81 cash...what do you do?

While most of the time you wouldn't lay down aces preflop....I have been in a surprising numer of situations where I did and it was the correct decision. The above situation happened and I have been a very large stack when were were about 10 people from the bubble and had to fold Aces, Kings, A-K...all sorts of premium hands...it is a difficult thing to do, but if you don't have to play to win then stop playing. I have seen som many big stacks get impatient trying to take out smaller stack and just end the tourney...they invariable lose a significant portion of thier chip and occasionally tilt or panic and end up bustng with nothing to show for it. Don't lock yourself into a mindset or a rule that you will NEVER make a play....whatever it is. Part of being a good poker player is adapting to the situation and doing what is in your best interest even if it is a bit painful....like folding aces preflop.

[xxDFOCxx]

I agree with future_proof,

I may fold it if i'm not the big stack because it assure you to be in the money. This is the only situation where you can think folding the best starting hand.

If your are the big stack like your example, it's a call.

my .02

[Aquinas]

I call for stack size reasons mentioned above...I do think there are times u want to fold aces (and I have done it on 1 occation vrs a single all in! beat that tighties! (it was in a step tourney--I was second in chips and large stack shoved with 5 players left and 4 advance)). But this is not 1 of those cases...

[Aces]

Don't lock yourself into a mindset or a rule that you will NEVER make a play....whatever it is. Part of being a good poker player is adapting to the situation and doing what is in your best interest even if it is a bit painful....like folding aces preflop.

I like your logic Dav. I try to do think this way myself and will now laydown hands that normally you wouldn't(especially QQ/AK but possibly AA/KK) PF without regret. In reality, I don't think I've ever layed down AA/KK PF, but I wouldn't rule it out.

[Bad Beaten]

The strongest hand I've ever layed down pre-flop was JJ, but that's because I rarely play satellites and I almost always play low-stakes games against very loose players.

[ensign_lee]

Even if my life depended on me winning a Sit and Go, I don't think I'm ever folding AA.

I'd just like to point out that if your life depended on it, you are playing WAAAAY out of your bankroll. :P

[gabe]

lol

[arkana]

Unless its a satellite im not thinking about folding. With the sng payout structure being what it is, you have to shoot for first. AA is still a big favourite against 2 other hands, do your ICM calculations vqchuang...

[daluchy]

Even if my life depended on me winning a Sit and Go, I don't think I'm ever folding AA.

I'd just like to point out that if your life depended on it, you are playing WAAAAY out of your bankroll. :P

Hahahaha.

Well in response to later replies, I do understand in a major MTT or satellite of some sorts maybe folding AA is a slight option, but we're talking Sit N Go's here right? Is folding AA in a low-buyin game ever a good choice?

The strongest hand I've ever layed down pre-flop was JJ, but that's because I rarely play satellites and I almost always play low-stakes games against very loose players.

Lol yeah I just did that today too. I felt proud of doing it, of course that changed when someone called the AI raise and the person showed 84o.

[vqc]

Unless its a satellite im not thinking about folding. With the sng payout structure being what it is, you have to shoot for first. AA is still a big favourite against 2 other hands, do your ICM calculations vqchuang...

are you making fun of me arkana?
cuz if you are.... I will.....
.... do something bad to you?

Im too lazy to do those calculations =D.

Im pretty sure that if I wasnt guaranteed third in this situation, it would be a very close situation.