20+2. 88 on the bubble

[vqc]

#Game No : 3062713814
***** Hand History for Game 3062713814 *****
NL Texas Hold'em $20 Buy-in + $2 Entry Fee Trny:17557794 Level:5 Blinds(75/150) - Saturday, November 19, 20:41:23 EDT 2005
Table Table 66789 (Real Money)
Seat 7 is the button
Total number of players : 6
Seat 2: Strega ( $1610 )
Seat 3: mxer7734 ( $3188 )
Seat 6: donboss ( $300 )
Seat 7: word7 ( $1620 )
Seat 9: kevrop ( $627 )
Seat 10: IModFTR ( $655 )
Trny:17557794 Level:5
Blinds(75/150)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to IModFTR [ 8c 8h ]
Strega folds.
mxer7734 folds.
donboss is all-In [300]
word7 calls [300].
kevrop calls [225].
IModFTR ?????????

Discuss

[gabe]

call and try to push any flop maybe?

i dont think the SB is folding preflop. this is tough.

i probably fold most often though.

[Sprayed]

You're low on chips gamble push.

[TLR]

you have 4BB -> push

[Drewbie]

Must push and hope for coin flip or underpair to your 8's

[mouteut]

Aren't there 3 players in that hand? i don't think 88 is very good against 3 callers and his stack is too little to push anyone off. MAYBE call and hope for a favorable flop.

tough one

[AHiltz]

They would only have to call 355 more PF if he pushed. 88 in a 4 way pot is not so good.

I would fold and wait til I could get my money in against 1 player

[PokerPatNEU]

Button or SB would push over with a higher pair than 8 here. I call and hope for a low flop to push at.

[pgil]

he doesnt have enough to push anyone out pre or post flop. If the short stack has been sitting around letting his stack dwindle waiting for his big hand, he may have just found it, so I would fold. If he has just recently become shorty, I would push over. chance to more than triple up late = push against the overcards/lower pockets.

[gabe]

he doesnt have enough to push anyone out pre or post flop. If the short stack has been sitting around letting his stack dwindle waiting for his big hand, he may have just found it, so I would fold. If he has just recently become shorty, I would push over. chance to more than triple up late = push against the overcards/lower pockets.

he does have enough to push them out postflop if they dont hit anything

[pgil]

you dont think overcards will call a ~1/3 pot sized bet from a short stack? maybe thats the big difference between the stakes, i know at the 5's and 10's you are gonna get called at least 75% of the time by overcards.

[LionsFan20]

88 in a 4-way pot? I'd wait for a better spot.

With no reads and assuming that at worst they have random cards, the best you can hope for is 42%-ish.

Put two of them on a range of all paint through Ax, and you're a 2:1 dog at best 4 handed.

[pgil]

but you are getting better than 3:1 on your money and are short stacked while shorthanded with relatively large blinds, are you gonna get a better spot soon enough to actually allow you a chance to win?

[LionsFan20]

the opportunity to triple up is more than tempting, but it's not a call that I would likely be able to make with 88 in that position.

If it gets limped/folded to me on the SB or the button, I'm pushing just about any two. Maybe I end up in worse shape, but most big stacks don't play agressive on the bubble and a 3x-4x push might be enough to get them to drop.

Of course with my luck, I'd fold the 88 and the flop would come out A88.

[konahead]

I think you have to push. You're the sb next hand and then you're a 430 stack pushing w 150 blinds - you may not see a better hand for a while...

Perhaps if no one is aggressively stealing and you think you can get HU against the bb next hand and push... but thats an optomistic thought...
If word7 can take out both small stacks here, you'll be down to 4 and can just start pushing like crazy... Lots of IFs and BUTs and wishful thinking.... I would push here.

[bigred]

That's definately a tough play. I think it matters what you're trying to do. I think you're getting called by at least one player if not more if you push. If you just call like gabe said, I believe you will not be able to take the pot down and you'll get called by overcards or a hand that has you beat.

I think it really comes down to what you're looking to do. If you're just aiming for an ITM and you're happy with 3rd then I would suggest folding and wait for a situation where you can get headsup and have a better chance of winnning the pot ( you don't have much folding equity left).

If you want to try to make a run for first you definately need chips and here's a decent spot to gamble for them. You could flat out push and you'll probably get a few callers. Now that I think about it, I think the better play is a stopngo like Gabe suggested it. You'll most likely get called by overcards or a better hand on the flop but you also have a chance of getting rid of a few players who might have called your allin preflop but missed the flop completely.

[HeavyP]

The main point here is that the two big stacks folded, there is one person with 1600 but everyone else is around where you are. I'm not sure if you can get any of them to fold, but if you can by pushing then it may be worth it.

[jdubs]

tough call. your position is such that you have probably decent chances of stealing in the next 2-3 hands if you fold, ... you arent anywhere near UTG at this point, however your situation is pretty dire..tough one, I dont know, It could go either way...

[Werddown]

you dont think overcards will call a ~1/3 pot sized bet from a short stack? maybe thats the big difference between the stakes, i know at the 5's and 10's you are gonna get called at least 75% of the time by overcards.

Thats exactly what I was thinking.

I play $10 SnGs on stars, and if you're getting called ALOT of the time post flop no matter what...

Especially when the other two players that just called the 300 bet only have 600 and 1600 something chips themselves... The stack with 600 may fold.. but I cant see how.... Hed only have like 300 left right?

I'm still new, but I guess I just dont understand why calling or pushing here would be good at all. The only way I see you winning the pot is if you hit an 8. I almost always see a card higher than 8 when the board goes to 5 cards... and someone might have a higher pocket pair already...

Like I said though, I'm still learning and play at lower stakes than this.

But I fold.


Edit: Ive contimplated some more and I definitely see the reasons for playing this hand now. You need the chips pretty bad, but I still think you'll have a chance to try and steal in the next hands, or get lucky with a premium hand and double up.

[zenbitz]

I think you push, because even a double up is not likely to get you back in this one. You need a triple, and you could get 3.5 if both guys call. You will probably bust out though, but with an M of of <3 and a Q of 0.1, you are probably busting out by the end of the orbit anyway..

[ChrisBCritter]

I'm playing for First, so I would push here. I'm too shortstacked to try and wait for a better hand, and I'll be blinded out before I get another chance for sure... Time to GAMBOOOL@!