Check behind on the river?

[kingnat]

3rd hand of a $10+1 SnG

PokerStars Game #3526889646: Tournament #17498647, Hold'em No Limit - Level I (10/20) - 2006/01/03 - 23:02:21 (ET)
Table '17498647 1' Seat #4 is the button
Seat 1: airsjo (1500 in chips)
Seat 2: WestMenlo92 (1490 in chips)
Seat 3: SavannahSlim (1400 in chips)
Seat 4: 1stDegree (1430 in chips)
Seat 5: minnkg21 (1550 in chips)
Seat 6: TheDirtBag (1420 in chips)
Seat 7: VIQAN (1540 in chips)
Seat 8: P&Ychaser (1670 in chips)
Seat 9: kingnat (1500 in chips)
minnkg21: posts small blind 10
TheDirtBag: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to kingnat [Ks Ac]
VIQAN: folds
P&Ychaser: folds
kingnat: raises 80 to 100
airsjo: calls 100
WestMenlo92: folds
SavannahSlim: folds
1stDegree: calls 100
minnkg21: folds
TheDirtBag: calls 80
*** FLOP *** [6c Ts 8d]
TheDirtBag: checks
kingnat: bets 240
airsjo: folds
1stDegree: folds
TheDirtBag: calls 240
*** TURN *** [6c Ts 8d] [9h]
TheDirtBag: checks
kingnat: checks
*** RIVER *** [6c Ts 8d 9h] [As]
TheDirtBag: checks
kingnat: ????

[nogenius]

I think you're ahead here, so I bet about 200 and fold to a raise.

[Aplomado]

I agree.

[thnwkd]

I think you're ahead here, so I bet about 200 and fold to a raise.

I am really puzzled by this. and this is not the first time that i've been puzzled by the reasoning of some of the seemingly respected posters on this site, that everyone else seems to agree with.
Im not a total newbie but i've only been seriously playing for a few months and i'm trying to improve my game, so help me understand.

If you are ahead here why bet and then fold?
If you truly believe you are ahead then shouldn't you call the push?
how can you assume that bb does not have a 7 or QJ or A8s?, this is the 3rd hand of a 10+1 remember. what do you know about bb?
Is the 200 a value bet. And if you are folding to a raise is it worth it when the pot is already so big?
why not chk behind?

[vqc]

remmeber this quote

"if getting raised will make u throw up, then dont bet"

[Aplomado]

remmeber this quote

"if getting raised will make u throw up, then dont bet"

Then what's the point of betting for information?

[AHiltz]

remmeber this quote

"if getting raised will make u throw up, then dont bet"

Then what's the point of betting for information?

You're on the river. What information are you going to get??
You bet for info on the flop and turn. By the river you should have most of the info that you need.


I check and take notes.

[nogenius]

remmeber this quote

"if getting raised will make u throw up, then dont bet"

I agree with that if you're out of position and are first to act on the river.

But here, you've just gotten checked to twice, and I don't think most $10+1 opponents would do that twice with a hand that beats TPTK.

[Staresy]

I don't know about that. I have seen all sorts of weird and wonderful shit on the Stars $10+1's of late. I just think there are far too many hands out there (3rd hand of a $10+1 don't forget) that you have to be concerned about.

I check, contest a smaller pot (well, it already has 890 in it, so it is hardly slim pickings) and crucially get to look at what villian is up to. I then use that information to pound away on him later. If you bet 200 here and fold to a raise, you have wasted 1/3 of your stack on a hand you are still no wiser about whether you had the best of it or not.

[MAX]

Try putting opp. on a range of hands based on his call preflop (will be big lv1 w/no reads-- any pp, any Ax, any suited connectors/gappers...). Based on his call on the flop, narrow that range. The check on the turn and river IMO tell me that he probably doesn't have the nuts, but it doesn't mean he doesn't have you beat. He may just be taking a check call line with trips or 2 pair. How many hands in the ranges you came up with, and narrowed down, are you ahead of on the river but will still call a value bet(very few)? How many better hands are folding (none)? I think the bet on the river will cost you money in the long run because it won't extract value from beaten hands very often, and will lose you more when you are beaten.

A side note: what if this guy is truly a fish who has called down with AQ and hit his gin card on the river. He can't wait to reraise your river bet ai. I have seen countless people get ai in the first level with Ax on an A high f/t/r.

[konahead]

Just about the only hands that will call a river bet here will have you beat, so check and see if you have the best hand. Why bet and take the chance of a check-raise that you can't call? You don't have that good of a hand. All kinds of holdings can beat you. I wouldn't be suprised to see opp flip over 89 or AT for 2 pair.

Check behind.

[kingnat]

I did check behind... though in doing so I think I felt my penis shrink a little....

kingnat: checks
*** SHOW DOWN ***
TheDirtBag: shows [Ah Jc] (a pair of Aces)
kingnat: shows [Ks Ac] (a pair of Aces - King kicker)
kingnat collected 890 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 890 | Rake 0
Board [6c Ts 8d 9h As]
Seat 6: TheDirtBag (big blind) showed [Ah Jc] and lost with a pair of Aces
Seat 9: kingnat showed [Ks Ac] and won (890) with a pair of Aces

I can't believe that guy called 240 on the flop with two overs...

To be honest my biggest fear was that he held AT, or A8.. and based on his play the rest of the SnG I think he was trying to lay a trap with his check on the river.

Thanks for the feedback...

[AHiltz]

I can't believe that guy called 240 on the flop with two overs...

You underestimate the value of stupidity

[Aplomado]

You're on the river. What information are you going to get??
You bet for info on the flop and turn. By the river you should have most of the info that you need.


I check and take notes.

For some reason I thought we were talking about the flop bet.

This just goes to show: don't drink and give poker advice.