I wanna move up to $10.... but where???

[Prestonian]

Hi All,

New to this site, only just found it but already it has been added to my bookmarks..

Quick Question to begin,

Ive played $5 sngs for a few months now and am showing a good profit and am finishing ITM enough to have a ROI of over 30%. I want to now move up to $10sngs to see if I can increase my bankroll a little faster.

I will only 2 table max, as I find it difficult doing anymore than that at present. I play mainly at VC, UB, Bet365, Ladbrokes.

I started playing $10sngs last night. Bet365 - 10 man, I won. Ladbrokes, 10-man, I came 2nd and lastly I played at Party 10- man (i think) and busted out in 5th.
The chipstack count at Party was only 800 and I went from chip leader to busting out due to the blinds increasing, and becoming a high % of people's stack.... therefore it became a crapshoot towards the end. I thought it took the skill out of the game and was basically down to a lot of coin flips as to who stayed in (and luck of getting good cards of course!)

I just wondered where you thought would be the best site for me to begin my $10sng career? Should I stay away from the 800 chips stacks at party and play my normal game at VC (2000 chips) or at Bet365 etc etc (1500 chips)
Time is not of the essence (unlike some ppl who play for a living whereby party poker would be ideal). I just want to gradually grow my bankroll so that I can continually move up the ladder throughout this year.

I get the feeling at party that a lot of ppl who play there, do it for a living and are like 8-tabling to increase their hourly rate. Is it easy to adjust from $5 to $10 AND adjust from 1500 chips to 800 or is it a different ball game??

Any thoughts guys??

[Staresy]

Welcome to FTR Prestonian.

Good to have a fellow Brit about the place! Incidentally, I went to UCLan between 1997 and 2000!! Good ol' Tokyo Jo's, the Adelphi, Roper Hall, Squires/Quinceys! The list goes on and on!!!!

Anyway, re: where to play, I am going to shamelessly promote PokerStars because (a) I play there and (b) I think it has one of the better blind versus starting stack structures. It gives you plenty of time to play without it necessarily getting to an AI-fest (as per Party). UB has an identical structure to Stars but I understand is a tougher game. Bet365 (Prima network) I found all a bit odd with the blinds going up per no. of hands, rather than on a timed basis. I don't know anything about VC.

I do know that DavSimon (I think) wrote a very comprehensive guide about which sites to play on. You should have a look for that.

One word of caution though, you mention that ...

I want to now move up to $10sngs to see if I can increase my bankroll a little faster.

You need to make sure that you have the BR to support moving up. Ideally, you want between 20-25 buy-ins in order to cope with the inevitable downswing that will come. The worst thing that could happen is to move up too soon looking to make quick and easy money only to hit a severe downswing (believe me, it happens) and lose your BR at a level at which you are not supported for.

[Toe]

sorry for offtopic but Tokyo Jo's is an awesome place to go party

[Prestonian]

Hey Staresy!!

How ironic is that! Someone replied who went to Preston Uni!!

I live close to there and my regular club is Green (Club Solid)! The place has changed since 2000 mate.. you would be suprised how many halls of residences they can fit into a sq mile!!

Anyway.. back to the poker... so you think UB can be tough going but suggest going to Poker Stars?? Is PokerStars not supposed to be the toughest of them all?? Im sure ive read on various sites that it can be tough going?? How do you fare on there mate??
Im thinking of staying away from Party with their 800 chips, I much prefer 1000+ to be honest.

I think I have the pokerstars and Full Tilt Software on my PC but have yet to deposit. Ive also played Pacific but the software is terrible, and I dont find the play as "fishy" as everyone makes out. I think a lot of good players have gone there on the sly to make some easy money, so invariably on a 10-man table, there will always be 2-3 really good players anyway.

Regarding bankroll... I made my initial deposit and have withdrawn that now. I have $600 to play with so I feel I should be ok with the $10 sngs for now. I was playing ring games but just find trny play so much more exciting and rewarding.

Ive read the books like HOH1+2 and Sklansky and I think bankroll management is fundamental in my poker career so im looking no further than $10 for a long time!

[Staresy]

Anyway.. back to the poker... so you think UB can be tough going but suggest going to Poker Stars?? Is PokerStars not supposed to be the toughest of them all?? Im sure ive read on various sites that it can be tough going??

I don't think the $11s are tough at Stars. Yes there are some tough players about, but you get that everywhere. In fact, in the last few months, they have become more and more of a donk-fest. I dunno why.

Im thinking of staying away from Party with their 800 chips, I much prefer 1000+ to be honest.

Me too.

Regarding bankroll... I made my initial deposit and have withdrawn that now. I have $600 to play with so I feel I should be ok with the $10 sngs for now. I was playing ring games but just find trny play so much more exciting and rewarding.

Oh, you are sorted. I was just a little concerned that you had dunked $50 in, turned it into $100 and were looking to make your way to the WSOP! If you do play on Stars, let me know your SN and I will look out for you!

[DogOnMySide]

Another Brit to chuck his opinion in the ring...

I play Party $20+2's and enjoy the format. I don't agree it's a crapshoot in the way that a turbo is, where you sometimes play a whole tourney without getting a hand worth a damn.

I will say that being chipleader when you get down to 3 or 4 players means NOTHING at all. The chip lead can and will switcheroo, and the blinds are so high that everyone's M < 10. There's still skill involved though.

I'm interested in your opinions on Ladbrokes... i started there a couple of years back but switched for some reason (i can't remember why, i liked it at the time).

I'd also say that your bankroll of $600 is (in my opinion) adequate for $20+$2 tournaments, and that they are NO HARDER that the $10's or $5's. My suggestion is that you invest a maximum of $88 in $20+$2's... i.e. if you play 4 and lose them all then fair enough. One win = $100 though, so you just have to do well once to make your whole mini-bankroll back.

I am currently debating moving to $33's... but my BR is only $900 so i'm still waiting.

Oh, and Roper Hall is a shithouse.

[Prestonian]

ha ha im liking this site already! Lots of good banter!

Yea Roper is a shite hole for sure, as much of Preston is, but the footy team aint too bad!

Regarding my BR.. the $600 is all profit gained thru sheer hard work at the nano tables, $1 sngs and some bonus whoring at Party. All my Capital is safely removed from Neteller so Im playing now with profits. All this took 3-4 months.
Ive spent HOURS upon hours reading HOH1+2 and now have a good basis of understanding that will take me forward.

I have dipped my toes at higher levels... I actually entered my first $33 sng on Monday and won it, and came 3rd in a $22 on Ladbrokes. I also play "rounders" at Bet365 and "Ladders" at Ladbrokes which I think can be pretty lucrative from what ive seen so far. My main source of income now will be sngs and after completing an exercise over xmas where I made record of all my games played (69 played - ROI 33%) I feel as though im ready for the next level. Not quite sure about $20 sngs yet... I think I will stick with $10 until I can hopefully reach $1000 profit then move up again

Dog.. I dont have much to add on Ladbrokes as I only started playing there a few weeks ago but I can highly recommend VC Poker... the software is great, you have a buddy list, can chat in a forum on the welcome page and sngs fill up within 1 minute right up to $30 I believe so its easy to get a game. Ive played more poker on VC than anywhere.

[DogOnMySide]

I see VCPoker advertised all over the place actually but have never visited the site. Might check it out. Thanks

Interesting that you say "tried a $30 and won it, tried a $20 and came 3rd" but you're "not ready yet"

That's what i felt at $10... like i was playing with shit players and was about to move up to compete with good players... and that my wins were just one-offs...

in fact i only played $22's and $33's because i was pissed off and 'fancied a flutter'. When i won a few i thought "these are just as hard/easy, but you win more!"

anyway i would say set yourself a limit, give it a go and see what happens. it sounds like you're a better player than i am... i found it almost impossible to make a bankroll playing $5's and so on.

[Stripclubjunkie]

I recently moved to 11$ played them a few months, got bored so I have now recently moved to 16$ turbo, and they are fishy as hell! So my advice would be to move to 16$ turbos, you will pay less rake and they just as fishy as 5$ sng's.

Strip

[Prestonian]

Dog,

I see your point and its a valid one... but my personality says im quite a cautious person and although I faired well in those 2 trnys that netted me about $150 clear profit, I also know that I could have just got lucky.
Next step for "bread and butter" games will defo be $10's but I may also take the odd flutter at higher games as well (like most of us do!)

Get on VC.. you will find it really good, one of the best out there for sure IMHO. 9 max tables tho, not 10!

[Prestonian]

I recently moved to 11$ played them a few months, got bored so I have now recently moved to 16$ turbo, and they are fishy as hell! So my advice would be to move to 16$ turbos, you will pay less rake and they just as fishy as 5$ sng's.

Strip

TURBO??!! OMG ive had a few of these games and i really find them hard work. I dont think im ready for them just yet.

Although I may have a crack at a $5 one tonight to see how I do!

[DogOnMySide]

I hate turbos.

That is all.

[Stripclubjunkie]

I hate turbos.

That is all.

The blind raise allmost as fast as PP.

That is all.

[DogOnMySide]

I hate turbos.

That is all.

The blind raise allmost as fast as PP.

That is all.

Not in PP turbos they don't!


That is awl

[Stripclubjunkie]

No the PP turbos are a crapshot, but the stars turbos blinds raise just like PP normal speed.

[samsonite2100]

I'm playing the 22s at Bodog, and as bad as most of the players are, it ain't nothing compared to the $11s--An unmitigated donkfest in which, by not going all-in in the first five minutes, you're practically guaranteed ITM. Okay, an exaggeration, but not much...

[zenbitz]

I play Party $20+2's and enjoy the format. I don't agree it's a crapshoot in the way that a turbo is, where you sometimes play a whole tourney without getting a hand worth a damn.

PS Turbos != (not equal) PP Turbos.

PS Turbos are a "different kind of crap shoot" than PP 800 chippers (you get 1000 chips on PP at $55). The blinds go up (on average) a little faster - every 5 minutes as opposed to every 10 hands. But the stacks are MUCH deeper 1500 vs 800!

Blinds on PS start at 10/20 - so lvl 1 is 75BB (M=50) , PP start at 15/20 (40BB, M=23!).

PS also hit antes much sooner... I'm not even sure when PP sngs have antes.

The up shot of this is that you can actually play an orbit or two as PS before you are in push fold. PP you can enter maybe 1 hand with a raise or 3 with a limp at lvl 1. If you lose... you are push fold. In either case, if you get an early chip up, you can play a little post flop.

1/2 hour in in both cases it's all push/fold - just a matter of how many left, and it totally varies. between 3-9, typically.

[donkbee]

In fact, in the last few months, they have become more and more of a donk-fest. I dunno why.

Maybe it's 'cause I started playing them What's your SN, Staresy?

[MAX]

I don't play the $11s, but have heard from numerous respected posters that there is none as fishy as Bodog. Forget about structure, when there is a ripe game then that is the best place to play.

[samsonite2100]

It's the truth. I went from $220 to over $600 in 10 days playing Bodog 11s. Mind you, I am not a brilliant player--but basic, unretarded, TAG play makes you Doyle Brunson over there.

[JeffreyGB]

Prestonian,

I like the suggestion of testing the waters in the $22s. Your roll can support it, and by playing below your roll, you're basically shooting yourself in the foot (I'm saying this from experience, because I did the same thing, though for me a part of it was that I didn't feel I had the experience behind me that I wanted before playing for higher stakes).

I can understand continuing to play the 10s if you're uncomfortable about the money involved and want to gain experience, but a suggestion I might make is to try your game in a 22 each time you win a 11. That way you're not risking too much, but you still get a chance for good profit. The skill level difference between the two isn't very significant. 33s on Stars is where players start to have a clue; 55s and up are where you might have a table of people with a good idea of winning play.

[Prestonian]

cheers for the replies guys..

Not done much on the sng front tonight but had a crack at 3 x $11's finishing 3rd , 3rd and 6th. The 6th im not bothered about cos my AK got cracked with a well disguised QQQ so I was left with virtually no chips so just putting that one down to bad luck eh???!!!

Was on Ladbrokes... also spent time playing ladders and managed to double my tokens so im well happy with that.... in fact extremely happy!!

I think the advice I will take is to play 10 x $11's and see how I do, then maybe every 10 games, have a crack at a $22 (or if I win 1 x $11 go str8 to a $22)

This Bodog seems interesting tho... may have to have a look at this....

Cheers

[Staresy]

Maybe it's 'cause I started playing them

I doubt it!

What's your SN, Staresy?

originally enough, Staresy.
My pic is Cartman - respect my authoritah. I like to think that I am sending out a subliminal message when I'm at the table!!