A hypothetical.

[vqc]

Version 1
Dealt to pocktmullets [Jc Jh]
straddle: calls 30
viper94: calls 30
rockjim: folds
Ryan5150: folds
pocktmullets: raises 90 to 120
gilby1969: folds
dxjwatson: folds
straddle: folds
viper94: calls 90
*** FLOP *** [5h Kd 8d]
viper94: bets 150
pocktmullets: raises 180 to 330
viper94: calls 180
*** TURN *** [5h Kd 8d] [3h]
viper94: bets 120
pocktmullets: raises 1245 to 1365 and is all-in

Version 2
Dealt to pocktmullets [Jc Jh]
straddle: calls 30
viper94: calls 30
rockjim: folds
Ryan5150: folds
pocktmullets: raises 90 to 120
gilby1969: folds
dxjwatson: folds
straddle: folds
viper94: calls 90
*** FLOP *** [5h Kd Qd]
viper94: bets 150
pocktmullets: raises 180 to 330
viper94: calls 180
*** TURN *** [5h Kd 8d] [3h]
viper94: bets 120
pocktmullets: raises 1245 to 1365 and is all-in

Do you think one play is more valid than the other becuase of the different flop textures?

I was thinking that with the K85 villian is very unlikely to be betting twice with an 8 or a 5, but with a KQ5, villian could have a donk Qx.

How big of a difference do u think this makes if at all?

[Trikflow77]

What your getting at is that it it is much more likely that someone has a King on the K85 board........and the other board has obvv draws that JJ is ahead of. Or the donkey could have a Q...... which would make it easier to move him off his crappy hand on the turn.

[vqc]

What your getting at is that it it is much more likely that someone has a King on the K85 board........and the other board has obvv draws that JJ is ahead of. Or the donkey could have a Q...... which would make it easier to move him off his crappy hand on the turn.

exactly.
does this thinking have any merit?

and would ur play be different given these two boards?
I mean would u tell me that ur turn bet was shitty if the board had been version 2 instead of version 1?

[Trikflow77]

What your getting at is that it it is much more likely that someone has a King on the K85 board........and the other board has obvv draws that JJ is ahead of. Or the donkey could have a Q...... which would make it easier to move him off his crappy hand on the turn.

exactly.
does this thinking have any merit?

and would ur play be different given these two boards?
I mean would u tell me that ur turn bet was shitty if the board had been version 2 instead of version 1?

my turn bet is much less shitty in version 2

[vqc]

What your getting at is that it it is much more likely that someone has a King on the K85 board........and the other board has obvv draws that JJ is ahead of. Or the donkey could have a Q...... which would make it easier to move him off his crappy hand on the turn.

exactly.
does this thinking have any merit?

and would ur play be different given these two boards?
I mean would u tell me that ur turn bet was shitty if the board had been version 2 instead of version 1?

my turn bet is much less shitty in version 2

yay!
i think im finally beginning to understand wat "reading the board" means.

[pgil]

although if he is a donkey with a Q, can he really be moved off of his hand?? most of the time, no.

[fasin8ing]

Version 2
Dealt to pocktmullets [Jc Jh]
straddle: calls 30
viper94: calls 30
rockjim: folds
Ryan5150: folds
pocktmullets: raises 90 to 120
gilby1969: folds
dxjwatson: folds
straddle: folds
viper94: calls 90
*** FLOP *** [5h Kd Qd]
viper94: bets 150
pocktmullets: raises 180 to 330
viper94: calls 180
*** TURN *** [5h Kd 8d] [3h]
viper94: bets 120
pocktmullets: raises 1245 to 1365 and is all-in

Do you think one play is more valid than the other becuase of the different flop textures?

I was thinking that with the K85 villian is very unlikely to be betting twice with an 8 or a 5, but with a KQ5, villian could have a donk Qx.

How big of a difference do u think this makes if at all?

Dude what happen to the Queen on the Flop? Hypothetically changed from a Q to an 8 ??? That is a different texture.. I dont understand version 1 at all.. Version 2.. I get.

[konahead]

well, people are much more likely to stay in with a K than a Q, but AQ would have called and on flop 2 you have a lot more ways to lose.... K, Q, straight draw, 4-to-a-flush-with-2-cards-to-go...

Trikflow77 - pls explain why version 2 is better than version 1 - this is interesting. I would have said the opposite....

[pgil]

i think its because in version 1 only a K is still in, and is unlikely to fold. while in version 2 opp may be on a str8 draw, a Q, maybe a backdoor flush draw (although kinda unlikely), or a K. you are ahead of the draws, and behind both the K and the Q, although the Q may be forced to fold 2nd pair to the all in.

[GatorJH]

I CAN SEE!!! I CAN SEE!!!!

Wow, what an interesting comparison. At first glance I had the same question as Kona, why wouldn't option 2 be scarier with two overcards to my J's.

However, after reading the posts I can see how there would be more instances where you are ahead with option 2 than option 1.

Correct?

[Scuba Chuck]

However, after reading the posts I can see how there would be more instances where you are ahead with option 2 than option 1.

Correct?

Yes, from a hand reading exercise, I agree. I don't really care for this play in low buyin SNGs. I think I'd rather play for a small pot here (and perhaps even shut down), because our pot equity is soo small against our villain's likely range.

Anyway, why not be specific? Put your opponents on hand ranges in version 1 & 2.