Bet or Check this river?

[chris_1069]

Ok so I just got the following hand in a 1 table $2+0.40 SnG. I limped this hand since the table had been pretty weak pre-flop and very few hands were being raised.

After this flop, the initial raiser in EP, my re-raise, and his call (of my re-raise) is there more value over time betting this river or checking behind? I was thinking a made set on the flop may want to hide behind my bets and just call it down so which play do you make?

Stage #376430635 Tourney ID 1031119 Holdem Single Tournament No Limit $15 - 2006-04-12 19:58:03 (ET)
Table: 6790234 (Real Money) Seat #8 is the dealer
Seat 1 - EH SAYS HI ($1730 in chips)
Seat 2 - WINFURT ($1430 in chips)
Seat 3 - JOKER617 ($1330 in chips)
Seat 5 - TIGERSWEETIE ($1030 in chips)
Seat 6 - OBERNOE ($1735 in chips)
Seat 7 - CHRIS_1069 ($2260 in chips)
Seat 8 - FULLOFDOUGH ($1815 in chips)
Seat 9 - MTHOUSE ($2170 in chips)
MTHOUSE - Posts small blind $15
EH SAYS HI - Posts big blind $30
*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to CHRIS_1069 [5d Ad]
WINFURT - Folds
JOKER617 - Calls $30
TIGERSWEETIE - Folds
OBERNOE - Calls $30
CHRIS_1069 - Calls $30
FULLOFDOUGH - Folds
MTHOUSE - Calls $15
EH SAYS HI - Checks
*** FLOP *** [5s 7h Ac]
MTHOUSE - Bets $120
EH SAYS HI - Calls $120
JOKER617 - Folds
OBERNOE - Calls $120
CHRIS_1069 - Raises $570 to $570
MTHOUSE - Calls $450
EH SAYS HI - Folds
OBERNOE - Folds
*** TURN *** [5s 7h Ac] [10h]
MTHOUSE - Checks
CHRIS_1069 - Bets $600
MTHOUSE - Calls $600
*** RIVER *** [5s 7h Ac 10h] [2h]
MTHOUSE - Checks
CHRIS_1069 - ????

[retro69]

That early on in the tournament i probably wouldnt even have played A5 from that position. Too likely someone had Ax with a better kicker. But if the table was tight then its an ok limp.

Your re-raise on the flop for me is a bit too much, a raise to say 350-400 would have scared any marginal hands away.

Id personally check the river. He says he has something, if you check and lose you still have a decent size stack to play with, if you raise and he re-raises you all in you have a difficult desicion. Unless you have some read on him then id check it.

[drmcboy]

I'm doing whatever you think gets more of your chips in. Most people are not checking a hand to you on the river.

[givememyleg]

Villian sure played this hand very weird. I don't mind limping a suited Ace this early, esspecially with 2 other limpers already, in hopes of hitting a flush or 2pair.

I like the way it was played postflop.

I think I would check the river. The pot has over 2500 in it, and you have a showdown hand. There is a good chance you have the best hand here, so just show it down... any river bet you make will certainly put you AI. "2 pair is not the nuts," and I only like to be AI this early with the nuts, or near nuts.

[chris_1069]

Villian sure played this hand very weird. I don't mind limping a suited Ace this early, esspecially with 2 other limpers already, in hopes of hitting a flush or 2pair.

I like the way it was played postflop.

I think I would check the river. The pot has over 2500 in it, and you have a showdown hand. There is a good chance you have the best hand here, so just show it down... any river bet you make will certainly put you AI. "2 pair is not the nuts," and I only like to be AI this early with the nuts, or near nuts.

Ok so this says about exactly what I was thinking.

That early on in the tournament i probably wouldnt even have played A5 from that position. Too likely someone had Ax with a better kicker. But if the table was tight then its an ok limp.

Given my position on this hand, and the fact that the table was weak pre-flop, I think a limp is a decent play here. I would not want to play this hand for top pair, of course, but as givememyleg says it was in hopes of hitting a flush or 2pair.

BTW I had already folded A7s, mid position, no raise, A3s on the button, with 1 pre-flop raise, and perhaps a few more... seemed to get quite a few of them early this tourney. Generally I do not favour it as a good hand, but with the CO position, blinds + a couple limpers, I don't mind putting out a small blind (and folding if there was a raise from Button or the blinds, unless the situation stipulated a call)

In this case I still think he could have easily had a better hand and considering my stack if I checked and lost vs bet and lost (bust) it was pretty easy decision.

*** RIVER *** [5s 7h Ac 10h] [2h]
MTHOUSE - Checks
CHRIS_1069 - Checks
*** SHOW DOWN ***
MTHOUSE - Shows [7c 5c] (Two Pair, sevens and fives)
CHRIS_1069 - Shows [5d Ad] (Two Pair, aces and fives)
CHRIS_1069 Collects $2730 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total Pot($2730)
Board [5s 7h Ac 10h 2h]
Seat 1: EH SAYS HI (big blind) Folded on the FLOP
Seat 2: WINFURT Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 3: JOKER617 Folded on the FLOP
Seat 5: TIGERSWEETIE Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 6: OBERNOE Folded on the FLOP
Seat 7: CHRIS_1069 won Total ($2730) HI$2730) with Two Pair, aces and fives [5d Ad - P:Ad,B:Ac,B:5s,P:5d,B:10h]
Seat 8: FULLOFDOUGH (dealer) Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 9: MTHOUSE (small blind) HI:lost with Two Pair, sevens and fives [7c 5c - B:7h,P:7c,B:5s,P:5c,B:Ac]

Ok so this time he had a decent, 2nd best hand, but this could have been me when he could have flipped a low pp with a made set, AKh even? ... maybe?

I still favour the check I think.

[chris_1069]

Your re-raise on the flop for me is a bit too much, a raise to say 350-400 would have scared any marginal hands away.

When I re-raised the flop I remember, it was exactly what the pot showed for me (I.e., a pot sized re-raise.) I hit about the best hand I could hope for except flopping the nut flush, or getting a free card with a draw to my nut flush...

I was trying to figure out what he had, not to mention th 2 other people that called his flop bet! Unless my raise here was strong I was not confident I could narrow the field to heads up, and did not want to allow for some other random hand to draw out with runner runner flush, boat, whatever.

But I don't know maybe a better play would have been a smaller bet, get say 2 callers(still more money in pot than my initial play) make the same turn bet (or add that extra 150ish I saved on the flop to this bet) and still get the same 1 caller (hopefully unless the other guy improved also) and by the end, if played the same on river, make an extra couple hundred...?

Thoughts?

[zenbitz]

I am afraid of something like 68 hearts, or AT, or even A7. Not to mention slow played mfing sets.

With his crappy 2 pair, he probably calls your bet on the river, but that's about the only thing that does that you beat.

[Fnord]

With his crappy 2 pair, he probably calls your bet on the river, but that's about the only thing that does that you beat.

WTF games are you playing in?!?!?!

I push this river twice on Sunday. It's a really good spot and Ax pays off like a slot machine in these games.

Although, as played, I push the turn, so the river is moot.

[nutsinho]

With his crappy 2 pair, he probably calls your bet on the river, but that's about the only thing that does that you beat.

WTF games are you playing in?!?!?!

I push this river twice on Sunday. It's a really good spot and Ax pays off like a slot machine in these games.

Although, as played, I push the turn, so the river is moot.

agree

[supermoneyz1]

There is a good chance you have the best hand here, so just show it down...

Wrong attitude. If I have the best hand I am going to bet for value...and hope a weaker hand comes along for the ride.

I am afraid of something like 68 hearts, or AT, or even A7. Not to mention slow played mfing sets.

How has the opponent shown any strength? Plus its a 2.20 SNG, such bad players I'd say atleast 85 percent of the time Hero is ahead.

Alot of begginers adapt this same attitude, they fail to bet the river and check the best hand. This is just flat out bad poker for 2 reasons...
1. Opponent usually is never trapping he just wants to see a show down
2. He will usually call the River bet if you have built up the pot through out the hand

The only real question you need to ask you'reself "Is my hand most likely the best, given the way my opponent has played it?, the answer is Yes."

I am ALWAYS pushing this river and if I bust gg next tournament.

I can make