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QQ to two shoves ($27)

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  1. #1

    Default QQ to two shoves ($27)

    Strange spot. UTG+1 is a winning player (12% ROI/$6900 profit according to Sharkscope). Plays LAgg in the early stages - stats something like 33/18. CO's stats at this point were something like 21% VPIP, this is the first hand he's raised. Cold called a raise and a re-raise with KTs though.

    PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t50 (8 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

    MP1 (t2085)
    MP2 (t1295)
    CO (t3230)
    Button (t1445)
    SB (t735)
    BB (t2090)
    Hero (t1225)
    UTG+1 (t1395)

    Preflop: Hero is UTG with Q, Q.
    Hero raises to t150, UTG+1 raises to t1395, 2 folds, CO raises to t3230, 3 folds, Hero looks down at 2.5 to 1 pot odds and...
  2. #2

    Default Re: QQ to two shoves ($27)

    Quote Originally Posted by taipan168
    Strange spot. UTG+1 is a winning player (12% ROI/$6900 profit according to Sharkscope). Plays LAgg in the early stages - stats something like 33/18. CO's stats at this point were something like 21% VPIP, this is the first hand he's raised. Cold called a raise and a re-raise with KTs though.

    PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t50 (8 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

    MP1 (t2085)
    MP2 (t1295)
    CO (t3230)
    Button (t1445)
    SB (t735)
    BB (t2090)
    Hero (t1225)
    UTG+1 (t1395)

    Preflop: Hero is UTG with Q, Q.
    Hero raises to t150, UTG+1 raises to t1395, 2 folds, CO raises to t3230, 3 folds, Hero looks down at 2.5 to 1 pot odds and...
    Calls! I bet you did. CO has already shown himself to be a bit of a donk. You can put TT, JJ, maybe even 99 in his range, and when he does flip over a dominating hand, you still have a chance to suck out

    PS Big congrats on the 4000th post!!
    3k post - Return of the blog!
  3. #3
    I would fold to two pushes


  4. #4
    Actually this is probably closer than at first glance. With the blinds that low and if the CO is quite passive.

    I still call though. i don't think 25 BBs is deep enough to be folding QQ preflop.
    3k post - Return of the blog!
  5. #5
    Fold in an SNG. I don't think that you have a need at 25/50 to risk your life against a winning player and an unknown. The KTs reraise could have been just a positional steal. This is a little different considering he doesn't want anyone else to call, hence his push. UTG+1 could have AK and CO has KK+.

    This is an easy call in an MTT, IMO.
  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Sprayed
    Fold in an SNG. I don't think that you have a need at 25/50 to risk your life against a winning player and an unknown. The KTs reraise could have been just a positional steal. This is a little different considering he doesn't want anyone else to call, hence his push. UTG+1 could have AK and CO has KK+.

    This is an easy call in an MTT, IMO.
    The CO flatcalled a raise and a reraise with KTs, so he must be a donk! Maybe it's just the stakes I play, and the mental gamboooolers at party, but there's no way I would lay this down.

    Is the reason it is a call in an MTT because SnGs are about survival and MTTs are about accumulation?
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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by badgers
    Quote Originally Posted by Sprayed
    Fold in an SNG. I don't think that you have a need at 25/50 to risk your life against a winning player and an unknown. The KTs reraise could have been just a positional steal. This is a little different considering he doesn't want anyone else to call, hence his push. UTG+1 could have AK and CO has KK+.

    This is an easy call in an MTT, IMO.
    The CO flatcalled a raise and a reraise with KTs, so he must be a donk! Maybe it's just the stakes I play, and the mental gamboooolers at party, but there's no way I would lay this down.

    Is the reason it is a call in an MTT because SnGs are about survival and MTTs are about accumulation?
    We are talking about a $27. That's not to say that donks don't live there, but you will see more positional play with hands like KTs if people in lp feel like others are getting out of line. However, in turbo SNGs people should stray away from making a lot of plays. I could be wrong, but the push all in over a raise and a reraise is a sign to me that he has a big hand and doesn't want others in the hand. If others want to play, they will be playing for all of their chips.

    SNGs are about survival and MTTs are about chip accumulation. In an MTT, you are getting the right price against their range to make this call. In an SNG you not only have to know if you are getting the right odds to call but you also have to think about your chip position in the tourney. If you call and lose you are out and you are sacrificing your chances to cash. Which in an SNG you want to money as often as possible.

    MTTs are different because you have to make it to the FT or the top 3 to really walk away with a good profit. In order to get there you have to accumulate chips. Every time you open up a single table you want to try and cash ever time. Therefore, survival is key and early chip accumulation is less important because you can win by just getting to the bubble and taking advantage of it.
  8. #8
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    Instinctively I think you're ahead or flipping with AK (and both played could have aces or kings in their hands). the decent player knows his hand is hard to play post-flop, so it's likely a mid PP or he's pushing AK to see all 5 cards. The CO's raise here basically says he has a similar hand rather than AA which should call, though KK might well push.

    I think utg+1 had JJ and CO had TT. I am also being overoptimistic
  9. #9
    So wait, are you saying that you think that the call is +cEV, but not +$EV? I haven't ever tried to differentiate between the 2 until sometimes when there are 5 players left, but usually not until the bubble. Looks like that's another thing I have to work on...
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  10. #10
    With your reads I think I fold here.
  11. #11
    Thanks, I thought about this one for quite a while before folding. I thought that the risk of AA/KK was just too great particularly when CO reshoved.
  12. #12
    what did they have ?


  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by TLR
    what did they have ?
    Results in white below (if you don't want to bias your thought processes then don't look)
    UTG+1 flipped AKo, CO flipped 88
  14. #14
    Meh.. i felt like it was a call but that doesnt matter after you post results. Seemed like they both could have AK here though.
  15. #15
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