ICM - when and why?

[PalmiCa]

I could not found any thread about ICM regarding question,
when to use it.
When is this concept out of use, somebody shortstacked?
If we are below 5*BB, or if we are UTG and under 8*BB.

Any thoghts.

[gingerwizard]

Every hand in a tournament where chip value is not equal to cash value

[PalmiCa]

I read somewhere that ICM concept is not correct if somebody at the table have less then 5*BB. Is that true, and why?

[taipan168]

I read somewhere that ICM concept is not correct if somebody at the table have less then 5*BB. Is that true, and why?

No, it's not true. What is true is that ICM tends to overvalue very very short stacks like 1-2x BB but for stacks above that it isn't a problem.

As Ginger said, ICM is applicable in any tournament because chip value will always be unequal to cash value. For example, in a single table tournament with 50/30/20 payout, if you win 100% of the chips on the table you only win 50% of the prize pool.

Even on the very first hand of the tournament, ICM is applicable. For example, first hand of the tourney and you're on the BB with 22. It folds around to the SB who shoves all-in onto your BB and shows you AKo face up. If this was a cash game you would call the all-in every time because you are 52.6% to win but you are getting even money odds. However, in a single table tourney you would have to fold because even though you double your chip stack, you do not double your share of the prize pool.

The other thing is that the divergence between chip value and $ value changes as the tourney progresses, and is most acute on the bubble and even more so when two big stacks go up against each other with a short stack on the table.

Hope that helped

[Kijjo]

very good explanation tai, I like the example. some people still won't get it, but that's ok, we'll be there at the table waiting