stupid question...

[Chopper]

i really hate asking this because i know the answers will range from "it depends" to "small sample" to "your a freakin' donkey." but, here goes anyway...

i have played DONs for awhile. they suck nowadays....too nitted up w/ massive multi-tablers. and, bottom line, they just arent fun anymore. i did well. i just got bored.

so, i thought i'd give SNGs a shot. i used to play them in 2006, but i switched to cash. and, until my foray into DONs, hadnt given them a 2nd chance. but, they ARE fun!

i read TLR/taipan's little guide on strat and "anything turbo." (great essay, btw) and, i thought i'd give them a go after learning the basics. although, i think your roi would run higher at mtt's, i like these for the speed/hourly of them....and, my limited time blocks to play.

what is to be expected in terms of roi and itm? just a ballpark is fine. (i know "anything positive is fine." but, i am not after just barely beating the donkey stakes.) short-term, if possible, i would like to know what an average session would bring to a guy 4-tabling the 3.40s and maybe the next level up for about 2 hours at a time. seems i can play about 6 per hour if i 4-table continuously. and, what is the best way to track progress other than sharkscope? i havent stumbled across anything yet in all the strat articles, although i'm sure something is there.

thanks in advance, and sorry for the ramble.

[fulksy]

officailpokerrankings.com tracks them ok. breaks Sngs down to stt, 9-45, 45-180, and 180 +(which wouldn't be a sng), also shows itm stats, ROI, how many times you finish in each poisition(1st,2nd,5th,etc) and a few other stats. i use it more than sharkscope cause its free and you get as many searches as you want.

[OneEyeLefty]

I agree OfficialPokerRankingsdotcom will give you all the info needed to track your specific game. I would like to be ITM 75% of the time with an ROI of plus 50%. If I can't keep these stats after 1000 games I drop a level.

Lefty

[Chopper]

fulksy,
OPR only tracks STTs and HU for fulltilt. it wont track for pokerstars.

[rong]

From sticky SNG FAQs

Code:
Buyin ITM% ROI%
$3.40 40-50% 25%+
$5.50 40-50% 25%+
$6.50 38-45% 20-25%
$11 40-45% 20-25%
$16 38-44% 12-20%
$20 38-45% 12-20%
$27 38-43% 10-15%
$33 37-42% 10-15%
$50 36-42% 8-13%
$60 36-42% 8-13%
$100+ 36-42% 5-10%

2+2 FAQ wrote:
$3.40s - 18%
$6s - 16%
$16s - 14%
$27s - 12%
$60s - 10%
$114s - 8%
$225s - 6%
$335s+ - 4%

[flomo]

I would like to be ITM 75% of the time with an ROI of plus 50%.

show me the way please Master 1I

[Chopper]

I would like to be ITM 75% of the time with an ROI of plus 50%.

show me the way please Master 1I

yeh. i figured that was a bit cock-eyed. hell, even 45% seems high. but, it makes me feel good about my uber-small sample set so far.

[rong]

At low levels, I've never been above 40% ITM over a sample of over 100. But id you can hit 36+ at any level you're making money

[Chopper]

thanks for the responses, guys. i have been dabbling with the turbo 340s today and think i'll move up well before i accumulate a decent sample. i just wanted to have an idea of where i may fall. ....now, if i can only find a way to track these things for free w/o having to manually enter the summaries/HHs.

i am trying to set PT up to do this, but its a royal pain in the arse.

oh, and i know about BR mgmnt, and im still rolled to move up twice more....using 100 BIs. no need to hit me over the head with that brick....lol.

[flomo]

wish i could help chopper but currently i'm just a hobby player
4 tabling the stars $11 sngs with no software and some liquor

i should say that since i have moved up to the $11's i feeel i need a hud and tracking program--i keep seeing the same dudes over and over

[Chopper]

i just came off a horrid night. i played at least 17 sngs....12 stts and 5 2tablers. hell, i stopped counting i had to reload so fast. i cashed twice. at least i won one of them.

but, jesus, i dont think AK won one flip when i held it. i dont think i got it in bad but 25% of the time. yet, i saw the kickers of the dominated fags hit more often than a hooker gets laid.

brutal. just brutal.

i suppose anything is possible with turbo stt's, but holy crap. thats some variance....or horrible play. sadly, i dont have enough experience in these to know which it was yet.

[flomo]

i can't stand the turbos, i play the turtles

[fulksy]

opr use to work for ps, but maybe it changed. i started playing reg speed sngs, but lately finding turbos way eaiser most players in low buy in sngs play terrible with high blinds, if you work on your push fold game late in sngs imo turbos are much more profitable. i think somewhere anywhere between 15% and 25% roi in low buy in sngs over a decent sample is pretty good, at least thats my goal to hover around their. 75% itm and over 50% ROI is rediculous

[Nakamura]

The figures posted in this thread are too high these days. You have to be pretty damn good these days to maintain an ROI between 20-25% at the $6.50's. There are too many God-damned regs/nits at them!

HEM is a good way to track your tournaments. It automatically imports in the background without the need to enter summaries. I know you will spend $55 on buying it, but IMO you will make that money back quick by spending the time you would normally spend entering information to play games! +EV .... Tournament support is also vastly improved. I posted a thread a way back with short video in it. I will try to find the post.

Found it...
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...em-t80908.html

[Chopper]

mucho thanko, naka.

the $55 is of no concern if i felt it helped that much. i'm kind of a cheapass, but it wouldnt put a dent in the roll. it would just cost $55 for some other version of what i have.

however, if i dont need to waste all that time requesting and importing, i may jump on it and slowly transfer my cash games over to it, too. i'll be damned if i run one for rings and the other for tourneys...lol.

thanks again.

[Nakamura]

the $55 is of no concern if i felt it helped that much. i'm kind of a cheapass, but it wouldnt put a dent in the roll. it would just cost $55 for some other version of what i have.

There's being cheap and then there's making a +EV decision. How much time do you spend messing around entering these things, and how much do you earn an hour? If you can't work this out quick, you need HEM!

[Chopper]

the $55 is of no concern if i felt it helped that much. i'm kind of a cheapass, but it wouldnt put a dent in the roll. it would just cost $55 for some other version of what i have.

There's being cheap and then there's making a +EV decision. How much time do you spend messing around entering these things, and how much do you earn an hour? If you can't work this out quick, you need HEM!

well, ive played a big ONE whole day of STTs, so the answer is that i am still in "trial mode" with them. i will likely be setting up the trial version today anyway.

oh, and the reason i am open to alternatives is because i cant even get them entered into PT. i dont mind following sharkscope/opr, but i want to look at some of my hands and make sure i am progressing away from donkeydome.

[Nakamura]

i dont mind following sharkscope/opr, but i want to look at some of my hands and make sure i am progressing away from donkeydome.

Use a hand replayer? They are free and downloadable.

[Chopper]

i dont mind following sharkscope/opr, but i want to look at some of my hands and make sure i am progressing away from donkeydome.

Use a hand replayer? They are free and downloadable.

now you are just being an enabler...lol.

[Nakamura]

i dont mind following sharkscope/opr, but i want to look at some of my hands and make sure i am progressing away from donkeydome.

Use a hand replayer? They are free and downloadable.

now you are just being an enabler...lol.

You must be quite the master brick layer with all these walls you are building ... :P

[flomo]

is there a HEM link on FTR?