Ugly river spot with broadway

[fjuanl]

Normally not my standard to do this pre, but BTN was limping over half his hands. BB is also a fish and a calling station. This is the $22 6max 500 cap on Sunday

Reads on BTN
- flatted an open with K2s in the SB
- c/r overbet shove with AJo on AQ8hh after calling a preflop raise

Poker Stars $20+$2 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t150/t300 Blinds + t40 - 6 players

MP: t8740 M = 12.67
CO: t9036 M = 13.10
BTN: t26478 M = 38.37
Hero (SB): t19983 M = 28.96
BB: t17135 M = 24.83
UTG: t5378 M = 7.79

Pre Flop: (t690) Hero is SB with J K
3 folds, BTN calls t300, Hero raises to t1200, BB calls t900, BTN calls t900

Flop: (t3840) Q 7 A (3 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, BTN checks

Turn: (t3840) T (3 players)
Hero bets t2800, BB folds, BTN calls t2800

River: (t9440) 7 (2 players)
Hero bets t4650, BTN raises to t18600, Hero calls t11293 all in

[Sprayed]

Since he sounds like a loose passive donk, I would tend to believe him.

[baudib]

gross, looks like a fold though...suited whatever and a check in position on the button with a flush draw, overbet with the flush seems like standard fish play.

i'm torn between leading the flop and checking.

[drmcboy]

I call, he could maybe have an ace and probably would raise with a 7.

torn on flop, i think b/f is probably better

[revolvingiris]

torn on flop, i think b/f is probably better

Really? It doesn't really look like fjuanl has a ton of FE with those reads. I think the river is a call also. Seems like villain could easily do this with 2 pair and almost 100% of the time with 7x.

[sk8r_daniel]

I dont like cbetting against 2 players who call wide, on an ace high flushing flop.

As for the river call. It doesnt seem like a boat..since he doesnt raise flop or turn(donkies do weird things at times, but it seems like he is aggresive with his TP type hands. I am only fearing the diamonds...and im sure there are more hands that you beat.

[drmcboy]

If they are stations who never fold I'd just call pre, I don't really see what value the raise is if we won't c bet A x boards since I assume we would also check rag boards. You're more likely to get 3 streets of value from TP by limping.

[revolvingiris]

If they are stations who never fold I'd just call pre, I don't really see what value the raise is if we won't c bet A x boards since I assume we would also check rag boards. You're more likely to get 3 streets of value from TP by limping.

Would you ever raise just for the sake of isolation? Limping almost always guarantees more people behind fjuanl into the pot. I like the idea of limping here. I'm just trying to grasp the worth of creating a HU scenario (even though that didn't happen in the hand).

[fjuanl]

The responses I've been getting about preflop are pretty mixed, which I thought was interesting. From watching cash game videos I know a lot of them would be giving me grief if I completed because I'd be missing value. I agree and would think its a mistake to complete if this were cash, but maybe there's some argument to simply keeping pots smaller in MTTs? We are about 70BB's deep in this hand which isn't normal this late

I think I should have cbet the flop. At the time I was thinking there was too much Ax in their range and they would never fold Qx. But both have such wide ranges and if I get called they often will pot control on turns and I can sometimes win when I hit my King and be able to get the stack in easier if the turn is a Ten

FWIW my plan was to cbet rag flops and drier Axx flops even with 2 callers

[Stacks]

Gonna preface this by saying I know nothing about solid tourney play.

Regarding preflop, I think either completing or raising is fine. As to which is more +EV, I'm really not sure. Both have their merits. Raising is good because we are likely ahead of villains limp/calling range. However, we are effectively building a larger pot OOP against a villain where we are likely going to have to make the best hand to win, as he probably hates to fold. So we will find ourselves check/folding the flops often, or cbetting only to be called, then c/folding turn unimproved.

Limping preflop, avoids this, and allows us to see a cheaper flop against a wider range which we have more equity against. We keep the pot smaller when OOP, which is a good thing from a positional disadvantage point. And since we really can't do anything but make a hand and vbet this individual (most likely), we get to do this while risking less preflop, which is pretty important since your playing with a shorter effective stack than in cash games.

On the flop, again, I'm a little torn on the situation. From a range standpoint our range > their range.. However, villains aren't going to fold a better hand to a single bet. And the only 'worse' hands that would call wouldbe flush draws, but they have loads of equity against you (9-15 outs), in position, which means a villain wouldn't be making a mistake calling with those hands.

I think I lean towards just c/folding the flop.

On turn, obv bet. Sizing can be a bit bigger. It's likely that when BU checks back this flop, he has some SD value, and has probably already decided to call 1-2 streets depending on the turn/river cards. So I'd bet like $3300 here. Also more draws came in, that he can easily peel a turn bet with.

As far as river, we are def value betting. Facing river shove, my curiosity says call, but my gut says fold.

I suppose it's correct for him to shove like any 7x, as you almost never has a flush (if ever), or else you would have cbet. So the only hand he is beat by would be a higher 7x (which is uber unlikely as I don't think you raise a 7x hand out of the SB here that wouldn't cbet this board [77, A7s]), or the hand you have KJ.

He's shoving any flush, but some % of the time he's going to stab at the pot on the flop with his fairly large amount of fold equity, and little fear of getting check/raised. I doubt the typical passive player would shove 2 pair type hands, not that he has any of those hands often as he would more than likely bet the flop/turn.

[baudib]

based on reads KJo is ahead of both villain's limp-call ranges. I'm ok with calling or raising preflop but the flop is probably a bet-fold after raising.