was this call correct?

[Gambler71]

Hi

Was this call correct? (The All In):
If no Why not?

PokerStars Game #56955629475: Tournament #359929007, $3.00+$0.40 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level II (15/30) - 2011/02/01 14:34:21 PT [2011/02/01 17:34:21 ET]
Table '359929007 1' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: cranko_loco (2300 in chips)
Seat 2: Alkemizten (1460 in chips)
Seat 3: tylabi (1650 in chips)
Seat 4: mashtee2003 (1410 in chips)
Seat 5: DomPepeSHSOP (1540 in chips)
Seat 6: HooMjoo (750 in chips)
Seat 7: rvrandrocker (1370 in chips)
Seat 8: Miklo33 (1210 in chips)
Seat 9: Fehjul67 (1810 in chips)
Miklo33: posts small blind 15
Fehjul67: posts big blind 30
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to mashtee2003 [Jc Js]
cranko_loco: folds
Alkemizten: folds
tylabi: calls 30
mashtee2003: raises 120 to 150
DomPepeSHSOP: folds
HooMjoo: folds
rvrandrocker: folds
Miklo33: folds
Fehjul67: raises 150 to 300
tylabi: folds
mashtee2003: calls 150
*** FLOP *** [6h 3h Ts]
Fehjul67: bets 330
mashtee2003: raises 780 to 1110 and is all-in

[fulksy]

welcome to FTR.

don't think you can convert until you have 10 posts, so this might make it easier to read.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, 3.4 Tournament, 15/30 Blinds (9 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

UTG (t2300)
UTG+1 (t1460)
MP1 (t1650)
Hero (MP2) (t1410)
MP3 (t1540)
CO (t750)
Button (t1370)
SB (t1210)
BB (t1810)

Hero's M: 31.33

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with J, J
2 folds, MP1 calls t30, Hero bets t150, 4 folds, BB raises to t300, 1 fold, Hero calls t150

Flop: (t645) 6, 3, 10 (2 players)
BB bets t330, Hero raises to t1110 (All-In)

Total pot: t1305



with no reads at a $3.40 I'm not getting away from this. in this spot if you aren't willing to get the money in on the flop with an over pair then you probably shouldn't call the 3 bet pre

[Gambler71]

with no reads at a $3.40 I'm not getting away from this. in this spot if you aren't willing to get the money in on the flop with an over pair then you probably shouldn't call the 3 bet pre

I called pre because I was getting good odds on the 2nd decision (I had to call $150 more to get $495 that was in the pot already)

Btw, should I have posted this in the beginner's section to get more response?

[fulksy]

i know this is a little extreme and doesn't really apply here, but if your in the sb with 72o and utg min raises and there's 4 callers your not going to call even thou your getting great odds.

you can't just think I'm getting good odds now so i call, you need to have a plan for future streets, where further betting will be happening. especially in sngs where you need to take ICM into account.

no this is the right forum for sngs there's lots of good players that will respond here.

[Nakamura]

I called pre because I was getting good odds on the 2nd decision (I had to call $150 more to get $495 that was in the pot already)

Good ol' Harrington again!

As Fulsky says, thinking in this manner is likely to get you into a lot of trouble in SNGs. For one, if we just call pre-flop we are quite likely to see a Q, K or A on the flop. That means we might be getting shoved off the best hand (although this is the least of our worries). If an over-card flops we will have a tough time extracting full value from the hand. So you should rather fold or shove in this spot.

That said, I fold here. Players in low stakes are often happy to call but re-raises usually mean the nuts. An exact doubling of your bet PF (it's not quite a min-bet, a min-bet would be to 250), especially from the blinds, usually indicates a monster. If you stack off consistently here you will more often than not be shown AA or KK. Just let it go IMO.

[Duffryn]

It is hard to do, but without a read, I would fold the jacks. Players call all day in these SNGs, so a raise is out of the ordinary and I agree with Nakamura that a minimum raise from the BB against someone who raised in middle position is very likely to be KK+. Of course it could be A8s, but you will end up risking your stack on what I think is a small likelihood that he has that kind of hand.

As played, you have a very tough decision on the flop. Your shove is going to make him fold all his air, but not QQ+ (or TT), so I think its a bad move. On the other hand, calling might win you the pot if he checks the turn, but thats pretty passive. And a A, K or Q on the turn would spoil your party. When there is a high probability that he has KK+, any flop without a J is difficult to play and best avoided.

[fulksy]

i don't really agree that he has to have a monster here., at 3.40's tons of players are raising 88,99, AQ, AK etc. i don't think a calls overly horrible. but yea folds probably better the majority of the time.

that said @duff JJ is to strong to just play for set mining and like i said if you call pre you need to go broke on this flop, so i think shovings fine, a shove doesn't nessasarily fold out his air it wouldn't surprise if he calls with AK AQ, and lower PP which he could still have. i think buyin here is pretty relevant.

[Gambler71]

i don't really agree that he has to have a monster here., at 3.40's tons of players are raising 88,99, AQ, AK etc. i don't think a calls overly horrible. but yea folds probably better the majority of the time.

that said @duff JJ is to strong to just play for set mining and like i said if you call pre you need to go broke on this flop, so i think shovings fine, a shove doesn't nessasarily fold out his air it wouldn't surprise if he calls with AK AQ, and lower PP which he could still have. i think buyin here is pretty relevant.

Well, he actually had AKu... but caught a King on river and as someone said spoiled my party!

As far as read on the guy, he was pretty Loose..
I had a feeling I had him beat on flop since there were no A,K,Q and that's why i waited to see the flop before going aline.... but there are lots of maniacs in low limits who just call hoping to get lucky which in this case he did!

[fulksy]

Well, he actually had AKu... but caught a King on river and as someone said spoiled my party!

As far as read on the guy, he was pretty Loose..

I'm not really surprised by the call at these stakes, i'n the future make sure you posts your reads of villian when you first post your hand, it's very important if you want accurate responses

[Duffryn]

I did not say that you should set mine with JJ, I was saying that you have a difficult decision on the flop UNLESS a J comes. If you shove, then its possible AK, AQ, 99- will call, but its just bet and pray. If you think that the BB is minraising a much wider range than KK+, then surely 4 betting/shoving preflop is better, since more than half of all flops will contain an overcard to the Js.

[fulksy]

sorry kinda misread your post a bit. i think reads are very important in this hand with no reads i go with a standard $3 player, in which case i don't think op lines is that bad. 4 bet shoving is probably fine if you have a read he calls light, but most of the times all hands we beat/dominate fold. meh folds pre's probably best.

[taipan168]

Sorry to come late to this thread. I would make it 90 or 120 preflop rather than 150, but that's a relatively small point (except that the pot size builds exponentially on each subsequent street).

As played, I agree with the others that unless I have a firm read, I am mostly folding this preflop. If I have a read that opp is loose, I shove over and watch him call with hands that I beat.